Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode
of redeem through his blood This is Scott Durfey
and I'm joined as always by the princess of the
home. Oh goodness gracious The queen only female
in this house, so I have no competition my Sweetheart
Deb Durfey. What's up, babe? Hi everyone. How
are you? You know what? I'm good enough There's
there's moments that I'm great and moments that
I'm not so great. So I'm just I'm I'm happy to
be here. The sun's out. I guess we should put
that in a little bit of context for those of
you who are new this week or whatever. Deb has
recently been laid off. No big deal. But I'm
looking for a job and I'm not real comfortable
in that. It's not my expertise. Getting her out
of her comfort zone just a little bit. No growing
in the comfort zone, no comfort in the growing
zone. I tell everyone that, now I get to swallow
my words. Yeah. I love that. I love that. Well,
and I got a... Kind of just tell everybody, hey,
thanks for reaching out. I think you sensed my
need. I think I had a moment of being a little
bit needy last episode. Sometimes it just feels
alone, feels empty. And I express that. And many
people reached out and were super kind in their
sentiment and their offerings. Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Yeah. Somebody's going to step up and do social
media for us. Thank you very much. David for
that very much appreciate that and you know we
have others that also reached out couple on Facebook
even done we got a sweet shout out from Becky
in central Iowa she said she's our biggest Midwest
fan I almost started crying I just want to say
now we're your fan thank you so much for reaching
out it kind of makes it feel like now you're
here with us and now we're we're speaking to
you all so golly it's Really nice to have names
and I think that's the thing that's been so kind
of strange for me Which I don't understand because
we've been doing it for several years, but you
know, I do Professionally, I'm a communicator,
but when I communicate professionally most of
the time not all the time But most of the time
is in front of live people And so when I'm teaching
Institute or even gospel doctrine or when I'm
at work on a stage It's in front of live people
and and I get interaction and you can feel the
energy back. It's just really difficult hope
to do that here. Anyway, thank you everybody
for reaching out. Thank you for listening. Thank
you for being along here with us. It made me
kind of reflect why I really do this. Well, it
did for me. Yeah, because I was like, wait, am
I waiting for everybody's approval before I keep
going or am I doing this because I have a relationship
with Jesus Christ that I want to testify. And
what did you land on? Well, Obviously, well both
kind of. Yeah. I got to be actually vulnerable
here and just say I actually like knowing that
people care and are open to it, but I also, you
know, there's been times in my life where I have
been, I mean, I've always been a member of the
church, but I have felt really lonely. Yeah.
And I wish that there, when I was going through
this, I wish that there had been somebody call
it puking your truth telling their story so I
didn't feel so alone in my you know my journey
because I put so many expectations on myself
and to the level of perfection that I was putting
on myself and I know I'm not alone I mean we
we all are striving for perfection but what we've
what I learned is you're not gonna get it here
sweetheart it's like You can't get that even
Jesus Christ was not perfected until he was resurrected
see Here's the thing for me. I hear people like
you say we're all striving for perfection and
immediately I feel left out because I'm not Yeah,
you know really yeah, really. I mean, I love
that you're saying out loud I have said that
too though. I have said I'm striving for perfection
and maybe at times in my life I have actually
believed that I'm not today striving for perfection,
and maybe there's a little bit of me that should
feel guilty about that or inadequate, but I don't
strive for perfection today. I mean, I strive
to do my best. I strive to be perfected in Him.
I strive that through my alignment that the things
that are out of alignment will fall away and
will allow my life to be sanctified and made
right through him and through a relationship
with him. I struggle though with even having
a desire sometimes to achieve perfection because
to me it's out of reach. So it's like why try
I don't know maybe maybe I don't know I think
maybe we could dive into that a little bit and
maybe some of those things will kind of unpill
themselves as we go through our kind of our topic
today, you know, we talked about receiving this
feedback and wonderful feedback and again, we
love you all and thank you for it and I feel
like we have new friends like I know and I need
that I'm such a I'm such an empath You know,
I just, anyway, you know how the five love languages,
I'm definitely a words of affirmation kind of
guy for sure. So anyway, whatever. I had it,
we did get an email though. We've been talking,
we started a new semester at Institute. Holy
moly. Great. Right? Kids. Just when you think
they just don't get better and I know then it's
like jaw drop. i know drop we find out we're
getting released in may and it's like well last
okay no problem maybe it's run its course you
know whatever and and then we get a group of
uh... students that come through we had like
eighty two kids eighty two students and in class
the other night and i'm tell you what that uh...
these kids are Powerhouse. They get it. They
understand what it means to have a relationship
with the Savior, and they're really trying hard
to do that. You know, they're working hard to
have instruments of grace at work in their life,
and they have questions naturally, and they have
concerns, of course, and they have things that
can challenge their faith from time to time.
But they really are focused on the one needful
thing, and I just can't believe believe it. They're
the 2026 stripling warriors. They really are.
I tell them every week when they're there, I
say you guys don't even have to be here. Yeah.
And look at you making an effort. There's so
many different places you could be, but you still
make an effort to be here. Each week we put our
phone number on the board and we encourage our
students. I hate to even call them students.
I'd rather call them our kids, because I love
them like our kids, but I don't want them to
hear that and think, I'm not a kid, because we
don't see you as kids. Young adults. I'm kind
of caught between a rock and a hard place. Oh,
your kids are old. They're a lot younger than
any of your kids. So if you get offended, don't
be offended, because we have old kids. You could
have gone all evening without saying that. These
these people that are coming I love them so much
and and I'm you know before it was like, okay
We're gonna be done in May now. It's like I don't
want to be done in May I don't want them to go
away. Anyway, we put a number, our number on
the board and we encourage them to ask questions
and send us texts and so on and so forth. And
sometimes we'll respond to them in class and
sometimes we'll just respond to them one off
because we do have a lot of people that want
to call and talk about things that are embarrassing
to talk about sometimes in front of other people.
Well, I got an email from somebody in class this
past week, Deb, and I want to talk about this
in our... podcast today Here it is I Have never
fully understood repentance the the repentance
process or what repentance looks like I have
felt like it was something that everyone just
kind of understood But never really explained
this podcast and Institute courses honestly taught
me so much about the atonement of Jesus Christ
and my relationship with him With all that I
have learned, it's made me think more about Christ's
atonement in my life. I have realized that I
still am just unsure to know if I am forgiven.
How do I know that God has moved past my sins?
How do I know that I have taken the right steps
and that I'm on the right path with God again?
And then this person says, I love you guys. Thank
you for everything you do. We love you. Yeah.
Yeah, we do we know who this is and we do love
you I Don't know Deb. That's a that's a pretty
important question Right. I there's a there's
a couple of things there that I think that you
know each of us relate to that question Yeah,
there's there's a couple things I think that
we each need to kind of reconcile here, right
for sure So how do I know if I've been forgiven?
There's there's a couple of things in here that
I would probably change the way they're worded
You know, how do I know that God's move move
past my sins? I want to talk about that for a
second But and then how do I know if I've taken
the right steps and I'm on the right path with
God again And that's one of the things that we
talk about in the course the divine gift of forgiveness
is How do I know that my path is pleasing before
God? That's really part of the quest that's really
when we get to that point where we know that
the path We're on is pleasing to God. That's
when we really know right? That's what I think
when we can kind of have that assurity. So I
Don't know We're not we're not gonna obviously
Be able to talk about everything that has to
do with repentance today For sure, but that there's
a really important questions here And the and
the questions are kind of the right ones, you
know hundred percent So, I don't know, where
do you go with it, babe? Well, I don't think
there is a set way of perfect repentance. I don't
feel like my repentance is going to be the same
as your repentance. I think it's, and we've talked
about this before, I think it's about a relationship.
Okay, so you're saying my repentance isn't going
to be like your repentance and you're measuring
those by certain actions that one might do. Perhaps.
Because I don't know how do you measure a relationship?
Yeah. Well, you talked about five love languages.
Yeah. You know, yours is words of affirmations.
Mine's acts of service. So if you want to show
me you love me, you're going to serve me. Right.
You'll make the bed. Yeah. Yeah. If you want
to know that I, you know, and so when I have
a relationship with Jesus Christ, I want to serve.
OK. I mean, it's it's it's that personal. And
I, you know, we Sunday this I might be derailing,
but Sunday we were talking in young women's about
breaking the bread during the sacrament and how
each piece of bread is different and torn and
broken differently. Just how we are all broken
and torn differently. So our transgressions,
our sins, our sorrows, our pains are very, very
different from each other. Therefore our relationship
with the Savior could be very different. And
relationship with Heavenly Father in the pleading,
in the asking, in the aligning, you know, crying
out. That's definitely true. And I think that
that's where we eventually get when we start
really beginning to understand what forgiveness
looks like. But I think some of the things that
are kind of internal scripts that we sometimes
use around forgiveness that may be inaccurate.
I think that it would help if we maybe identify
what some of those are, for example, you know,
when we automatically if we're just focusing
on I messed up, you know, that's an internal
script. That's what I'm telling myself. And so
if I messed up and I think it's important that
we understand where we do make mistakes and so
forth. But we don't look at it as. God sees us
as we are messed up. We made a mistake, etc.,
but we're not messed up. You know, we think God
must be disappointed in me. You know, in fact,
we've been told that. God's he doesn't hate you,
but he's disappointed in you. You know, I've
been told that and I know others have been told
that and I don't believe that anymore. I don't
believe that God is disappointed in us. Well,
I think about I always go to this analogy because
it makes sense to me is a toddler learning to
walk. And when that toddler doesn't get it just
right the first time and falls down, trips or
runs into a wall or whatever. a parent is not
going to get mad at that baby for falling down
when they're learning something. And I feel like
a lot of our transgression and a lot of our messing
up, some of it's intentional. I'm not going to
write us all off and say, oh, no, it's OK to
mess up. No, it's never OK. But I think there's
oftentimes when we mess up that it's like, oh,
I messed up. Yeah. And to think The words God
must be disappointed. I have to disagree with
you. I mean, agree with you that I don't think
God's disappointed. I really don't feel like
he looks at us and goes, way to go, ding dong
or whatever. But I think it's more like, can
you learn from this? It's one thing I say to
my kids all the time and they're probably sick
and tired of hearing it. The only thing worse
than having a bad experience is not learning
from it. And I think that's what God's intention
is, is to help us learn from it. And I'll know,
I'll know I'm okay when I feel okay. You know,
those are, those are some of the things that
we go through. Well, has there ever been a time
when You believed in Christ you repented but
you still felt like you were watching for signs
for everything to be okay Oh gosh, I'm gonna
get really vulnerable right here as I mean a
previous podcast I shared my story about Having
a baby and placing it for adoption. Well not
sure not Soon after and it was soon after I I
found myself in the exact same situation, doing
the exact same thing and getting pregnant again.
So, you know, doing the same thing over and over
and expecting different results. And as a, you
know, 18 year old having a child. And like I
said, when I shared that experience before, it
was hard. It was very, very difficult, but I
did the steps. that I thought were the steps
to repentance. I talked to the bishop, I, I reconciliated,
and I really feel like placing that baby for
adoption into a good home where she could be
sealed to another family was, was the perfect
reconciliation of my mistake. And I did that,
but here's the interesting thing that I've learned
now decades later is I knew God forgave me for
that because I made that wrong right. So how
did I get in the exact same situation again?
less than a year later here I am again not married
and pregnant and Looking back now I I can definitely
tell you that my relationship with Jesus Christ
was not there. I had not been converted. I did
not understand the atonement of Jesus Christ.
I did not forgive myself. In fact, I had physical
proof with stretch marks and with a stretched
out body. After you have a baby, especially a
C -section, I even had a scar to remind me that
I disappointed God. And that's what I kept remembering.
So I, in my own head, mean that logistically
wise I felt forgiven however in my brain and
in my belief system I did not feel like I had
been forgiven that I was still broken in his
eyes and you know when did it when did it finally
click you know I'm embarrassed to say decades
later that I finally said repentance is not a
step -by -step process and making the wrong right
repentance is allowing Jesus Christ to change
me not just my broken heart but change my heart
to make me feel and be someone that I wasn't
to let me fall down hard enough to say now are
you willing to take my name upon you now are
you willing to be broken enough to align with
his will. God wasn't waiting on me. He was already
looking at his son. And that's who I needed to
look to was his son. And that's repentance. Exactly.
That's repentance. You know, when I think of
that, I love that you share that. Thank you.
I've been hearing this story for since we first
met, and every time I hear it, it touches me
and I feel the spirit bear witness to me that
our Heavenly Father has sanctified and is sanctifying
all that's going on around that babe. I also
know that, you know, when we go through repentance
processes, it's not uncommon. In fact, it's probably
most common that we do sometimes wonder, am I
forgiven? Has Heavenly Father move past my sins,
etc. You know, and again, I think that when we
think of it that way that we see it wrong Heavenly
Father is I don't know if he moves past our sins
I think that when we are not aligned with Jesus
Christ that there's two focal points one is Jesus
one is us and that when we are left With the
full exposure of our sins without going through
Jesus Christ that our sins condemn us But I believe
that when we align with Jesus Christ in other
words when we put one focal point in front of
God and God can only see us through Jesus Christ
because of our alignment with his atonement and
is healing that when we do that, that God doesn't
look at our sins. He sees us through Jesus Christ
and he begins instead to pull us into Christ.
The Father doesn't move past our sins. Instead,
he moves us into Christ when we make that alignment.
And that's what I hear you saying. You know,
when we receive this email and they're talking
about. Asking about how do I know if I'm forgiven
and? And all of this this is this is a an important
question. It's one that I think that Again that
we all wrestle with from time to time If we just
do what I if we just do what we just talked about
and are able to Allow God to see us through Christ
first and the way we do that is aligned with
him Then it's through Christ's merits through
Christ's obedience and through Christ's grace
and I think I think the thing that makes us human
and reminds us that we're in a fallen world is
just like I shared in my story that I didn't
know at that time that I really needed to align
with Jesus Christ I didn't know what that looked
like I didn't know what that meant and I could
remember my sin if I had that shame still holding
on if I still had that trauma from my from my
past I knew God knew and I think that's where
I Don't think God has any I don't I don't think
he wants to think about all of that and I think
like you said focusing on Jesus Christ and Letting
him be my advocate because here's the bottom
line truth. He felt that He knows that. He knows
what that shame and trauma and fear and guilt
feels like. And that's why I align with him because
he gets me and he gets all of us. Just kind of
quickly going back to the email. That we got
I felt like it was something everyone just kind
of understood but was never really explained
to me And I think that's a problem that we have
When it comes to repentance and and and it's
it's okay that we have this problem, but there's
a problem When I was on my mission, we taught
repentance and there were steps, you know, and
I don't remember if it was five steps or seven
steps, but there were hours or something. Yeah,
five hours of repentance or, you know, various
things, various things like that. And, you know,
which is fine. But. It's really not so much about
steps as it is about establishing a relationship.
I love the way that you describe repentance to
our Institute students every time. Deb talks
about repentance as just being, you know, it
actually comes from the word Montanejo. We hear
her... President Nelson talk about that word
on more than one occasion, which just means to
change or to turn around or to turn back towards
that which is good. And that's repentance, which
is to really talk about, which really talks about,
again, a relationship. It's not so much, and
it's not an institutional event, right? It's
not a checklist. It's not penalty payment or
punishment for sin. And a bunch of other things
and I think you know, maybe in a future podcast
We should talk about what repentance really is
not because we've done that in the past In fact,
I think that there have been more than several
episodes that we've covered that and it's important
that we know that but but to understand what
repentance really is And if we understand that
it is really just a relationship then we're not
looking for some sort of confirmation And I think
I think for a long time having a relationship
Well, for me, for a long time, it's like, how
do you have a relationship with someone that's
not physically here? And it's it's been a super
reflective thing that I have been consciously
and intentionally making of what does my relationship
with God look like? What does my relationship
with Jesus Christ look like? And how do I strengthen
that relationship when they're not physically
here? Because being in this realm, all of our
relationships except with the Godhead are with
beings. We hug them, we kiss them, we say goodbye,
we greet them when we haven't seen them in a
while. And then you have an experience where
someone you love goes to the other side. And
it's like now it's a remembering now. And I have
pictures just like I have. pictures of Jesus
Christ. I have pictures of someone I love and
care about. And then I remember the memories
and I wish I actually I do have some sweet memories
with my Savior and with Heavenly Father. And
I know I've I've I've shared the experience when
our oldest Jessica was three about leaving the
pre -existence. She didn't have a veil. And that
sweet message that God allowed her to bring to
me. And that message was such a powerful message
and so impactful to me today. 38, almost 39 years.
Well, okay. So minus three, 36 years ago was
remember my son. I said, what did heavenly father
tell you? What else did he say is what I said.
and she raised her little right hand and she
said remember my son that was important for me
to remember and to hear even though she doesn't
remember that today i will never forget that
experience because it is all about the relationship
it is all about aligning with him and you know
when i make a mistake and when i do something
that that disconnects me or turns me away from
God. You know, like at Institute, I turned my
back on that thing, whatever it was that distracted
me, and I turned to Him. And that's when I say,
thank you, Heavenly Father, for the fall, so
that I remember there's repentance, and I have
a Savior that's gonna save me from this. And
that is repentance. Yep. That is exactly what
repentance is. I love this. I think it's as we
kind of pull things together and wrap things
up. There's one other concept here that is an
important one for us, because we talk about this
often, Deb. We talk about how the Holy Ghost
is the administrator and administer of the atonement
of Jesus Christ. In other words, it's through
the Holy Ghost that we're healed. It's through
the Holy Ghost that we receive forgiveness. And
the Holy Ghost has so many roles, super important.
And I think that we way underestimate the importance
of our relationship there as well. But here's
the thing, you know, oftentimes we think, well,
if I feel, and we've actually taught this, and
I'm kind of wanting to backpedal a little bit
on this teaching for this reason, because we've
taught that if you feel the spirit of the Holy
Ghost, then you know that the atonement of Jesus
Christ is at work in your life. That's true.
That is absolutely true. So if you do feel the
spirit at any point you can know that you're
being forgiven or that you are forgiven of your
sins and that Christ's atonement is at work in
your life to offset the effects of the fall of
Adam and even other aspects of your life as well
That's true. But what if I don't feel the spirit?
Am I not forgiven? And maybe because I know that
there are a lot of our listeners and now I know
a lot of them personally that because of mental
Illness because of chemical imbalances because
of other things not related to sin or worthiness
There's sometimes that feel of the spirit is
hard to come by And so, you know to that person.
What do you say? Well, if you don't feel the
spirit, you're not forgiven. No, absolutely not
There are ways and it's really important for
us to understand that we all will approach this
relationship with our Heavenly Father through
his Son and the Holy Ghost Deity all of deity
all of Elohim. I love that we're studying that
right now and gospel doctrine then come follow
me but but but all of Elohim all of God to To
have that relationship with all of God and to
know that We can know that sometimes without
really feeling that caloric burn of the spirit
and it's important that we point that out as
well because a relationship can be had in so
many different ways. So the bottom line is this.
I hope that our listeners will feel invited to
quit auditing ourselves, you know Really? I mean,
I think it's important and I talk about this
and you'll hear me reiterate this I've been talking
about this since the beginning of the podcast
cast a few years ago I believe in what we call
an alcoholics anonymous a tenth step where I
take a personal inventory every night and where
I'm wrong promptly admit it but that's different
than a spiritual sin audit where I'm measuring
myself in my forgiven not forgiven against the
against the way I think God sees me God see doesn't
see me that way remember he sees me through Jesus
Christ and so he's not seeing me as I have my
worthy or not worthy seeing me as I am I aligned
with him so I need to quit auditing myself right
and then I got a kind of this is going to kind
of sound different but I got to quit monitoring
what God's mood is Isn't it weird how we humanize
God? It's so weird. But we do it. I know, but
I monitor God's mood. Yeah. Do you do that? Oh,
yeah. Oh, absolutely. Because I think he's disappointed
because I think he's, you know, whatever. I humanize
God. I know. I know. It's like, he must be mad
at me. It's embarrassing to admit, but yes, I
do. He must be mad at me today because I forgot
to say my prayers. Or I'm not feeling him today.
You know, I don't. I've been there. I must have
done something to step away. To step away because.
Yeah. Yeah. It must be pain. This is this is
payment, penalty and punishment for something
I've done wrong. And I start viewing it wrong.
The Accuser. Right. Yeah, that's where that comes
from the accuser. The other thing is is I've
just got to start trusting more And I think and
now I'll extend this invitation to all of us
to just trust more that Christ work is finished
We just align with what is already finished It's
infinite and paid for an eternal purchased and
it's finished. He said it It is finished as final
words on the cross and and and I think that if
we if we really believe that it is finished and
as we really align with him and as we really
allow God to see us through the purview or the
lens of Christ's atonement by aligning and putting
Christ's atonement between us and the vision
of God, then we're comfortable. And when we're
comfortable and we know and we have that assurity
in our lives that our path in life is pleasing
before God, then we know that the repentance
process is at work in our lives, Deb. Yeah. And
I think that's when it finally clicked for me.
Was when I literal when I literally felt that
change that change of heart that that Thing in
me that was like, ah I get it now But it's it's
such like I said having a relationship with Heavenly
Father and Jesus Christ takes Faith muscles takes
hope muscles and it's being very, very still
and listening and pondering and meditating and
then trusting that what you're hearing and what
you're feeling is coming from him because that's
the universal language is that spirit to spirit.
I relate it somewhat to the communication a mom
has with her infant. Because there's I mean a
mom can sing and a mom can talk but that baby
can't talk and when you make that eye contact
with that baby There's communication. There's
so much going on And I know that's what he does
with us because we're babies We're embryos trying
to figure out this thing called life. We're trying
to become like him and We're just figuring things
out and when we can be still know and feel that's
the communication he wants us to to feel and
know and have that peace I think I think that's
the other part of this that when I felt that
peace of oh okay now I feel that change a new
heart yeah I love that too not just change my
heart but gave me a new heart yeah I think that
scripture encapsulates all of this in Matthew
11 28 Come unto me all you that labor and are
heavy laden and I will give you rest take my
yoke upon you and learn of me For I am meek and
lonely of heart and you shall find rest unto
yourselves for my yoke is easy and my burden
is light You know the question isn't has God
moved past my sins The real question is, am I
willing to stay in Jesus Christ? I hope that
that's our resolve this week. Thank you so much
for your email. And thank you all for your listening
and your kind words and your spreading the good
word and your support. Please keep it up. Thanks
for being with us. We look forward to being with
you again next week. We love you. Until then,
be well.