Hey there everybody, welcome out to another episode
of Redeemed Through His Blood, Scott Durfey here
as always joined by the lovely Debra Durfey.
Why are you laughing? Just because the way you
look at me and you say that I just want to say
hello friends. Hi everyone She's laughing because
it took me like five tries to get that right
tonight I hope that's not a sign babe of things
to come tonight. So hey, we're just sinners helping
the sinners And we have the the magic of edit
So hopefully we won't have to do too much of
that tonight, but hey, I'm not gonna be surprised.
We're off to a good start Something like that.
Well Here we are. It's been what, 10 days or
so since the podcast has been released. We're
going to try and get in a little better rhythm
than that. Check one, two, we're going to try
and get in a little better rhythm or more frequent
rhythm, probably with school starting here in
the US and and maybe other places across the
world as well. But. For now, it's been about
a ten day between each episode pace. We'll probably
try and close out to about seven Days between
episodes. The truth is we're just not that organized
Let's just get honest Why you got to do that?
I'm just going to puke some truth here. Yeah,
that's about right. We don't need excuses. Well,
we're not that organized. I guess we got some
good news though, didn't we? The other night
we ran into a friend, an old friend who's been
on the podcast. Yeah. And you'll remember, in
fact, I'll probably publish his episode here
in another week or so. Might go, maybe I'll do
it between episodes or maybe I'll be lazy and
do it in lieu of one that we would otherwise
record. But our good friend Nick, he was on a
couple years ago. I think he's a recovering addict,
alcoholic, phenomenal story, just an amazing
story. Great guy too. Yeah, a young man that
I have an opportunity to be really close to in
the groups of recovery and various things. Anyway,
he'll be on surprise episode. He's got some great
news some great wonderful things have happened
in his life I'm not gonna divulge what those
are. We'll let those all come to be when we have
him on here But we're gonna I'm super excited
about that. Yeah, and it was so great to see
him. He's doing so great Yeah, I have the opportunity
to talk to him every week I don't get to see
him like you do, but it was so good to see him.
Just such a great guy people, fellow friends,
helping fellow friends. It's just good when you
see somebody that's, you know, doing their best
and they lift you. They make you want to be better.
We've had so many examples of that in our lives
lately. Right. We had a young lady that her parents
are in Armenia. She was my young woman. I remember
when she was a little beehive. We went to girls
camp. Her mother served as the Relief Society
president when I was the elders corn president.
Great family. Her dad and I are very close friends
and they've been in Armenia. We're at their home
country serving a mission Her parents are her
parents and her brother actually also so she
called up said hey It's time to go back to school.
I need a father's blessing, and I was very honored
to stand in proxy for my good friend Arthur and
do that. Pretty tender, pretty tender little
experience. You know, those instruments of grace.
It's just so cool, babe, to have that in our
lives. Yeah, went to a lovely farewell yesterday.
Nephew Corbin. Yeah. Such a great, great kid
and so ready to go out and serve out in Mexico.
He's just. We have we're just surrounded with
great people. Well, we are also at the point
where we're between semesters. Oh, yeah. Institute.
Yeah. How do you feel about that? Honestly, be
honest. Oh, I'm actually relieved. I am not the
I am not the go fight winner on the Let's Go
Teach Institute. Hooray. I am the. Drag behind
Scott. Yeah, well, that's not true. I love it
when I'm there. I do love it when I'm there,
but getting there sometimes after working a long
day at work and I come home and I'm like, oh.
Yeah, our work situations are a little bit. Sometimes
are just a little overwhelming. Different. I'm
on the truth meter today. You're going to get.
So, speaking of the truth, we kind of wrapped
up last week all of the effects, the conditional
effects, and we did the unconditional effects.
And I know that there's more. But, Deb, I'm ready
to move past that. I'm ready to move into past
some of that deeper doctrine. And one of the
things that has really been on my mind heavy
for the last few days, I'm in a process of repentance.
I have had an awakening. You know, one of the
things that we do in Alcoholics Anonymous or
in the Rooms of Recovery is we take personal
inventory. And I've been pretty good at that
over the years. In fact, if you'll go back several,
well, a couple of years ago, probably on several
episodes, David and I would actually talk about
that. And I'd kind of let it slip a little bit.
I haven't been. taking my personal inventory
been kind of honestly as we say in the rooms
of recovery kind of resting on my laurels spiritually
and otherwise you know and When that happens
to me, I kind of get off the beam, is what we
call that. And I've been a little bit off the
beam, so I'm in a bit of a process of repentance.
I'm trying to get out of the way. I'm trying
to move myself out of my own way and re -engage
and really do the things that we talk about on
here. You know, the thing that's really kind
of difficult sometimes is... Come on here. We
come on here We talk about these wonderful things
and and it's true and I love them and but living
them is sometimes different for me Yeah, knowing
it's not enough. I know that yeah, I mean I know
the right answers, but am I living the right
answers? No, not always absolutely not. Yeah.
Yeah, it's hard Yeah, it's really really hard.
Yeah, so you know what? I'm grateful for today
Second chances third daily repentance, maybe
daily repentance. Finding the joy in daily repentance.
Opportunity to turn to Him, right? Yeah, for
sure. Yeah, finding joy in daily repentance.
Anyway, so there you have it, you know, that's
where I'm at. That's where I've been and I've
been really reflecting yesterday specifically
on the airplane coming home from Chicago after
I'd heard Corbin's talk and I had had some, you
know, prayerful experiences the night before
in the hotel there and you know various things
and as I'm coming home, I'm just I'm just so
grateful. You know, we talked about in the past
when sometimes we get in those spots and we recognize
our fallenness and we rather than bow our heads
in shame, you know, to bow our heads and just
say thank you. Yeah. You know, thank you, Heavenly
Father, for the gift of your son. Yeah. And that
was a big adjustment for me, too. Yeah. Because
I wasn't always thankful. I picked up the shame
card or shame hat and put it on and wanted to
hide. Hide. Yeah. Literally, it's like I don't
want anybody to know what just happened or what
I did or what I thought or what I whatever yeah
Because yeah, I don't I definitely don't do this
100 % I don't do it right. I Mean and again knowing
is just not enough I mean, I love the feelings
that we get when we get in a deep scripture,
you know study and meditation and I love how
I feel but to take that into the real world for
me and to apply it I'm coming to me and every
thought doubt not fear not is Impossible for
me. I will tell you that because I put effort
into it. Yeah, I can't do it It's it's I'm trying
I am trying But I I will tell you it is very
very difficult when life gets in the way when
you know I'm at work or if I have other distractions
people driving. I mean, I just I easily get derailed
and I think of Martha Martha you're encumbered
about and Deborah Deborah I am encumbered about
For sure. Well, you know Sometimes this stuff
in life those real we can't trivialize it true,
you know, I mean there's some real stuff I mean
real stuff that you and I and some of our listeners
go through and you know, they can have to do
with families and they can have to do with You
know, choices that family are making that, you
know, you see and you know, the kind of consequences
and the kind of cause and effect that come from
choices and decisions and decisions that have
been made in the past that are now bearing the
fruit of consequence. Yeah. Oh, my word. I bow
my head and say thank you. Thank you for the
for the atonement of your son, because, oh, I
just don't know how we could do it. Yeah, I've
tried. I mean, you know overwhelming it truly
is overwhelming right like when you when Because
I've shared before you know, I like to control
things and I still like to control things Yeah,
and there are times that I just I have to like
lift my hands up and in a surrender mode and
just go not my will but then there's there's
days I get overwhelmed and frustrated and It's
it's well to remember what I'm supposed to do
but not easy to remember to do it It's not easy
to do it to do it. It's hard to be in the world
and not of the world I had a great experience
so in Chicago, you know working there and it's
so many great people I love what I do for my
career and all that but you know what Deb New
York last week Chicago this week. I'm tired Yes,
you are. I'm tired. I get beat down and when
I get beat down, and these are some of the things
that maybe we can talk about tonight. You know,
when I get beat down, there's a couple of things
that I need to be careful of. When I get beat
down and when I feel hungry or when I feel angry
or when I feel lonely or when I feel tired. It's
the halt. Hungry, angry, lonely, tired. Halt.
Stop. That's right. That's when I feel susceptible
to the accuser, to the accusations of the accuser.
Because I'm being accused, you know, I get it.
I know that I can put for get better effort I
know all of that but but here's the thing the
the accuser wants me to believe that I'm really
messed up that that's just and and eventually
just throw in the towel what I'm super grateful
for and and next week and maybe even a little
bit this week as we start talking a little bit
about faith. Maybe what I'm super grateful for
is to know that it's really not my effort that
counts. I mean, my effort accounts in terms of
alignment with him, but it's not my effort that
redeems me. That's the all you can do part. You
just need to align. Yeah. Yeah. Repent. Yes.
Yes. Repent. And by repent, I don't mean run
to my bishop and say, Bishop, I'm having these
thoughts of discouragement or whatever the whatever
it is, you know, that's not I mean, that can
be that can be a one of the manifestations of
repentance. We'll get to all that later. I'm
kind of going down a rabbit hole there with repentance.
But repentance, if just let's just suffice it
to say that when I use that word repentance,
I'm really just talking about when he makes the
invitation come unto me to respond to that invitation
to come unto him. That's the comforting part
is just to know that's it Just come unto me and
that's for me the important part, you know Because
if I have to earn my way back, I just not gonna
do it There's just no possible way I can and
and I've tried and I try to check all the boxes
and I try to cross all the T's and dot all the
eyes and invariably I am going to be human invariably
I am going to succumb to the the Accusations
and believe them sometimes it just happens for
me. Yeah, and you know, I don't think I'm alone
Do you feel that way? Absolutely. Yeah, and I
I feel like it's one of those things that we
feel like we earn You know, we will earn our
way. I guess that's kind of my point. Yeah. Yeah,
I love that quote from I can't even remember
who it is. Adam Miller. Can I read that? Yeah.
Have you got it there? Yeah. So yeah, this is
a quote from Adam Miller. This quote comes from,
I think it's from a letter to a young Mormon.
Yeah. Something like, is that right? Yeah. OK.
I love this. Yeah. I love this, too, because
it gives me peace. And it makes it easier for
me to bow my head and say thank you. Keeping
the law doesn't earn you heavenly merits. breaking
the law doesn't earn you hellish merits. Both
merits and demerits are about you. The purpose
of the gospel is to point you away from yourself
Free you from the self -obsessed burden of your
own story and center you on Christ. You don't
need to generate merit in order to be saved.
You need instead to come unto Christ and rely
wholly upon the merits of Him who is mighty to
save. There's a scripture in 2 Nephi 31 19 that
talks about that. and we can read it when I'm
done with this quote. The gospel points holy
to Christ and His grace. Keeping the law of the
gospel is the work of relying on Christ's merit,
not the work of generating your own. This is
still hard work, but it is work of an entirely
different kind. Keeping the law of the gospel
is the work of relying on Christ's merit, not
the work of generating my own. Yeah. Because
we think it's like the choice and consequence
thing. It's like if I do a good thing, then I
get a good consequence. If I do a bad thing,
I get a bad consequence. As carnal and humans,
we believe that that's the way that we earn our
way back. We don't earn it also there the scripture
in the middle of that was second Nephi 31 19
and I just want to read that really quick just
because I feel like it applies and Now my beloved
brethren after ye have gotten into this straight
and narrow path I would ask if all is done Behold
I say unto you nay for Ye have not come thus
far to save it were by the word of Christ with
unshaken faith in him, relying wholly upon the
merits of him who is mighty to save. I love that.
I love that scripture. You know, there's so many,
though, in second Nephi that talk about Christ's
merits. Is that your favorite one, the one you
just read? That's the one that was quoted with
this quote. Do I have a favorite? To be honest,
no. I don't know enough to have a favorite. I
love that scripture, Deb. I love this scripture
too. This is Lehi speaking to his son Jacob,
and I'm not gonna read the whole thing, but he's
talking to Jacob and about how he needs to be
with his brother Nephi, and he says, wherefore
thyself shall be blessed, and thou shalt dwell
safely with thy brother Nephi. And thy days shall
be spent in the service of thy God. Here it is.
Wherefore, I know thou art redeemed because of
the righteousness of thy Redeemer. And end four.
and thou has beheld in thy youth his glory wherefore
thou art blessed even as they unto whom he shall
minister in the flesh for the spirit is the same
yesterday and today and forever this is also
it and the way is prepared from the fall of man
and salvation is free what does that even mean
salvation is free how does that align with what
i've been taught yeah I know it gets confusing
for sure well until we dig deeper into the doctrine
right right it's not that the doctrine the truth
I think I think as a young child and you learn
things in primary and young you know in youth
programs and stuff you sure you interpret the
best way you know how yeah and then it becomes
a belief yeah and then it becomes like This is
the truth and and I would argue it to the bitter
end and so when I had to unlearn Some of my truths
that I learned incorrectly like what like? Thinking
that I was gonna earn my way to heaven. I mean,
there's even a song about There there's angels
marking the good things and the bad things that
we say I mean that to me is like there's a there's
a Cop up there that or somebody, you know angels
are taking record and they're they know what
all the good and all the bad that I'm doing and
I'm gonna be judged for the good and the bad
So I better out do the good and do more good
than the bad That was literally my belief system
and I truly believe that that's the way I was
gonna be judged in the last days That I was going
to stand before him and every one of my thoughts
were going to be exposed to the world and all
of my bad doings that I didn't repent correctly
of. That was my belief. That was truly my whole
belief system. And I remember as a child thinking,
Oh gosh, I hope, you know, I can, I can repent
of that. Whatever I just said or did or whatever,
just because I knew that I had to earn my way
back to heaven or back to heavenly father. Boy,
I'm glad I unlearned that I mean it was if that
stresses me out talking about it Yeah, it's stressing
me out hearing you talk about it because I had
the same belief system And I don't know that
I was, I don't want anybody who's listening,
mom and dad or anybody else to feel like there's
any blame here because it's not. But but I think
this was kind of and maybe kind of still is a
cultural thing. And I know that our our religion
is does not have the corner on this. I have very
close friends who are evangelicals and a very
close friend who's a Lutheran and very close
friends. I belong to this group at work. And
I'm literally the this Christian group at work.
And I'm literally the only. the S guy and Deb
I'm telling you we're not the only ones that
struggle with this and I think anybody who's
trying to align their lives with Jesus Has had
this experience wherein we have felt condemned
condemned by our actions condemned by just everything,
you know everything that our thoughts are and
actions and and I don't want to be irreverent
or flippant here because you know, We do have
onus, you know, we are responsible for the things
we say we are responsible for the actions that
we take however We can't earn our way there Right,
no matter how good we are and how well we pay
tithing and say our prayers and read our scriptures
and serve in all the church every, or whatever.
And all the good deeds, yes. But that's literally
what I believed. I know, me too. Pay more tithing
to make it up. Well, and the thing is, exactly
right. Really? I'm not kidding. As silly as that
sounds, that was my belief. You paid extra tithing?
I have before, yes. I just wanted extra blessings.
There you go. How absurd is that? Well, I'm not
going to call that absurd, but I'm not going
to judge that. I mean, whatever. The thing about
that was my belief. The thing about this. You're
laughing at me. I'm not. I'm laughing. I'm laughing
at all of us. I'm laughing at the entire with
me because I'm kind of human race, including
myself, because we take ourselves far too seriously.
We think we are far too far more powerful than
we actually are. We can't redeem ourselves. We
can't save ourselves. It's important that we
align and I don't want to be misunderstood. Correct.
I don't want to be. I don't want anybody to say,
well, Brother Durfee or Scott or however you
want to refer to me said that we don't have to
do anything to get back to the presence of our
Heavenly Father. That's not true. It's just a
different work, right? Like Brother Miller, like
Adam Miller said, it's just a different work.
It's still work. But the gospel points us wholly
to Christ and his grace. Keeping the law of the
gospel is the work of relying on Christ's merit.
Yeah, not our merits. Period. Exactly. Exclamation
point. What does that work look like, relying
on the merits of Christ for you and me? That
means get out of the control panel, Deb. Okay,
so what is what does that look like? Do you want
so I well I have to have I have to literally
have faith That he can make me whole I have to
have faith that he can save me I have to have
faith that he can forgive me for my my sins I
have to have I have to align that my will and
thy will I know I talk about this all the time,
but it's that Obey my soul commune with thee
I need to be led and guided and directed because
my thinking some of my greatest thinking got
me in some serious trouble and You're not alone.
You're not the only person that's had that experience
I have to many of our listeners have to I think
to some degree all who Experience this mortal
existence if we are honest with ourselves Have
that same experience to some degree, right? You
talked about having faith and how faith is kind
of did you say it was key? Well, I just have
to have faith that I There's a power greater
than me that Heavenly Father can make things
better that Jesus. Yeah is is going to save me
from my Carnal state let me just share a really
I know I've shared part of most of this story,
but you know as a 17 year old girl that found
myself pregnant. And I was in a place where there
was not a human around me that could answer this
question was I knew I wasn't capable of raising
a child. I'm not a mom and a dad. I'm a teenager.
And I need what, what I needed to do at that
point in my life was find a mom and a dad that
would love my blood child. the way I felt loved
growing up. And I remember looking at every human
in my world thinking, nobody knows this answer.
There is not a human that walks this planet that
knows my answer. And at 17 years old, I fell
to my knees and I said, heavenly father, I have
a big story and I don't, this is a human. This
is a human being that needs a home. And I know
I am not capable of raising this child the way
that you would want this child to be raised.
And I literally pleaded with him saying, lead
me, guide me. And I knew, I knew at 17 years
old that he knew the answer to that. And I trusted
that somehow he would tell me and I would be
led and guided by the inspiration and by his
guidance. But it was a very, that was a very
vulnerable place for me to be. And the simple
fact is there was not a human that could answer
this question or solve this problem or whatever.
There just wasn't. And I knew that he knew. A
lot of us have problems that we don't know how
to solve. A lot of us. have problems that we
don't know where to turn or where to go and maybe
some of them feel as big as and are indeed as
big as the one that you just described maybe
some of them by comparison we would say well
that's not as big a deal why I don't know that
it would it requires me to handle it the same
way that Deb handled that but what would you
say to that first off how did you handle that
how did you come to him you're 17 years old Yeah,
you didn't just you know fold your arms bow your
head and say a prayer and get an answer No, I
didn't I I prayed fervently and often and I I
just remember And and that was the first time
I really that it was really impactful for me
Because believe me that was not the first time
I had to go vertical. I mean, okay What do you
mean by go vertical it is? to seek Heavenly father
for my answers. Okay, so you use Can you remember
where you were at because I want to explore this
go vertical thing? Yeah, okay when you say go
vertical go vertical as opposed to horizontal
which means Asking others asking people around
me getting advice from people that maybe had
gone through it and you know, I did seek that
sure I did seek I mean, there were other young
girls that were in a similar situation that I
was asking, that I was observing, that I was
seeing these girls have a baby and keep it. I
was seeing these girls have a baby and place
it for adoption. I observed. gathered as much
information and then I would journal and I would
pray and I I didn't really honestly at that point
I did not read a ton of scriptures I'm sure I
did but I don't remember diving into the scriptures
was very hard for me to seek answer if I could
get one scripture answers I would open up and
kind of point and plead that there would be some
kind of answer there for me because reading did
not resonate with me at that time. Well, you
were still struggling with that reading. For
sure. As part of your learning disability at
that point in your life. My reading comprehension
was very, very, very low and they didn't have
as easy accessible audible. As we do now. As
we do now. We had no audible list. You could
buy a cassette tape. Zig Ziggler or whatever.
Yeah. But I mean, I think for me, it was just
like, Heavenly Father, I know you have this answer
and I know this child needs to be somewhere and
not be raised by me or my family or whatever.
And I think that it's It was that pivotal time
for me that I learned how to be completely vulnerable
to the point that it's like, I don't know. I
really don't know. And as much as I was seeking,
because there were days that it was like, no,
I'm just gonna keep her. My family will help
me raise her. And then I'm like, no, this isn't
fair. I was raised with this amazing dad that
loved me. And this little child deserves a dad
that loves it was a her and I just it was clear
to me in the end Where this child needed to go
and You know, I I worked with a social worker
that you know, they took they you know when I
would make a decision it was family ABCDE And
I just, I would read. their bio, what color hair
they have, if they already had a child, what
their interests, what their hobbies were. And
there were certain things that were important
to me. I was raised in a musical home. I wanted
her to be raised in a musical home. I mean, I
just had, I wanted her to have outdoor experiences.
Like I did camping and living in the great outdoors.
And, you know, so there were little things there,
but ultimately it was again on my knees, pleading,
lead me, guide me, walk me. beside me, help me
find this way. Literally, literally. Where did
that faith come from? I guarantee it was from
my upbringing. This song, Love Is Spoken Here,
is my upbringing. I see my mother kneeling. My
father was a valiant priesthood holder. We had
family night, family prayer. I just, I was raised
in a really great home that taught me the importance
of prayer. And obviously that instilled within
you some faith. Yeah, when you get in a really
rough spot, you go kind of back to your roots.
You do. You really do. I, you know, when it's
appropriate at some point, I have a similar experience
and a night where I was actually snatched like
it's talked about in Alma just literally snatched
out of my situation out of my attitude out of
my problem out of everything it was definitely
the hand of God but but I've often asked myself
that same question that's why I asked you because
I don't know the answer you know where did that
faith come from You know, I don't know where
that faith for me came from. In fact, I don't
know that I had that much faith in the beginning
when I began to find better alignment so that
I could have joy in my life, better alignment
with Heavenly Father's will for me. I'm a true
believer that all of us were born with the light
of Christ. I really truly believe that. Yeah,
that's doctrine for sure. And I feel like when
we know truth, there's something that resonates
in us. I watch children, all children, and they
know right and wrong. They know truth. And I
think as, I mean, we all chose him, Jesus Christ,
we all chose him, and that's why we are all here.
Chose him once. Yeah, we chose him once in the
pre -existence. When there was a plan presented,
we chose either Well, we chose Heavenly Father's
plan or we chose Satan's plan. And I know that
every human being that walks this planet chose
him once. I know that. There is no doubt in my
mind. And I feel like when that truth resonates
and the spirit is penetrated, And we know that
truth. I feel like every single human being that
walks this planet has the ability to know truth.
I mean, I, I shared this years ago. There was
a little primary kid that I taught and I said,
when you feel the spirit, what do you feel? And
I remember her telling me, and this is a little
kid, she goes, I get the hiccups. And, and I
was like, Oh, that's cute. When you feel the
spirit, you get hiccups. And I'm like, okay,
what else? Oh, I have a warm feeling inside or
I get cold chills or I get tears or whatever.
about five years later, this young girl was up
at the pulpit, burying her testimony. And got
the hiccups. And I just wept. I was like, you
recognize the spirit. At a very young age. How
tender, how sweet. So however we feel it, it's
not right or wrong. It just is. That's how we
feel it. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not sure where it came
from for me. I don't ever remember a time where
It was just big and all of a sudden I knew that
I had faith in Jesus I knew that I had faith
in what he had done for me. I do remember though
not believing it, you know bullet not not not
believing the church but not believing that He
did it all for me. I believe I remember growing
up thinking I needed to do it for me And I man
that was just a difficult spot to be in and sometimes
I still because and I don't know if it's programming
I don't know if it's DNA. I don't know what it
is, but I know that sometimes When I've been
feeling the way I've been feeling over the last
week or so just a little bit off the beam You
know off the beam or on the beam doesn't I'm
off the beam. I've been feeling off the beam
so to speak Something's amiss, you know, something's
just not and and so often it's just me That has
just kind of drifted away faith and it is difficult
and and for a lot of people it's a new concept
or a concept that has so much contextual and
principle to it that is really kind of one that
we don't really dive in too much or talk to very
talk about very much, but In Alma 3221, it says,
talking about faith, and now as I said, concerning
faith. Faith is not to have the perfect knowledge
of things, therefore if you have faith, you hope
for things which are not seen which are true.
And so according to that, according to what I
just read, if I have faith, I hope for things
which are not seen but they're true. I hope.
for things that are not seeing, which are true.
What does that mean? That means that when you're
17 years old and you're struggling the way that
you're struggling and you're in that kind of
despair, you hope. You know, as much as desperate
as I felt, I knew he knew. I knew he knew. There
was not a question that I didn't wonder if he
knew. I knew he knew. It was seeking that answer
from him that I needed. to seek. So it wasn't,
I mean, I was just hoping that I could hear that
answer or be led to that answer or be guided
to that answer. And let me hear you. Let me see
how you speak to me. Let me hear and be led and
guided. And, you know, when I feel the spirit,
I have a warmth, massive warmth in my, in my
heart. And I often will get chills and I often
tear up and I'm like, Ooh, there's my truth meter.
That's, that's true. And so I had to seek, I
knew he knew, but I had to seek how to get that
answer. So how does this tie in then to merits
of Christ, not my merits, but his merits? And
then how does that tie into faith then and being
able to overcome the things that keep us from
joy? Well, I think first off, the merits of Christ,
I think I think for that situation, you know,
seeing a 17 year old pregnant was not the ideal
situation. And because I had gone through the
repentance process and I knew that this wrong
could be made right. I saw, I mean, I felt like
I had done, I mean, being immoral was next to
murder in my belief system. And I remember thinking,
and I remember seeing people that adopted babies
and I just thought we were able to make this
thing that was so, so wrong, so, so right because
of the merits of Jesus Christ. And I was so grateful
that that terrible wrong could be made right.
And I think to understand the faith, knowing
I wasn't as worried about Making it right for
me because I felt like I had I had the merits
to pay You felt like you needed to be punished.
I did I know I felt like I I was being punished
and I I I felt like I needed to take my whoopens
that's literally kind of how I what I truly believed
and I think that's why I again got pregnant so
soon after I placed that baby for adoption and
had such a spiritual awakening and such a answering
to prayers and so much faith. And I think that's
why I, it was because I felt like this was all
I deserved. And it was such a messed up belief
system that my perception was that I, I, it was,
that was a really big sin. Even though it's made
right. I didn't allow him. That's where my faith
was. Weak is I didn't have the faith that he
I knew he was gonna make that situation, right?
But I didn't have the faith that he was gonna
make me right. Yeah at the end of of the fifth
chapter or where we read in the fifth chapter
of alcoholics anonymous Do you remember that
that we believe that God could and would if he
were sought, right? Yeah, I always believed he
could I Just didn't know he would for me Yeah,
and I think that's where I got tripped up. Right.
Is because that was the ultimate sin. I mean,
that was like, oh my gosh, no hiding it. No,
even though we tried to hide it, it was just
like, there was just no, I mean, I just felt
like, you know. For sure. Yeah. I deserve it.
For me, it really is all about that, you know,
that God could and would if he were sod. I believe
that he could. So I must have had some faith,
faith in him. And I believe that he would for
others, but I just never would believe that he
would for me, Deb. And I think that's the case
for me because I felt like that I had to pay
it back. I had to earn it back. I had to rely
on my own merit. And relying on my own merit
really robs me of the experience of faith. Yeah.
Yeah. Now that we talk about that, that's interesting
to have that perception of, yeah, I had the faith
that he could make that wrong right, but I didn't
have the faith that he was going to make me right.
Not for me. Yeah. I think that's where I got
tripped up. And the reason I adopted that is
because I knew better. because where much is
given much is expected right right i was raised
in the kind of not enough i was raised in the
same type of family you were we did family night
we read scriptures we did all of the same things
and you know obviously We can do all that's right
and not and our kids won't always turn out exactly
the way we want them to dang kids have free agency
No, that was a case for me and my parents much
to their chagrin There's such wonderful people
and have forgiven and all that today but but
the point is is it's like I believed that I knew
better and because I knew better I was being
held to a higher standard the fall was less effective
in my life for some mysterious reason and because
of that I needed to pay for the stupid stuff
I did. And I think that's where I got tripped
up again. Really? Yeah. It's because I just felt
like I had to pay. Yeah. Yeah. Those merits,
that was a real belief for me, is that I had
to earn my own. If I believe that it's my merits
that count over his, it robs me of the experience
of faith. Well, even the rate and repentance
faith unto him and faith unto repent. There's
no repentance without faith. No hundred percent
There's no coming unto him without faith and
you know, and there's so many levels though of
faith You know so many yeah, it was right after
that that I went got my patriarchal blessing
right after I had that first baby and I I I just
remember thinking I'm in alignment. I'm in alignment
because I was doing the things that I thought
I was supposed to do. What I was missing was
that wholly relying on him still. Cause I was
like, Hey, he got me through that. Now I got
this. Yeah. But you know, cut yourself some slack
there too, because you were learning how. True,
and I think and I'm grateful I learned and I
think that's for all of us I think that you know
when it comes to this kind of stuff We really
need to get be gentle with ourselves. Oh for
sure We need to we really need to extend ourselves
a lot of grace because it's really easy for me
to sit here in this situation 26 almost 27 now
years. Can you believe that almost? 27 years
now sober and it's it's a lot different here
today Deb than it was then yeah, and so I get
it, and I know that we have listeners and I know
that we have friends and loved ones and others
that are out there that are just in different
stages of this whole process, and there are so
many levels of faith. We just begin to talk about
just a little bit of faith, faith in Jesus, right,
faith, and then faith in Jesus Christ. Anybody
can have faith. Right, but it but it's really
faith in Jesus Christ is when we start talking
about the doctrine of Christ Faith in Jesus Christ
faith in what in Jesus Christ faith in all that
he did right faith in Alma chapter 7 faith in
Alma 32 21 faith all of that We're getting to
the point now where I think if we start taking
on more on faith tonight that we won't be able
to do it justice. And so we'll kind of move that
discussion to next week. But for this week, maybe
we can do our own personal inventory. I began
the podcast tonight talking about a personal
inventory that I've been doing. And maybe the
rest of us can too, at least to a little bit
degree. Just do a little personal inventory on
where am I? Where am I? How much do I trust?
how much faith do I have? Does the faith that
I have have power in it? Does it motivate me?
Does it drive me to repentance? Does it help
me come closer to Him? And so, you know, maybe
throughout this week as we prepare for the sacrament
coming up Sunday, maybe we can just take that
challenge on, babe. I just love again in that
quote from Adam Miller about rely wholly upon
the merits of Him. who is mighty to save. I think
that's such a critical piece for me to remember
because I rely there were oftentimes I rely partially
on him and I but I was not relying wholly wholly
on him that can he that he that can save. I can't
wait to have Nick on again. I love his perspective
on that right he thought that he could only get
to him through certain through the church and
through certain other things, you know, we don't
have We don't have the corner on a relationship
with him and anybody who can exercise faith in
him can have Faith, I mean can have relief from
the sins of the fallen world. We just can yeah
and I think it's also great to to hear how people
come to Christ in their own sweet ways, and I
seek for that. I look for ways that people seek
Him, and I'm interested in them sharing with
me how they... Find him and whether it's through
prayer whether it's I mean I go back to when
we were in Israel and we were at the River Jordan
and just watching all of those people in one
way or another Just finding their way to Jesus
describe that describe that there were hundreds
and hundreds of people there. It's a it's a tourist
site now and it's concrete and stairs and restrooms
and there's tour guides everywhere and there's
there are people there of all denominations.
This is the traditional site. where Jesus was
baptized by John the Baptist. The traditional
site. We don't know for sure where that was,
but this is the traditional site. But this is
where all the tour buses go. And this is where
everybody goes to say this is where Jesus Christ
was baptized by John the Baptist. And as we approach,
there are hundreds and hundreds and hundreds
of people there. And some of them are in white
robes and some of them are just in a pair of
shorts and some of them. I mean, it just like
tons. of people, some of them are in the water,
dripping water on the head and there's preachers
and pastors and all kinds of people ministering
and helping baptize in any way they knew how.
To come unto Him. To come unto Him. And I remember
in the noise thinking, well, there is a lot going
on here. And this was not the traditional way
I knew Jesus to be baptized. And I thought, okay
push pause Deb and I backed up and I went up
the stairs and I looked down on this river and
I watched all of the hundreds of people hundreds
of people trying to touch that sacred water and
to find Jesus somehow and I just I looked up
to the sky and I just said oh heavenly father
I bet this just makes your heart so warm that
all of these hundreds and hundreds of people
are following your son, Jesus Christ. They just
want to be like you, like him, to get to Heavenly
Father. I was so overwhelmed with that, that
goodness that was among their, any way they found
him, whatever it looked like, they were all trying
to get to Jesus, period. They just were seeking
him. The one needful thing. Yes. the one needful
thing. We have a picture and I'll just end with
this, but we have a picture in our living room
from that very trip. I've talked about it on
the podcast before, but this is the woman who
had been what do you call it? Issue of blood.
She had the issue of blood for 12 years. This
is the woman who had had the issue of blood for
12 years and through her faith reached through
the crowd and just was able because of her faith
to touch the hem of the Savior. and he felt a
virtue. leave him. He felt that. He felt that
healing take place. He even knew. Hadn't gone
through the events, all of the events of the
atonement yet, but of his atonement yet, but
he had felt that and through her faith was able
to be healed. You know, sometimes that's all
it takes. It's just our ability to reach through
the crowd, to reach through the busyness of our
world, to reach through the confusion, through
the hecticness, through All that's coming at
us from every single direction and find even
in the chaos the ability to reach through and
just with our finger Touch the hem of him who
hills. Yeah I'm grateful I'm grateful. I'm grateful
that when I get off the beam I know how to get
back on when I get I'm grateful that I Know that
when I feel that my life has drifted a little
bit that he's not wringing his hands He's not
worried about me. He's not mad at me. He's just
waiting for me to come back to say Welcome home,
you know, here you are again, you know, and I'm
not talking about major sin or I'm not talking
I'm just talking about a spiritual Drift. Yeah
a spiritual drift and and you know, I'm human
and I hope it I hope that I just hope that I
can always know that through the spirit of the
Holy Ghost that all those things can be administered
and that all the blessings of Christ's atonement
can be administered into my life and I'm grateful
for that today. I guess Deb as we kind of just
wrap it up today just like always we want to
say to you our listeners that wherever you are
however you're feeling. You're welcome to be
here with us. We hope that you find hope and
healing as you do. Jesus isn't waiting for you
to clean everything up, thank goodness. He's
just waiting for us to come to Him. Yep, He meets
us in the middle of our mess and our chaos and
our crazy. Especially when we seek him that's
where his grace shines the brightest so come
as you are broken hopeful questioning Searching
you truly are not alone and neither are we? So
thanks for being here. Yeah, we'd also love to
stay connected. We've made a little push on social
media I'm the one doing it. So it's pretty I
don't know not very great, but We're trying to
do that. No big deal. If you if you don't want
to like us find us share us. That's great But
we really love your questions. We love your comments.
We've had a couple of conversations going on
via email currently and are really enjoying that
opportunity stuff that we have been asked not
to really talk about on the podcast. But if you
have questions that you'd like us to, we'd be
more than happy to address those here as well.
And you can do that at he redeems us at gmail
.com. And if this episode touched you or any
other episode touched your heart, we hope that
you share it with someone you love and care about,
a friend, a family member, anyone who could use
a little bit more hope and faith. Next week,
we're going to continue our discussion on faith.
We're going to learn about how the Savior doesn't
just redeem us. He heals us. He lifts us. He
transforms us. Thanks for being with us, everyone.
And remember, there is always hope through Him.
because you have been redeemed through His blood.
We love you. God be with you. Until next time,
be well.