WEBVTT 00:00:15.940 --> 00:00:19.039 Hey there, everybody. Welcome out to another 00:00:19.039 --> 00:00:22.719 episode of Redeemed Through His Blood, season 00:00:22.719 --> 00:00:26.719 four. Scott Durfey here, joined as always by 00:00:26.719 --> 00:00:32.200 my better half. That's debatable. What's up, 00:00:32.380 --> 00:00:35.679 Deb? Hi, everyone. Hi, my friends. It's good 00:00:35.679 --> 00:00:38.119 to have you, Deb. How's the week been? Everything 00:00:38.119 --> 00:00:41.600 good? Oh, I had a fabulous Mother's Day. That's 00:00:41.600 --> 00:00:46.200 right. It was fantastic. Just past this past 00:00:46.200 --> 00:00:48.640 week. In fact, before I came down here, I had 00:00:48.640 --> 00:00:52.520 a busy day at work. Yeah. And I was like, how 00:00:52.520 --> 00:00:54.719 am I going to just calm down? And I read through 00:00:54.719 --> 00:00:57.179 a couple of my Mother's Day cards and just remembered 00:00:57.179 --> 00:01:02.090 the day and being surrounded by my kids and friends 00:01:02.090 --> 00:01:06.069 and loved loved loved loved loved ones yeah yeah 00:01:06.069 --> 00:01:08.310 warms my heart yeah you definitely had a blessed 00:01:08.310 --> 00:01:11.629 day on mother's day you know what though uh it's 00:01:11.629 --> 00:01:14.909 not the case for everybody i know and i'm so 00:01:14.909 --> 00:01:16.890 sorry for that please come over and i'll feed 00:01:16.890 --> 00:01:19.489 you and hug you yeah not everybody mother's day 00:01:19.489 --> 00:01:22.250 is not a wonderful day for everybody out there 00:01:22.250 --> 00:01:25.090 and we're aware of that we did We've received 00:01:25.090 --> 00:01:29.090 a couple of emails encouraging you, Deb, to continue 00:01:29.090 --> 00:01:32.849 on and say, hey, don't be nervous. You're doing 00:01:32.849 --> 00:01:35.269 a great job. Thank you for that, everyone. And 00:01:35.269 --> 00:01:37.810 all of that, yeah. I just wanted to read parts 00:01:37.810 --> 00:01:41.569 of this one. I don't know where this person's 00:01:41.569 --> 00:01:43.909 from or anything like that, but I thought it 00:01:43.909 --> 00:01:47.810 was really cool. I haven't listened to all of 00:01:47.810 --> 00:01:50.370 it yet, but I was listening to a recent one that 00:01:50.370 --> 00:01:53.049 Deb has joined as a co -host, and I really appreciate 00:01:53.049 --> 00:01:56.010 both your openness and vulnerability. This is 00:01:56.010 --> 00:01:58.390 what I thought was great. Sharing your experience 00:01:58.390 --> 00:02:01.409 is helping me deepen my understanding of the 00:02:01.409 --> 00:02:04.769 Savior's grace and atoning sacrifice. Hearing 00:02:04.769 --> 00:02:07.450 you continually praise and express gratitude 00:02:07.450 --> 00:02:10.409 is exactly what I've needed to hear. Thanks for 00:02:10.409 --> 00:02:13.169 all you do. And I think that there's something 00:02:13.169 --> 00:02:16.689 to be said about that. not just us, but everybody, 00:02:16.810 --> 00:02:20.150 there's something to be said about praising God, 00:02:20.509 --> 00:02:24.550 praising Jesus, praising the Lord, where we should 00:02:24.550 --> 00:02:29.389 be praising him. And we wrapped up last week 00:02:29.389 --> 00:02:33.330 and we actually did our first Institute class, 00:02:33.409 --> 00:02:37.129 I did, you weren't there. I was busy doing other 00:02:37.129 --> 00:02:42.159 things. Yeah. Well, honestly, you were to you 00:02:42.159 --> 00:02:43.979 had a temple walk and things that you had to 00:02:43.979 --> 00:02:46.919 do for your bridal shower. That's true. I forgot 00:02:46.919 --> 00:02:51.300 about that. And there was a wedding. Yeah. So 00:02:51.300 --> 00:02:53.460 there were four horses to ride for one person. 00:02:53.460 --> 00:02:56.060 I had to pick my horse. Well, I picked I picked 00:02:56.060 --> 00:02:58.800 the other horse and did make it is to it was 00:02:58.800 --> 00:03:01.419 great. We talked about who we are like we talked 00:03:01.419 --> 00:03:03.340 about last week in the episode, you know, in 00:03:03.340 --> 00:03:07.129 our first in our. last episode prior to this 00:03:07.129 --> 00:03:09.310 when we talked about who we are, whose we are. 00:03:09.590 --> 00:03:12.729 I've been thinking a lot about that of you. Absolutely. 00:03:12.909 --> 00:03:16.310 What have you been thinking? Well, it puts things 00:03:16.310 --> 00:03:19.729 in perspective really quickly for me. Yeah. Because. 00:03:20.490 --> 00:03:24.330 So talking about who who I am. Yes. Yeah. Who 00:03:24.330 --> 00:03:27.930 we are. Because I have a lot of distractions. 00:03:27.969 --> 00:03:33.669 I have a very busy work that I I a job that I 00:03:33.669 --> 00:03:37.370 work at. and it is I think that's where I exercise 00:03:37.370 --> 00:03:39.909 the most that I just I literally have to push 00:03:39.909 --> 00:03:42.930 pause and I take a big deep breath and I'm like 00:03:42.930 --> 00:03:48.770 think celestial dad this is just a job literally 00:03:48.770 --> 00:03:52.090 yeah I literally do because there's pressures 00:03:52.090 --> 00:03:55.189 and stresses and personalities that are very 00:03:55.189 --> 00:03:58.650 very difficult for me that I literally just have 00:03:58.650 --> 00:04:01.500 to take a deep breath and go they're a son or 00:04:01.500 --> 00:04:05.759 a daughter of God too and we this is this is 00:04:05.759 --> 00:04:09.419 not who they really are this is so I there's 00:04:09.419 --> 00:04:12.740 perspective a lot of perspective that I have 00:04:12.740 --> 00:04:15.199 to just kind of push pause and you know you really 00:04:15.199 --> 00:04:19.399 can't find you know positive in a day in a situation 00:04:19.399 --> 00:04:24.310 if you look for it yeah if if Oftentimes in the 00:04:24.310 --> 00:04:26.990 podcast, we talk about Doctrine and Covenants, 00:04:27.069 --> 00:04:29.490 section six, where it says, look unto me in every 00:04:29.490 --> 00:04:32.949 thought. I always wondered, so I think that's 00:04:32.949 --> 00:04:36.709 important, but I often wonder if we looked unto 00:04:36.709 --> 00:04:39.970 him in every thought, knowing who we are, and 00:04:39.970 --> 00:04:43.149 if that was part of our process of looking to 00:04:43.149 --> 00:04:48.129 him. Hey, I'm a son of God, and I'm a spiritual 00:04:48.129 --> 00:04:53.920 son of... We didn't talk much about that. We 00:04:53.920 --> 00:04:57.240 talked about being sons and daughters of heavenly 00:04:57.240 --> 00:05:02.160 parents, but we learned in Mosiah that we become 00:05:02.160 --> 00:05:05.100 spiritual sons and daughters through our covenant 00:05:05.100 --> 00:05:08.680 relationship with Jesus Christ too. I think it's 00:05:08.680 --> 00:05:12.600 important for me also to remember that not only 00:05:12.600 --> 00:05:15.860 am I a daughter of God, but those that I'm surrounded 00:05:15.860 --> 00:05:19.279 with. I mean, Bi are also sons and daughters 00:05:19.279 --> 00:05:21.899 of God, because this is where I forget it the 00:05:21.899 --> 00:05:24.579 most too, not just to work, but when I'm driving. 00:05:25.279 --> 00:05:27.519 Because sometimes people cut me off or sometimes 00:05:27.519 --> 00:05:30.959 people do things that I'm like super irritated 00:05:30.959 --> 00:05:34.759 with. Well, and this is the little story I have 00:05:34.759 --> 00:05:37.459 to tell myself. Oh, they're probably hurrying 00:05:37.459 --> 00:05:39.420 to the hospital because their wife's in labor 00:05:39.420 --> 00:05:42.279 or oh, they probably just found out that their 00:05:42.279 --> 00:05:44.439 parent passed away. I literally have to play 00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:48.470 this little story in my head. to remember the 00:05:48.470 --> 00:05:50.990 eternal perspective of these are sons and daughters 00:05:50.990 --> 00:05:53.870 of Heavenly Father and I am a daughter of Heavenly 00:05:53.870 --> 00:05:55.990 Father. It's a game I have to play with myself. 00:05:56.610 --> 00:05:59.329 It's that sounds absurd. You can edit that if 00:05:59.329 --> 00:06:01.410 you want. I'm not going to edit that. That's 00:06:01.410 --> 00:06:03.970 out there for the whole world, sweetie. But, 00:06:04.089 --> 00:06:06.939 you know, for those of us who know you. We know 00:06:06.939 --> 00:06:10.060 this so it's okay that I play a little game when 00:06:10.060 --> 00:06:12.519 I'm well when I have road rage Yeah, we're just 00:06:12.519 --> 00:06:15.379 you know, I and nobody's different than you I'm 00:06:15.379 --> 00:06:17.639 certainly no different than you in that regard 00:06:17.639 --> 00:06:21.620 for sure, but I wonder if you know at some point 00:06:21.620 --> 00:06:25.660 We when we have those situations and we see ourselves 00:06:25.660 --> 00:06:28.860 as who we are and we see others as who they are. 00:06:29.379 --> 00:06:31.620 I think that, you know, as we progress along 00:06:31.620 --> 00:06:34.079 this path that we're progressing along, or we're 00:06:34.079 --> 00:06:36.680 making an attempt to progress along in healing 00:06:36.680 --> 00:06:38.899 from all of the effects of the fallen world, 00:06:39.139 --> 00:06:41.480 which we're going to talk about tonight. Which 00:06:41.480 --> 00:06:43.379 I'm excited about. Yeah, which we're going to 00:06:43.379 --> 00:06:50.480 talk about today. But understanding who I am, 00:06:51.139 --> 00:06:54.720 and that I really have a royal birthright that 00:06:54.720 --> 00:07:02.560 I really am. by way of heirship entitled to all 00:07:02.560 --> 00:07:04.540 that my Heavenly Father has. And in this life, 00:07:04.600 --> 00:07:07.699 that's so incomprehensible to me. In this life, 00:07:07.699 --> 00:07:09.519 I'm just trying to keep my head above water, 00:07:09.560 --> 00:07:11.699 it seems like most of the time. And so most of 00:07:11.699 --> 00:07:14.980 the time, what that really means to me then is 00:07:14.980 --> 00:07:19.040 that I can just have peace. Peace in the trial, 00:07:19.180 --> 00:07:21.740 peace in the affliction, peace in the mess, you 00:07:21.740 --> 00:07:26.620 know, like we've talked about so much. will be 00:07:26.620 --> 00:07:30.939 joint heirs with Jesus Christ. I mean, that is 00:07:30.939 --> 00:07:33.579 overwhelming. Yeah, me too. Yeah, it's like, 00:07:33.620 --> 00:07:35.439 I don't even know what that means. So let's just 00:07:35.439 --> 00:07:38.680 back it up a little bit. Pause. Actually, I do 00:07:38.680 --> 00:07:40.839 kind of have a feeling that I know what that 00:07:40.839 --> 00:07:44.240 means, but I think let's just back it up a little 00:07:44.240 --> 00:07:48.509 bit and talk about. You know, some of the things 00:07:48.509 --> 00:07:51.029 that we talked about, just to wrap up from last 00:07:51.029 --> 00:07:52.850 week, some of the things that we talked about 00:07:52.850 --> 00:07:56.069 in class this past week about who we are, some 00:07:56.069 --> 00:07:59.730 of the comments were, you know, if I really constantly 00:07:59.730 --> 00:08:02.410 remembered, and that's the word that you like 00:08:02.410 --> 00:08:05.009 to talk about so often is the remembering, but 00:08:05.009 --> 00:08:09.110 if I really remembered who I am, then my life 00:08:09.110 --> 00:08:11.629 would be completely different a lot of the time. 00:08:12.869 --> 00:08:15.649 I wouldn't have the insecurities or feelings 00:08:15.649 --> 00:08:20.509 of inadequacies that I have. I would accept the 00:08:20.509 --> 00:08:23.790 trials that come my way, maybe with a little 00:08:23.790 --> 00:08:28.230 bit of a different approach and so much more. 00:08:28.810 --> 00:08:32.009 But we talked about last week the pre -existence, 00:08:32.129 --> 00:08:35.230 we talked about the council and heaven and all 00:08:35.230 --> 00:08:38.730 that took place there. And then, What we really 00:08:38.730 --> 00:08:42.730 didn't get into yet was what happened next, right? 00:08:42.769 --> 00:08:45.129 So we know we have these pillars of eternity. 00:08:45.230 --> 00:08:47.669 We know we have the creation. We know we have 00:08:47.669 --> 00:08:50.210 the fall of Adam and Eve. We know we have the 00:08:50.210 --> 00:08:52.990 atonement of Jesus Christ and the resurrection 00:08:52.990 --> 00:08:55.769 and all these things are what we call the pillars 00:08:55.769 --> 00:08:58.870 of eternity. So the first pillar of eternity, 00:08:59.490 --> 00:09:01.950 or the next pillar of eternity that we're gonna 00:09:01.950 --> 00:09:05.169 be talking about, rather, is actually the fall 00:09:05.169 --> 00:09:08.960 of Adam and Eve. And that's an interesting conversation. 00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:13.120 People will sometimes say, well, okay, but aren't 00:09:13.120 --> 00:09:15.559 we gonna talk about healing? Aren't we gonna 00:09:15.559 --> 00:09:19.080 talk about how do we let Jesus's power into our 00:09:19.080 --> 00:09:22.539 lives to heal us from all of the stuff that... 00:09:22.590 --> 00:09:26.230 that really stinks in our lives and those kinds 00:09:26.230 --> 00:09:28.889 of things. And so, you know, it's important that 00:09:28.889 --> 00:09:32.169 we understand who we are and it's important that 00:09:32.169 --> 00:09:34.509 we understand why we're in the condition that 00:09:34.509 --> 00:09:39.269 we're in today so that we can approach that fallenness 00:09:39.269 --> 00:09:42.470 in a different way, a way with more grace, a 00:09:42.470 --> 00:09:45.590 way with more ease, a way with more whatever 00:09:45.590 --> 00:09:50.289 adjective that you're looking for. That reminds 00:09:50.289 --> 00:09:53.330 me of the second article of faith that says, 00:09:53.570 --> 00:09:55.269 we believe that men will be punished for their 00:09:55.269 --> 00:09:58.230 own sins and not for Adam's transgression. And 00:09:58.230 --> 00:10:02.830 I think, I think just remembering that, you know, 00:10:02.850 --> 00:10:05.889 we think of the fall and we think of transgression, 00:10:06.169 --> 00:10:12.009 but I think understanding the fall has, and really 00:10:12.009 --> 00:10:15.090 studying the fall has changed my entire perspective. 00:10:15.920 --> 00:10:18.500 of what Adam and Eve did in that Garden of Eden. 00:10:18.779 --> 00:10:21.440 Yeah, right, yeah. Okay, well let's do this. 00:10:21.620 --> 00:10:23.840 Why would it be important for us to talk about 00:10:23.840 --> 00:10:26.230 the fall? Well, I think understanding the fall 00:10:26.230 --> 00:10:30.769 has helped me realize that the things, the experiences 00:10:30.769 --> 00:10:34.169 and the challenges and the mistakes and things 00:10:34.169 --> 00:10:38.669 that I experience in mortality, that it is literally 00:10:38.669 --> 00:10:42.830 one of those things that helps me remember that 00:10:42.830 --> 00:10:45.649 there is a purpose for all the challenges, trials, 00:10:46.149 --> 00:10:50.330 temptations, even on days that I have those. 00:10:50.509 --> 00:10:54.289 moments that it's like a why me moment. Why is 00:10:54.289 --> 00:10:56.549 this happening? What am I supposed to learn from 00:10:56.549 --> 00:11:00.509 this? But it helps me understanding the fall 00:11:00.509 --> 00:11:04.730 helps me know that everything has its purpose 00:11:04.730 --> 00:11:08.889 and it's all a part of God's plan. There is no 00:11:08.889 --> 00:11:13.190 mistakes. There is no accidents. And so everything 00:11:13.190 --> 00:11:16.450 that we're here experiencing feeling our life 00:11:16.450 --> 00:11:22.059 experiences are part of why we are here, literally. 00:11:23.700 --> 00:11:25.659 When we talk about the fall of Adam and Eve, 00:11:26.539 --> 00:11:30.080 this is literally our advent into mortality. 00:11:31.100 --> 00:11:35.360 And without this advent into mortality, our progression 00:11:35.360 --> 00:11:38.379 would have just been stifled, right? There's 00:11:38.379 --> 00:11:41.299 just so much that we would not have been able 00:11:41.299 --> 00:11:47.429 to do to progress, et cetera. But here's the 00:11:47.429 --> 00:11:49.710 problem, there comes, because of the fall, Deb, 00:11:49.870 --> 00:11:52.850 there comes two big problems. Spiritual death 00:11:52.850 --> 00:11:55.029 and physical death. Physical death, so let's 00:11:55.029 --> 00:11:56.990 read about them. So let's go to the first one 00:11:56.990 --> 00:11:59.350 is we're gonna talk about physical death. Let's 00:11:59.350 --> 00:12:04.610 go to Moses chapter six, verse 48. So, Moses 00:12:04.610 --> 00:12:09.740 chapter six, verse 48. And he said unto them, 00:12:09.940 --> 00:12:14.039 because that Adam fell, we are, and by his fall 00:12:14.039 --> 00:12:19.259 came death, and we are made partakers of misery 00:12:19.259 --> 00:12:26.720 and woe. Yay. Hooray. Partakers of misery and 00:12:26.720 --> 00:12:29.740 woe. So, you know, because of the physical death, 00:12:30.299 --> 00:12:33.740 we become partakers of what? Misery and woe. 00:12:33.820 --> 00:12:36.620 Okay, physical death. Alright, let's go to Alma 00:12:36.620 --> 00:12:39.320 42, chapter nine. We're not gonna do a ton of 00:12:39.320 --> 00:12:41.720 this tonight, but just a little bit we need to. 00:12:41.740 --> 00:12:46.000 Let's go to Alma chapter 42, verse nine. Therefore, 00:12:46.000 --> 00:12:49.700 as the soul could never die, and the fall had 00:12:49.700 --> 00:12:52.980 brought upon all mankind a spiritual death, as 00:12:52.980 --> 00:12:56.259 well as a temporal, that is, they were cut off 00:12:56.259 --> 00:12:58.820 from the presence of the Lord. It was expedient 00:12:58.820 --> 00:13:01.919 that mankind should be reclaimed from this spiritual 00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:05.320 death. Okay, I love that. And let's not forget 00:13:05.320 --> 00:13:07.200 that. We'll put a pin in that and come back to 00:13:07.200 --> 00:13:10.580 that in weeks down the road. But where it says 00:13:10.580 --> 00:13:13.639 it is expedient that mankind should be reclaimed 00:13:13.639 --> 00:13:16.840 from this spiritual. Okay, so we're reclaimed 00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:19.700 from the spiritual death. We're reclaimed from 00:13:19.700 --> 00:13:23.679 also the physical death, right? And those are 00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:27.700 some of the blessings that come by way of Christ's 00:13:27.700 --> 00:13:30.840 atonement. But before we get to by way of Christ's 00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:33.200 atonement, we really need to dive into, okay, 00:13:33.220 --> 00:13:35.759 so what's this fall of Adam and Eve all about? 00:13:36.159 --> 00:13:38.860 So number one, was it part of the plan or was 00:13:38.860 --> 00:13:44.279 it a mistake? It was definitely part of the plan. 00:13:44.570 --> 00:13:47.669 I love Elder Anderson's book, The Divine Gift 00:13:47.669 --> 00:13:50.269 of Forgiveness, and there's so many nuggets in 00:13:50.269 --> 00:13:53.289 here that talks about the fall. And it says, 00:13:53.830 --> 00:13:56.490 before the fall of Adam, this is chapter six, 00:13:56.610 --> 00:13:59.750 far from our heavenly home, page 64, in The Divine 00:13:59.750 --> 00:14:03.669 Gift of Forgiveness. And I'm in the third paragraph, 00:14:03.929 --> 00:14:07.070 a little bit down. Two of the Father's choices 00:14:07.070 --> 00:14:09.629 spirits, Adam and Eve, were selected to begin 00:14:09.629 --> 00:14:14.019 the human family. before the fall of Adam, there 00:14:14.019 --> 00:14:19.019 were no children, no death, and no sin upon the 00:14:19.019 --> 00:14:22.759 earth. I can't even imagine that. No children? 00:14:22.879 --> 00:14:26.539 No children. No sin? No sin. No death? No death. 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:28.879 I can't even imagine that. And then when Adam 00:14:28.879 --> 00:14:32.559 and Eve ate the forbidden fruit, all the living 00:14:32.559 --> 00:14:37.440 elements of the earth became mortal, requiring 00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:41.860 work to live and survive. and bringing death, 00:14:42.080 --> 00:14:44.759 sin, temptation, injustice, physical and spiritual 00:14:44.759 --> 00:14:48.340 trials, and all the difficulties of mortality. 00:14:48.740 --> 00:14:51.480 That really pushes pause in my brain for a minute. 00:14:51.480 --> 00:14:56.600 Yeah. Why? Yeah. Why? Well, like I said, I cannot 00:14:56.600 --> 00:15:00.039 imagine no children, no death, and no sin, which 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:04.580 means to me, I mean, I'm reading into this, but 00:15:04.580 --> 00:15:08.200 did they really know joy with no sorrow? No. 00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:13.590 Okay. The answer to that is found, right? You're 00:15:13.590 --> 00:15:15.509 gonna tell me a scripture, I know it. Exactly, 00:15:15.710 --> 00:15:19.309 we're gonna go to Moses, chapter five. So the 00:15:19.309 --> 00:15:21.370 question was what again? Did they know joy or 00:15:21.370 --> 00:15:24.549 could they know joy? Well, there was no sin, 00:15:24.710 --> 00:15:26.909 no death upon the earth, so how would they know 00:15:26.909 --> 00:15:29.889 joy? Yep, let's go to chapter five of Moses. 00:15:30.029 --> 00:15:32.860 Hang on, you're faster than me. And we're gonna 00:15:32.860 --> 00:15:38.080 start in Moses chapter five verse eight. Wherefore, 00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:40.360 thou shalt do all thou doest in the name of the 00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:42.919 Son, and thou shalt repent and call upon God 00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:46.159 in the name of the Son forevermore. So obviously 00:15:46.159 --> 00:15:48.980 Adam and Eve are being commanded here, taught 00:15:48.980 --> 00:15:51.779 here, what they need to be doing. And they're, 00:15:51.820 --> 00:15:53.399 right, the very first, one of the very first 00:15:53.399 --> 00:15:55.539 things that they're taught is we need to call 00:15:55.539 --> 00:15:58.799 upon the name of the Son. That means something 00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:01.059 more than just calling upon the Son. They call 00:16:01.059 --> 00:16:03.860 upon the name of the Son. We'll get to that in 00:16:03.860 --> 00:16:06.720 a few weeks when we talk about faith in the name 00:16:06.720 --> 00:16:09.179 of Jesus Christ. So just kind of put that in 00:16:09.179 --> 00:16:11.919 the back of your head for a minute. And then 00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:14.860 in nine, and in that day the Holy Ghost fell 00:16:14.860 --> 00:16:17.259 upon Adam, which beareth record of the Father 00:16:17.259 --> 00:16:19.460 and the Son, saying, I am the only begotten of 00:16:19.460 --> 00:16:22.159 the Father, from the beginning henceforth and 00:16:22.159 --> 00:16:26.500 forever, that thou hast fallen, thou mayest be. 00:16:28.529 --> 00:16:32.129 So because they were fallen, now they can be 00:16:32.129 --> 00:16:35.730 redeemed and all mankind, even as many will. 00:16:36.110 --> 00:16:38.190 So let's just stop right there. Can you have 00:16:38.190 --> 00:16:41.350 joy without redemption? Without the redemption 00:16:41.350 --> 00:16:45.929 that comes at all mankind, even as many as will. 00:16:46.539 --> 00:16:49.100 So it seems like we have a big choice here. I 00:16:49.100 --> 00:16:51.679 mean, it's just a choice as many will. Right. 00:16:52.639 --> 00:16:54.740 And in that day, Adam blessed God and was filled 00:16:54.740 --> 00:16:57.100 and began to prophesy concerning the families 00:16:57.100 --> 00:16:59.159 of the earth saying, blessed be the name of God 00:16:59.159 --> 00:17:02.480 for because of my transgression, my eyes are 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:09.059 opened. And in this life, I shall have joy. There 00:17:09.059 --> 00:17:12.119 it is. and in this life I shall have joy and 00:17:12.119 --> 00:17:14.359 again in the flesh I shall see God." And now 00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:17.059 Eve, his wife heard all these things and was 00:17:17.059 --> 00:17:19.339 glad saying, were it not for our transgression, 00:17:19.420 --> 00:17:22.440 we would have never had seed. So there's one 00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:24.900 of the four things, okay? So we would have never 00:17:24.900 --> 00:17:28.019 had seed and never should have known good and 00:17:28.019 --> 00:17:32.200 evil. So they would have never had, I mean, think 00:17:32.200 --> 00:17:33.859 of that. If you don't know the difference between 00:17:33.859 --> 00:17:37.990 good and evil, that's just flat. There's no up, 00:17:38.029 --> 00:17:41.730 there's no down, it's just flat. So that's the 00:17:41.730 --> 00:17:44.430 second one. They know good from evil. And the 00:17:44.430 --> 00:17:48.750 joy of our redemption. And the joy of our redemption. 00:17:48.869 --> 00:17:51.430 You know, that's another name of Jesus. The joy 00:17:51.430 --> 00:17:55.150 of our redemption. I love that. Yeah. And eternal 00:17:55.150 --> 00:17:59.970 life, which God giveth unto all the obedient. 00:18:00.049 --> 00:18:01.970 So would we have had joy without the fall of 00:18:01.970 --> 00:18:04.490 Adam and Eve? No. It would have been that flat. 00:18:04.490 --> 00:18:07.730 You know, and it used to be that, you know, and 00:18:07.730 --> 00:18:11.309 I don't care to compare and contrast that much, 00:18:11.329 --> 00:18:13.390 but it used to be that when we would talk about 00:18:13.390 --> 00:18:15.490 this on the podcast, that we would talk about 00:18:15.490 --> 00:18:17.950 how that, you know, our faith is really one of 00:18:17.950 --> 00:18:20.269 the only faiths that really understand the fall 00:18:20.269 --> 00:18:23.930 of Adam and Eve the way we do. But today I was 00:18:23.930 --> 00:18:27.430 listening to a Christian radio station and I 00:18:27.430 --> 00:18:29.710 heard a preacher on there. I'm not gonna say 00:18:29.710 --> 00:18:31.990 his name or even the radio station or anything 00:18:31.990 --> 00:18:34.549 like that, but this is a evangelical preacher 00:18:34.549 --> 00:18:37.670 on there, praising Adam and Eve for the fall 00:18:37.670 --> 00:18:40.890 of Adam and Eve. Yeah, first time I've ever, 00:18:41.789 --> 00:18:44.690 ever heard anything like that. Yeah, I think 00:18:44.690 --> 00:18:47.890 so too. So, okay, here we are, we're talking 00:18:47.890 --> 00:18:50.390 about the fall of Adam and Eve, and again, I'm 00:18:50.390 --> 00:18:52.609 gonna pose the question one more time, why do 00:18:52.609 --> 00:18:55.089 we care? Why does this matter to you and me, 00:18:55.269 --> 00:18:59.529 Doug? Well, I think it helps us understand why 00:18:59.529 --> 00:19:04.390 we're here and I mean understanding who we are 00:19:04.390 --> 00:19:07.730 and Why we're here. I mean it we gotta learn 00:19:07.730 --> 00:19:10.349 from our experience. We got to learn from being 00:19:10.349 --> 00:19:13.069 mortal We didn't know what it was like to to 00:19:13.069 --> 00:19:16.910 bleed to have an owie You know what? I mean learn 00:19:16.910 --> 00:19:19.029 to walk learn to eat That's funny that you'd 00:19:19.029 --> 00:19:21.390 go there because if I didn't have the fall of 00:19:21.390 --> 00:19:23.400 Adam and Eve I wouldn't have had an owie I know. 00:19:23.599 --> 00:19:25.579 Yeah, and I go too, if it wouldn't have been 00:19:25.579 --> 00:19:27.460 for the fall of Adam and Eve, alcoholism would 00:19:27.460 --> 00:19:30.700 have never become part of my life. Well, we think 00:19:30.700 --> 00:19:34.259 different. Well, and I love that. It just, you 00:19:34.259 --> 00:19:37.240 know, speaks to your own purity. Well, and I'm 00:19:37.240 --> 00:19:40.559 going also back to the book because it says, 00:19:40.680 --> 00:19:45.259 first, mortal life would not be easy. Choices 00:19:45.259 --> 00:19:47.539 and decisions would constantly be before us, 00:19:47.539 --> 00:19:50.440 and our challenge would be to choose good and 00:19:50.440 --> 00:19:53.900 reject evil. Yeah. I mean, Literally. I mean, 00:19:54.140 --> 00:19:57.700 we face stuff. I don't think there's a human 00:19:57.700 --> 00:20:00.960 on this planet that is not going through hard, 00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:03.779 hard, hard things right now. Experiencing hard 00:20:03.779 --> 00:20:06.359 things, seeing hard things, enduring hard things, 00:20:06.859 --> 00:20:09.160 and in all aspects, physically, mentally, emotionally, 00:20:09.339 --> 00:20:11.640 spiritually, I think there's just so much, like 00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:14.440 President Nelson said, tumultuous times, tumultuous 00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:18.960 things. We live in a world that is so hard. But 00:20:18.960 --> 00:20:21.799 you know what? The thing that's interesting is 00:20:21.720 --> 00:20:25.700 This isn't new news. By understanding the fall, 00:20:25.940 --> 00:20:29.740 it's like this is not, I mean, we read anywhere 00:20:29.740 --> 00:20:33.000 in scripture, nobody had it easy. Whether you 00:20:33.000 --> 00:20:35.660 were born 2 ,000 years ago or you were born in 00:20:35.660 --> 00:20:38.559 2 ,000 years, I mean, it's part of the plan. 00:20:39.920 --> 00:20:45.599 And we are here to learn good from evil. And 00:20:45.599 --> 00:20:48.680 because of the fall, we get to experience good 00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:52.690 and evil. If you were to ask me the same question, 00:20:52.730 --> 00:20:54.430 if you were to ask me, Scott, why do you think 00:20:54.430 --> 00:20:57.230 it's important that we understand the fall of 00:20:57.230 --> 00:21:00.930 Adam and Eve? I can talk about it from a collective 00:21:00.930 --> 00:21:03.730 perspective for all of us. So I think it's good 00:21:03.730 --> 00:21:06.009 that we all understand the fall of Adam and Eve 00:21:06.009 --> 00:21:10.450 because of this. I think it's important that 00:21:10.450 --> 00:21:13.809 we understand the fall of Adam and Eve as a group 00:21:13.809 --> 00:21:18.230 so that we can know this. But then I take this 00:21:18.230 --> 00:21:23.589 and I make it personal. So for me, Scott Durfee, 00:21:24.009 --> 00:21:26.549 how does understanding the fall of Adam and Eve 00:21:26.549 --> 00:21:31.849 help my relationship with deity, help my approach 00:21:31.849 --> 00:21:36.329 to overcoming the things that are on me, be all 00:21:36.329 --> 00:21:38.910 over me because of the fall of Adam and Eve, 00:21:39.089 --> 00:21:42.470 right? So understanding the fall of Adam and 00:21:42.470 --> 00:21:44.549 Eve really helps me understand a couple of things. 00:21:44.730 --> 00:21:47.769 Number one, it helps me understand that I'm not 00:21:47.769 --> 00:21:52.960 broken. I've fallen, but I'm not broken. It helps 00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:57.700 me understand that I'm not evil. I have propensities 00:21:57.700 --> 00:22:00.380 and tendencies and those types of things that 00:22:00.380 --> 00:22:03.460 may not necessarily be 100 % in alignment with 00:22:03.460 --> 00:22:05.859 my Heavenly Father's will for me, but that does 00:22:05.859 --> 00:22:09.259 not make me evil. It doesn't make me subject 00:22:09.259 --> 00:22:16.019 to the devil. and a few other things, but I think 00:22:16.019 --> 00:22:18.460 about if it hadn't have been for the fall of 00:22:18.460 --> 00:22:20.599 Adam and Eve, number one, I wouldn't have forgotten 00:22:20.599 --> 00:22:24.400 who I am. I mean, that's the very veil. That's 00:22:24.400 --> 00:22:26.759 one of the effects of the fall of Adam and Eve 00:22:26.759 --> 00:22:30.039 is we have that veil. And then the other effects 00:22:30.039 --> 00:22:34.279 of the fall of Adam and Eve would also not mean 00:22:34.279 --> 00:22:37.019 as much to me if I really have that deep understanding. 00:22:37.119 --> 00:22:42.650 So for example, I'm a recovering alcoholic. I 00:22:42.650 --> 00:22:48.230 have 26 years sober, but I still have alcoholic 00:22:48.230 --> 00:22:52.710 type of thinking and attributes, and people that 00:22:52.710 --> 00:22:54.529 don't understand that are shaking their heads 00:22:54.529 --> 00:22:57.809 right now. And you get thirsty. And I do. And 00:22:57.809 --> 00:23:01.089 people who do understand that are saying, yeah, 00:23:01.210 --> 00:23:04.869 no kidding, me too. Yeah. Yeah, no kidding, me 00:23:04.869 --> 00:23:08.710 too. Because, you know, I've told the story before, 00:23:08.710 --> 00:23:11.529 even on the podcast, but I was... So this would 00:23:11.529 --> 00:23:13.869 have been maybe 12 years ago. So I would have 00:23:13.869 --> 00:23:17.089 probably been 15 years or 14 years sober somewhere 00:23:17.089 --> 00:23:18.710 in that neighborhood. And I was in St. Louis, 00:23:18.710 --> 00:23:22.490 Missouri, speaking. I was on a work trip and 00:23:22.490 --> 00:23:24.250 I was getting ready to walk across the street 00:23:24.250 --> 00:23:28.210 to Bush Stadium to a baseball game. And as I 00:23:28.210 --> 00:23:29.970 was walking by myself, I had to walk through 00:23:29.970 --> 00:23:32.930 the bar area and all of a sudden I wanted to 00:23:32.930 --> 00:23:37.019 drink just out of nowhere. Right? It just hit 00:23:37.019 --> 00:23:39.500 me. And it wasn't one of those things like, oh, 00:23:39.500 --> 00:23:43.480 that sure sounds good. It was a drive. It was 00:23:43.480 --> 00:23:48.420 a pull. It was a, it felt so familiar. That temptation. 00:23:48.640 --> 00:23:52.039 Yeah. And it was ugly. And it scared me. I called 00:23:52.039 --> 00:23:55.799 my sponsor who at the time, who was not a member 00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:59.000 of the church, but understand life, understood 00:23:59.000 --> 00:24:02.160 life. He understood the church too. Big time. 00:24:02.240 --> 00:24:06.759 But I called him and I said, He's no longer with 00:24:06.759 --> 00:24:11.079 us, he's passed, and I owe my life, a great deal 00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:13.319 of my life to that man. Anyway, I called him 00:24:13.319 --> 00:24:15.940 and I said, hey, I got a little problem. And 00:24:15.940 --> 00:24:18.220 he goes, what's the problem? And I go, I'm walking 00:24:18.220 --> 00:24:20.319 through this bar on my way to the baseball game, 00:24:20.380 --> 00:24:25.160 and I want a drink. And I was expecting him to 00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:28.039 say, oh man, I'm so sorry, that's probably so 00:24:28.039 --> 00:24:30.519 hard, blah, blah, blah, you know. You know what 00:24:30.519 --> 00:24:32.359 he said? You know what he said. I do know what 00:24:32.359 --> 00:24:33.519 he said. You know what he said. And he says, 00:24:33.579 --> 00:24:36.420 yeah, well, no kidding. Dummy, that's not exactly 00:24:36.420 --> 00:24:38.619 how we put it. But he said, yeah, no kidding, 00:24:38.859 --> 00:24:41.319 dummy, you're an alcoholic, you're supposed to 00:24:41.319 --> 00:24:46.019 want to drink. That was a big aha for me. And 00:24:46.019 --> 00:24:49.420 it's the same way with the fall, Deb. Yeah, no 00:24:49.420 --> 00:24:52.920 kidding you have inappropriate emotions. No kidding 00:24:52.920 --> 00:24:55.740 you have inappropriate thoughts. No kidding that 00:24:55.740 --> 00:24:58.519 you're responding in ways that are inappropriate 00:24:58.519 --> 00:25:04.599 to this. situation. Yeah. And everything else. 00:25:04.759 --> 00:25:07.700 Well, he had no kidding. No kidding. You're in 00:25:07.700 --> 00:25:12.240 a fallen world. You're fallen, bro. You're, you're 00:25:12.240 --> 00:25:16.380 a mortal. Yeah. In a fallen world. And you know, 00:25:16.640 --> 00:25:19.180 As soon as I say that though, then there's that 00:25:19.180 --> 00:25:21.240 part in the back of my head that are like, okay, 00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:23.480 you're just trying to justify it. Okay, you're 00:25:23.480 --> 00:25:25.599 just trying to justify it. Okay, you're just 00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:28.279 trying. That's not the case at all. We are in 00:25:28.279 --> 00:25:31.500 a fallen world and because we deal with and have 00:25:31.500 --> 00:25:35.079 to respond to the effects of spiritual and physical 00:25:35.079 --> 00:25:38.000 death, we forget who we are sometimes. Yeah. 00:25:38.460 --> 00:25:41.640 And you know what? We are all tempted. No man's 00:25:41.640 --> 00:25:44.519 free from temptation. Yeah. Yeah. The adversary 00:25:44.519 --> 00:25:47.720 will use every means possible to deceive us. 00:25:48.059 --> 00:25:52.140 And when we make mistakes, Heavenly Father's 00:25:52.140 --> 00:25:55.799 not surprised. Heavenly Father's not mad at us. 00:25:55.819 --> 00:25:58.039 He's not up there wringing his hands thinking, 00:25:58.059 --> 00:26:03.099 oh, this fallen people. There's a plan put in 00:26:03.099 --> 00:26:05.640 place for us to heal from all of the effects 00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:08.440 of the fall of Adam and Eve. In this book, there's 00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:12.559 a quote from President M. Russell Ballard, page 00:26:12.559 --> 00:26:16.950 65. He says, Satan will seek to tempt us at all 00:26:16.950 --> 00:26:20.769 times and in ways that exploit our greatest weaknesses. 00:26:21.210 --> 00:26:25.029 He knows them too. He didn't say that. Or destroy 00:26:25.029 --> 00:26:29.789 our strengths. But his promise of pleasure are 00:26:29.789 --> 00:26:32.990 short -lived deceptions. His evil design is to 00:26:32.990 --> 00:26:36.589 tempt us into sinning, knowing that when we sin, 00:26:37.069 --> 00:26:40.589 we separate ourselves from our Heavenly Father 00:26:40.589 --> 00:26:44.289 and the Savior Jesus Christ. There he is. He's 00:26:44.289 --> 00:26:47.809 the dismemberment. He's trying to dismember us 00:26:47.809 --> 00:26:52.190 when we're trying to remember. His desire would 00:26:52.190 --> 00:26:55.170 be to destroy us spiritually and keep us from 00:26:55.170 --> 00:26:58.410 returning to our Heavenly Father. Why would Heavenly 00:26:58.410 --> 00:27:01.109 Father allow Satan to continue to fight against 00:27:01.109 --> 00:27:04.549 righteousness and to tempt all of us coming into 00:27:04.549 --> 00:27:08.750 mortality? The scriptures answer, and it must 00:27:08.750 --> 00:27:11.369 needs be that if the devil should tempt the children 00:27:11.369 --> 00:27:14.609 of men, or they could not be agents unto themselves, 00:27:14.690 --> 00:27:18.529 for if they never should have bitter, they could 00:27:18.529 --> 00:27:22.440 not know the sweet. I think, Deb, there's a couple 00:27:22.440 --> 00:27:24.859 of things that we just really wanna drive home 00:27:24.859 --> 00:27:28.519 here in context with the spirit of what we're 00:27:28.519 --> 00:27:31.519 trying to accomplish here. So let's just re -establish 00:27:31.519 --> 00:27:33.680 what it is that we're trying to accomplish with 00:27:33.680 --> 00:27:36.740 this podcast. In this podcast, it's our wish 00:27:36.740 --> 00:27:40.420 and desire, our objective, to help others to 00:27:40.420 --> 00:27:43.579 heal from whatever it is that they need to heal 00:27:43.579 --> 00:27:47.220 from using the atonement of Jesus Christ to do 00:27:47.220 --> 00:27:52.819 it. Heal from what? Heal from addiction. Heal 00:27:52.819 --> 00:27:55.980 from the problems that come from mental illness. 00:27:56.299 --> 00:27:59.900 Heal from... Abuse. The problems that can become 00:27:59.900 --> 00:28:03.380 ours because of abuse or the abuses even that 00:28:03.380 --> 00:28:07.680 we have perpetuated. Yeah, the abuser temptations. 00:28:08.240 --> 00:28:11.339 Okay. Turmoils, pains and afflictions of all 00:28:11.339 --> 00:28:15.859 kinds. Disease. There's so many. Fear, pride. 00:28:17.220 --> 00:28:20.039 selfishness, all of these other negative types 00:28:20.039 --> 00:28:25.039 of emotions are all here because of the fall 00:28:25.039 --> 00:28:29.460 of Adam and Eve. Now, when I, and this is important 00:28:29.460 --> 00:28:31.839 because, you know, when I worked the 12 steps 00:28:31.839 --> 00:28:33.880 of Alcoholics Anonymous, and I just had an opportunity 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:36.259 to work steps one, two, and three with the new 00:28:36.259 --> 00:28:38.359 sponsor the other day, which was a great experience. 00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:40.900 But when I worked through the steps of Alcoholics 00:28:40.900 --> 00:28:45.880 Anonymous, I had to find a new design for living. 00:28:46.279 --> 00:28:48.359 I mean, that's actually kind of how we refer 00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:51.759 to it there. Because of the effects of the fall, 00:28:52.519 --> 00:28:55.500 which were my alcoholism, which were all of the 00:28:55.500 --> 00:28:58.119 emotional and other negative attributes in my 00:28:58.119 --> 00:29:01.440 life that were not in alignment, that were not 00:29:01.440 --> 00:29:04.480 God -like, because of all of those things, if 00:29:04.480 --> 00:29:07.579 I ever wanted to have peace, okay, I knew the 00:29:07.579 --> 00:29:10.819 misery, which was also because of the fall, but 00:29:10.819 --> 00:29:14.400 I never... If I were to know the joy and the 00:29:14.400 --> 00:29:16.440 peace that would come through Christ's atonement, 00:29:16.799 --> 00:29:19.259 that would offset those effects of the fall. 00:29:19.460 --> 00:29:23.180 But here's my problem. So I'll be going along 00:29:23.180 --> 00:29:26.559 in life and I'll be getting the checkboxes checked 00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:31.960 and I'll be going on temple excursions as a youth 00:29:31.960 --> 00:29:35.200 and then I'll make a mistake and then I'll... 00:29:35.339 --> 00:29:39.400 hurry and repent and go on other temple excursions 00:29:39.400 --> 00:29:42.779 as a youth or what have you and then pretty soon 00:29:42.779 --> 00:29:46.960 my life gets into my 30s and my 40s and my 50s 00:29:46.960 --> 00:29:50.559 and now I'm in the beginning stages of my 60s 00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:53.920 and it's not all that much different, right? 00:29:54.140 --> 00:29:59.480 I still see everything in my life. I hope I can 00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:02.599 explain this right. I still see all of the challenges 00:30:02.599 --> 00:30:09.319 in my life. And they can still have those those 00:30:09.319 --> 00:30:12.500 they can they can still affect me in negative 00:30:12.500 --> 00:30:17.839 ways. For example. If I'm not in tune and if 00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:20.940 I'm not realizing that the effects of the fall 00:30:20.940 --> 00:30:23.039 of Adam and Eve are at work in my life and I 00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:26.799 have an inappropriate feeling or I have a feeling 00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:30.059 of anger or resentment towards somebody else 00:30:30.059 --> 00:30:33.579 or I have a desire to commit a sin or whatever 00:30:33.579 --> 00:30:37.920 the case may be, if I know that I'm fallen, if 00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:42.460 I know that because I'm fallen the devil has 00:30:42.460 --> 00:30:46.619 the ability to bruise my heel, But because of 00:30:46.619 --> 00:30:51.160 enmity, I have power to crush his head. But because 00:30:51.160 --> 00:30:55.380 of all of that, I realize that if I'm feeling 00:30:55.380 --> 00:30:58.079 those things, it's probably part of Heavenly 00:30:58.079 --> 00:31:02.400 Father's plan too. I went a long ways to say 00:31:02.400 --> 00:31:05.160 that, didn't I? But I think it's really important 00:31:05.160 --> 00:31:08.460 for us to push pause every once in a while. And 00:31:08.460 --> 00:31:12.019 especially when we're in that state of temptation 00:31:12.019 --> 00:31:16.269 or or whatever, that feeling guilt that, oh my 00:31:16.269 --> 00:31:18.829 gosh, I had this thought, or oh my gosh, I really 00:31:18.829 --> 00:31:21.190 wanted to do something really mean, or say something, 00:31:21.369 --> 00:31:25.210 or whatever, whatever that temptation is, to 00:31:25.210 --> 00:31:27.450 push pause and go, thank you, Heavenly Father, 00:31:27.450 --> 00:31:30.609 for the fall. Thank you for making me mortal 00:31:30.609 --> 00:31:33.789 so that I can experience these things and know 00:31:33.789 --> 00:31:39.410 for myself that I am fallen and that I truly 00:31:39.410 --> 00:31:44.039 do need. the atonement of Jesus Christ. Just 00:31:44.039 --> 00:31:47.960 like Adam and Eve, when they learned that they 00:31:47.960 --> 00:31:51.200 could be redeemed. I think when we get to that 00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:53.640 space where there's that fallenness that it's 00:31:53.640 --> 00:31:58.000 like, wow, I fell really hard this time. And 00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:00.420 then to just push pause and look up and go, there 00:32:00.420 --> 00:32:04.359 is hope. There's still hope. Even in this big 00:32:04.359 --> 00:32:07.660 dark hole I've just dug. And I just kept digging. 00:32:08.319 --> 00:32:10.779 And I thought, Wow, even the ladder is gone at 00:32:10.779 --> 00:32:13.259 this point. I can't get out of this. What am 00:32:13.259 --> 00:32:18.299 I to do? But what a gift to be able to push pause 00:32:18.299 --> 00:32:21.200 and say literally, thank you Heavenly Father 00:32:21.200 --> 00:32:24.420 for the fall. Thank you for this perfect plan 00:32:24.420 --> 00:32:29.640 that helps me learn, that helps me grow, that 00:32:29.640 --> 00:32:32.799 gives me experience, helps me, that gives me 00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:36.140 freedom to have agency to make those choices. 00:32:36.589 --> 00:32:40.529 and then choose again to follow him. I'm going 00:32:40.529 --> 00:32:44.509 to read another part in this book. I'm still 00:32:44.509 --> 00:32:49.130 in chapter six on page 69. In understanding the 00:32:49.130 --> 00:32:53.490 fall, we must remember who we really are. We 00:32:53.490 --> 00:32:56.589 are divine, literal spirit children of heavenly 00:32:56.589 --> 00:33:01.349 parents. Elder Jeffrey R. Holland taught, because 00:33:01.349 --> 00:33:04.230 this doctrine of the Fall is so basic to the 00:33:04.230 --> 00:33:07.809 plan of salvation and also because it is so susceptible 00:33:07.809 --> 00:33:12.609 to misunderstanding, we must note that these 00:33:12.609 --> 00:33:16.849 references to natural evil empathetically do 00:33:16.849 --> 00:33:20.490 not mean that men and women are inherently evil. 00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:24.880 There is a crucial difference. I love this. As 00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:27.500 spirit sons and daughters of God, all mortal 00:33:27.500 --> 00:33:30.740 men and women are divine in origin and divine 00:33:30.740 --> 00:33:35.039 in their potential destiny. But it is also true 00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:38.859 that as a result of the fall, they are now in 00:33:38.859 --> 00:33:43.200 a natural or fallen world where the devil taketh 00:33:43.200 --> 00:33:46.819 away light. and where some elements of nature, 00:33:47.200 --> 00:33:51.059 including temporal human nature, need discipline, 00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:53.519 restraint, and refinement. We live in a world 00:33:53.519 --> 00:33:57.440 of sin, and no matter how good we desire to be, 00:33:57.720 --> 00:34:01.980 sin enters into each of our lives. It's just 00:34:01.980 --> 00:34:06.119 a fact. Yeah. So if and when it does, how should 00:34:06.119 --> 00:34:09.039 we respond to that, right? Should we see ourselves 00:34:09.039 --> 00:34:16.730 as as broken, as defeated, as trash, as unworthy. 00:34:16.969 --> 00:34:19.250 Well, and it was important for me to know and 00:34:19.250 --> 00:34:21.869 learn that I am not my mistakes. Yeah, that's 00:34:21.869 --> 00:34:25.210 right. That is not my identity. And I think that's, 00:34:25.269 --> 00:34:28.630 like I said when Elder Holland quoted, I mean, 00:34:28.710 --> 00:34:31.650 even before that says, we are divine, literal, 00:34:32.590 --> 00:34:36.119 spirit children. Yeah. of heavenly parents. That's 00:34:36.119 --> 00:34:38.420 who we really are. And that's why it's so important 00:34:38.420 --> 00:34:40.980 that we know who we really are. So that when 00:34:40.980 --> 00:34:43.400 we have these temptations, when we have this 00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:46.239 sin, when we have this coming at us, that we 00:34:46.239 --> 00:34:49.440 don't let it re -identify ourselves. Because 00:34:49.440 --> 00:34:52.579 that's not who we are. I am not my abuse. I am 00:34:52.579 --> 00:34:54.960 not my addiction. I am not my sins. I am not 00:34:54.960 --> 00:34:59.940 my mistakes. I am a literal descendant of the 00:34:59.940 --> 00:35:03.710 divine. heavenly parents who love me, and I love 00:35:03.710 --> 00:35:08.289 them. For me, one of the great things that come 00:35:08.289 --> 00:35:10.829 about by way of the fall of Adam and Eve Dev 00:35:10.829 --> 00:35:15.590 is we wouldn't know our need for the Savior. 00:35:16.710 --> 00:35:20.869 You know, when we talk about recovery, in the 00:35:20.869 --> 00:35:24.409 circles of recovery, we often refer to a great 00:35:24.409 --> 00:35:27.760 gift being the gift of desperation. Right. It 00:35:27.760 --> 00:35:30.519 is a gift to an absolute gift of desperation. 00:35:30.739 --> 00:35:33.559 And that gift of desperation comes to those who 00:35:33.559 --> 00:35:36.780 are dealing with addictions by way of what we 00:35:36.780 --> 00:35:39.619 sometimes refer to as rock bottom. Yeah. You 00:35:39.619 --> 00:35:42.440 know, and that rock bottom is obviously not a 00:35:42.440 --> 00:35:45.699 place. It's a choice. It's a decision. It's not 00:35:45.699 --> 00:35:48.820 necessarily a series of events. And it can look 00:35:48.820 --> 00:35:52.360 and be different for literally everybody. But 00:35:52.360 --> 00:35:55.460 there's a gift in that. There's an absolute gift 00:35:55.460 --> 00:36:00.639 in understanding our nothingness, right? King 00:36:00.639 --> 00:36:04.639 Benjamin teaches us that. To understand our own 00:36:04.639 --> 00:36:10.099 nothingness is key, key, absolutely key to all 00:36:10.099 --> 00:36:13.880 of this working at all. And so, which is kind 00:36:13.880 --> 00:36:17.880 of interesting. One of the great tools that the 00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:23.570 adversary uses is to want us to make to be relevant 00:36:23.570 --> 00:36:28.110 or important. And it can show up differently 00:36:28.110 --> 00:36:32.550 for so many people, right? But when I'm not relevant, 00:36:32.690 --> 00:36:35.730 when I'm not feeling those kinds of things, important 00:36:35.730 --> 00:36:40.849 or seen or heard or whatever like that, I know 00:36:40.849 --> 00:36:44.389 that I'm in need of connection with my savior. 00:36:45.179 --> 00:36:46.940 And if I didn't have the fall of Adam and Eve, 00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:49.460 I wouldn't know that. In fact, Elder Holland, 00:36:49.480 --> 00:36:52.400 I love this. He said, you can't appreciate the 00:36:52.400 --> 00:36:55.940 atonement of Jesus Christ unless you understand 00:36:55.940 --> 00:36:59.239 the fall of Adam and Eve. You can't appreciate 00:36:59.239 --> 00:37:01.340 the atonement if you don't understand the fall. 00:37:02.000 --> 00:37:05.280 And I think part of understanding the fall is 00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.880 knowing that we can't save ourselves. I can't. 00:37:08.039 --> 00:37:11.769 Yes. And yeah, and he can. He can. And we'll 00:37:11.769 --> 00:37:13.469 let him. I think I'll let him. That's the first 00:37:13.469 --> 00:37:17.030 three steps. Well, and also I think about if 00:37:17.030 --> 00:37:20.650 we really... Believed that we could do this all 00:37:20.650 --> 00:37:23.150 on our own think about how many egos we would 00:37:23.150 --> 00:37:26.349 have on you know what I mean I mean, I just well 00:37:26.349 --> 00:37:29.769 now here's here's an acronym is that what it's 00:37:29.769 --> 00:37:32.530 called for ego that has really helped me out 00:37:32.530 --> 00:37:36.230 because out because sometimes I allow my ego 00:37:36.230 --> 00:37:38.190 to get in my way that look what I did and look 00:37:38.190 --> 00:37:40.150 what I've accomplished and look who I helped 00:37:40.150 --> 00:37:43.769 and look who I you know, whatever sure and I 00:37:43.769 --> 00:37:46.769 remember being in a meeting one time and somebody 00:37:46.769 --> 00:37:51.010 saying, you know what ego is? A meeting of? Alcoholics 00:37:51.010 --> 00:37:53.530 Anonymous. Well, it was a 12 -step recovery in 00:37:53.530 --> 00:37:58.730 the LDS. Okay, yeah. Back in the 90s and early 00:37:58.730 --> 00:38:02.889 2000s when I was a very faithful attender. Back 00:38:02.889 --> 00:38:07.889 when you were the OG. Yeah. Anyway, back to ego. 00:38:11.599 --> 00:38:16.380 brought up that ego means edging God out because 00:38:16.380 --> 00:38:18.719 you know what I think I know better and I don't 00:38:18.719 --> 00:38:21.940 need him and I think that's where that humility 00:38:21.940 --> 00:38:25.659 and that brokenness is really such a gift because 00:38:25.659 --> 00:38:29.820 I've said it before and I always show it but 00:38:29.820 --> 00:38:33.619 a broken heart is an open heart and a broken 00:38:33.619 --> 00:38:37.159 human is an open human. I mean, we've got to 00:38:37.159 --> 00:38:39.800 come down here and be battered and bruised and 00:38:39.800 --> 00:38:45.000 torn. Just, I mean, literally, we have to have 00:38:45.000 --> 00:38:49.920 these experiences so that we understand and can 00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:54.559 grow and then realize, oh, we do have a savior 00:38:54.559 --> 00:38:57.159 that saves us. I can't save myself. Nobody else 00:38:57.159 --> 00:38:59.659 can save me, but I know who can. And that's what 00:38:59.659 --> 00:39:01.960 we have to come to understand. Right. That's 00:39:01.960 --> 00:39:05.250 the whole, in my mind, that's the whole purpose 00:39:05.250 --> 00:39:08.309 of the fall of Adam and Eve is so that we will 00:39:08.309 --> 00:39:13.309 understand our complete and utter absolute absolute 00:39:13.309 --> 00:39:17.269 complete and utter dependence on Jesus Christ 00:39:17.269 --> 00:39:20.610 and his power that's made available to us through 00:39:20.610 --> 00:39:24.230 his atonement there's no addiction that can be 00:39:24.230 --> 00:39:27.590 overcome there's no there's no abuse that can 00:39:27.590 --> 00:39:31.349 be dealt with there's no PTSD that can be reconciled 00:39:31.349 --> 00:39:35.030 quite the way that it can through the power of 00:39:35.030 --> 00:39:39.650 Jesus Christ and his atonement. And that's why 00:39:39.650 --> 00:39:43.250 this is so important to me, Deb. For so many 00:39:43.250 --> 00:39:47.269 years, 19 years, I was going back and forth and 00:39:47.269 --> 00:39:51.329 back and forth because I'm fallen and because 00:39:51.329 --> 00:39:55.429 I am quite rebellious, which is also a problem 00:39:55.429 --> 00:39:59.449 because of the fall for me. Some of us just are. 00:39:59.550 --> 00:40:02.230 Our personalities are just that way. We're just. 00:40:02.269 --> 00:40:05.889 because of the fall of Adam and Eve. We have 00:40:05.889 --> 00:40:08.150 certain predispositions. I just believe that. 00:40:08.550 --> 00:40:13.289 But for 19 years, I had a testimony, and I was 00:40:13.289 --> 00:40:15.969 trying to be a good kid and go to church and 00:40:15.969 --> 00:40:17.869 do those kinds of things, but I couldn't quit 00:40:17.869 --> 00:40:19.809 drinking. I couldn't quit doing a whole bunch 00:40:19.809 --> 00:40:23.329 of other things. And I just thought that I was 00:40:23.329 --> 00:40:26.550 broken. that I had gone too far, that there was 00:40:26.550 --> 00:40:30.949 no way that I could because I couldn't get my 00:40:30.949 --> 00:40:33.670 stuff together. I couldn't get the discipline 00:40:33.670 --> 00:40:36.030 I needed. I couldn't, you know, I mean, it talks 00:40:36.030 --> 00:40:38.150 about it. You just read what Elder Anderson said 00:40:38.150 --> 00:40:40.869 about our discipline. Yeah. And because I couldn't 00:40:40.869 --> 00:40:42.690 pull my discipline together and I still hear 00:40:42.690 --> 00:40:44.670 that because I couldn't do that. I was like, 00:40:44.750 --> 00:40:47.880 well, this isn't for me. And it took, you know, 00:40:48.019 --> 00:40:50.940 a couple of membership councils and a whole bunch 00:40:50.940 --> 00:40:53.800 of other things. Today, I'm so grateful that 00:40:53.800 --> 00:40:57.500 I have a different set of eyes to see this through. 00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:01.039 But for those of us who are struggling and beating 00:41:01.039 --> 00:41:03.659 ourselves up and feeling like I'm just never 00:41:03.659 --> 00:41:08.000 gonna get this thing, it's okay. It's okay. We 00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.840 may never totally get this thing, whatever this 00:41:10.840 --> 00:41:14.429 thing is to you, but it's okay. Because what 00:41:14.429 --> 00:41:16.650 we're gonna find out as we go through the next 00:41:16.650 --> 00:41:19.849 few episodes and get well into the podcast here 00:41:19.849 --> 00:41:23.170 at least What we're gonna find out is it's okay 00:41:23.170 --> 00:41:26.210 And there's a process in place for us where we 00:41:26.210 --> 00:41:29.210 can be reconciled Where we can still have peace 00:41:29.210 --> 00:41:32.289 because we've been purchased. We've been redeemed 00:41:32.289 --> 00:41:34.429 through the blood of Jesus Christ And I feel 00:41:34.429 --> 00:41:37.510 like the more experiences we have with though 00:41:37.510 --> 00:41:41.449 with that immortality with the brokenness and 00:41:41.449 --> 00:41:44.929 the hardness. I think it, you know, we have enough 00:41:44.929 --> 00:41:48.670 broken spots on us and we allow the Savior to 00:41:48.670 --> 00:41:51.789 mend. I just think of those shattered vases and 00:41:51.789 --> 00:41:55.110 bowls that people, you know, like literally just 00:41:55.110 --> 00:41:58.469 bust into millions of pieces. And it's not that 00:41:58.469 --> 00:42:03.170 He's changing our hearts. He's giving us a new 00:42:03.170 --> 00:42:07.369 heart. He literally, I mean, repentance is change. 00:42:07.599 --> 00:42:13.760 And he is changing us to who we really are. Because 00:42:13.760 --> 00:42:16.559 we came, we come down here and get beat up a 00:42:16.559 --> 00:42:18.360 little bit. I'm going to read one more quote 00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:24.579 out of the book, page 68. It says, You are now 00:42:24.579 --> 00:42:27.119 here on earth, a glorious son or daughter of 00:42:27.119 --> 00:42:30.119 God. You have entered a mortal world with all 00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:32.900 the deficiencies, temptations, and enticements 00:42:32.900 --> 00:42:35.840 of a secondary existence where Satan and his 00:42:35.840 --> 00:42:38.780 followers are allowed to tempt you, to seduce 00:42:38.780 --> 00:42:41.679 you, and to ensnare you. While you have made 00:42:41.679 --> 00:42:44.860 mistakes, these sins do not describe who you 00:42:44.860 --> 00:42:48.019 are. Your identity is not defined by the sins 00:42:48.019 --> 00:42:51.980 of the world but by the righteousness of another. 00:42:52.199 --> 00:42:55.920 Finding yourself here with the sins of failings 00:42:55.920 --> 00:42:59.119 of the difficult, difficult probationary state, 00:42:59.719 --> 00:43:03.659 your soul cries out for divine help. This is 00:43:03.659 --> 00:43:07.260 our brokenness. This is where we cry out. Deep 00:43:07.260 --> 00:43:11.340 in your soul, you yearn for a redeemer, a savior 00:43:11.340 --> 00:43:14.820 to find your way back to your heavenly home. 00:43:15.360 --> 00:43:20.039 The fall does not define you. It helps refine 00:43:20.039 --> 00:43:23.449 you. And I think it goes back to that sweet little 00:43:23.449 --> 00:43:26.909 story about Jessica being homesick, because that's 00:43:26.909 --> 00:43:30.630 really where we all will end up, is in our heavenly 00:43:30.630 --> 00:43:37.139 home. This is not our permanent home. I think 00:43:37.139 --> 00:43:40.739 next week we can kind of wrap up this part of 00:43:40.739 --> 00:43:42.880 it. We will be talking about this in our institute 00:43:42.880 --> 00:43:45.679 class this week. So this will be a good timing 00:43:45.679 --> 00:43:49.719 for us. But Deb, I think just before we wrap 00:43:49.719 --> 00:43:53.860 up today, this is really important for me. To 00:43:53.860 --> 00:43:58.440 understand the fall of Adam and Eve. is probably 00:43:58.440 --> 00:44:03.219 what really changed everything for me. I think 00:44:03.219 --> 00:44:05.880 I've said this before, I've had a testimony as 00:44:05.880 --> 00:44:09.880 long as I can remember. And how that came about, 00:44:09.940 --> 00:44:12.699 I don't know and I don't care, I had one and 00:44:12.699 --> 00:44:15.909 have had all my life. But conversion didn't come 00:44:15.909 --> 00:44:19.329 for me really. I mean there were bits and pieces 00:44:19.329 --> 00:44:21.409 of conversion and I know that I'm still in the 00:44:21.409 --> 00:44:24.670 process of conversion because conversion literally 00:44:24.670 --> 00:44:27.730 means to change and I'm still trying and making 00:44:27.730 --> 00:44:31.510 effort through Jesus Christ and his sacrifice 00:44:31.510 --> 00:44:35.469 to make those changes. But this is where it changed 00:44:35.469 --> 00:44:38.449 for me. This is where I began to really see myself. 00:44:39.070 --> 00:44:40.829 When I understood the fall it made it easier 00:44:40.829 --> 00:44:45.059 to see myself as a loving as a loved, rather, 00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:47.780 child of heavenly parents, when I understood 00:44:47.780 --> 00:44:50.619 the fall. When I really understood that, you 00:44:50.619 --> 00:44:53.019 know what, Scott, it's okay. You're supposed 00:44:53.019 --> 00:44:55.099 to want to drink, dummy. And the heavenly father's 00:44:55.099 --> 00:44:58.599 not mad at you. He's not surprised. You're supposed 00:44:58.599 --> 00:45:02.320 to want to sin. You're supposed to have, and 00:45:02.320 --> 00:45:05.119 whatever that is. And you're supposed to turn 00:45:05.119 --> 00:45:07.440 to him. And I'm so grateful to know that today. 00:45:07.710 --> 00:45:10.510 to know I'm not broken, to know that when I have 00:45:10.510 --> 00:45:13.110 these feelings and these thoughts and these impressions 00:45:13.110 --> 00:45:16.070 and these inadequacies and on and on and on, 00:45:16.349 --> 00:45:19.750 that it's okay, that it's just a lie. And it 00:45:19.750 --> 00:45:23.489 doesn't define you. No, that's not who I am. 00:45:25.139 --> 00:45:27.960 Well, so, as we wrap it up, like we always do, 00:45:28.000 --> 00:45:30.139 wherever you are, however you're feeling, we 00:45:30.139 --> 00:45:31.940 just hope you know you're welcome to be with 00:45:31.940 --> 00:45:35.059 us. We hope you feel Jesus' love for you. He's 00:45:35.059 --> 00:45:37.760 not waiting for you to clean up everything before 00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:40.340 you come to Him. He just wants you to come to 00:45:40.340 --> 00:45:43.219 Him. Yeah, broken and all. He meets us in the 00:45:43.219 --> 00:45:46.199 middle of our mess. That's where His grace truly 00:45:46.199 --> 00:45:49.780 shines. So come as you are, broken and open, 00:45:50.199 --> 00:45:53.099 hopeful, questioning, searching. You're not alone. 00:45:53.420 --> 00:45:56.460 We'd love that if you'd stay connected with us. 00:45:57.059 --> 00:45:59.900 Appreciate the, we've got many already emails, 00:46:00.320 --> 00:46:03.320 appreciate the words of encouragement and all 00:46:03.320 --> 00:46:06.599 of that. And just continue to ask you to continue 00:46:06.599 --> 00:46:09.219 to do that for us. Also, if you have any questions, 00:46:09.820 --> 00:46:12.900 maybe share an experience with us, a time when... 00:46:13.500 --> 00:46:16.019 understanding your fallenness has been a blessing 00:46:16.019 --> 00:46:20.659 to you, and maybe a question of, hey, my fallenness 00:46:20.659 --> 00:46:22.559 doesn't feel like a blessing, and we can talk 00:46:22.559 --> 00:46:25.280 about that more as well. And if this episode 00:46:25.280 --> 00:46:27.320 touched your heart, we hope you'll share it with 00:46:27.320 --> 00:46:30.500 someone you love, a friend, a family member, 00:46:30.679 --> 00:46:32.880 anyone who could use a little bit more hope right 00:46:32.880 --> 00:46:36.059 now. So next week, we're gonna talk more about 00:46:36.059 --> 00:46:38.760 how the Savior doesn't just redeem us, He heals 00:46:38.760 --> 00:46:41.840 us, He lifts us, He transforms us, and He does 00:46:41.840 --> 00:46:45.769 it in everyday life. That's kind of amazing to 00:46:45.769 --> 00:46:49.869 me. He does it in everyday life, not just in 00:46:49.869 --> 00:46:52.610 our church life, not just in our whatever, but 00:46:52.610 --> 00:46:55.710 in our everyday life. I love that. Thanks for 00:46:55.710 --> 00:46:58.429 being with us, friends. And remember, there's 00:46:58.429 --> 00:47:01.710 always hope through him because you have truly 00:47:01.710 --> 00:47:04.650 been redeemed through his blood. Thanks for being 00:47:04.650 --> 00:47:06.469 with us. See you next time.