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Hey there everybody welcome out to another episode of Redeemed Through His Blood.

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This is Scott Durfey here joined as always by Uncle David Durfey.

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What's up Dave?

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How you doing Scott?

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Still don't have my voice back.

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Well there's a reason for that.

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Dave I don't know I just kind of feel like I need to tell you how much I have enjoyed

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doing this over the last few years.

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That's awesome.

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This has just been an absolute joy.

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I look forward to it every week recording it and putting it out and I really have enjoyed

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our input and feedback and comments that we get both negative and positive from our listeners.

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Just really appreciate it.

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Grateful for you.

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Your path has been a little different than my path and yet here we are together at the

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same point and that's all that really matters but it's great that we have different perspectives

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and experiences and great that you have all the equipment to do it.

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That's a good point.

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I can do it without you.

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So you know really I mean it's a blessing for me as much as it is for you or more to

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be able to do this.

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You know an old crow you know what is the old crow know.

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There's a poem about that Robert J. Matthews used to always share that poem in his later

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years and what the old crow knows is that he doesn't really know anything.

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He has so much.

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Really you say this and now I know what he meant.

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The older I get the more I know the more I know I don't know.

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That's really true Scott.

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So much more I need to learn.

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Been getting some big time glimpses of that my own life over the last several years as

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well that's for sure.

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So I'm really grateful for the last several episodes.

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I think this might be our concluding episode on this maybe a little mini series of why

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I believe and why do I choose to stay.

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You mentioned earlier that you've had a lot of comments.

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You've gotten a lot of emails and I've gotten a lot of comments about how people really

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have enjoyed kind of this format and the way we're doing it.

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You know as a matter of fact Dave last week in Institute it was brought up and it occurred

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to me to say this to them.

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You know if we don't really focus on why do I stay.

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Because you know this is maybe something that maybe for a lot of members of the church especially

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you know those who are a little longer in the tooth in terms of their membership.

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By that I mean those who have been members all their lives and you know have gone through

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all the policy changes and changes in the temple and changes around ministering and changes

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around the time we meet for church and you know and just all organizational changes.

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Oh yeah just all these things no more high priests.

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I remember when we had a 70s group with me you know and that changes procedures just

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changes all the time.

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So many changes.

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But what it occurred to me to say is that if we're not intentional about staying then

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we are by default we're slipping a little.

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We may not be drifting as the word drifting.

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We're just drifting.

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And if we're drifting you know and it's really easy to drift.

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Last episode we talked a little bit about assimilation and how we become a part of a

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culture and by becoming part of that culture we all look alike and we all sound alike and

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we all do alike and all those things which is fine I guess you know.

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But when we talk about that and then we see that you know maybe there's a lot more to

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it than just that.

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Maybe what we've been talking about the relationship with deity and coming more fully to him and

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really beginning to understand him and the true points of doctrine really create an intent

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for us to stay.

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And then by doing that then we're more solid and when I'm more solid in that then my confidence

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waxes strong in the presence of God too Dave.

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Yeah you know it's really I think critical Scott.

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What we've been really trying to say is that instead of looking horizontally we should

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be looking vertically.

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That's what we're really saying.

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Right.

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Instead of looking at what other people are doing around us that's assimilation.

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We should be looking vertically.

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That's redemption.

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Deb my wife and eternal sweetheart is really good at pointing that out to me and to others

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you know there will be times maybe not so much recently but there are times when you

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know I may not be a hundred percent where I need to be and she'll often ask you know

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or even as she's doing her own her own inventory she'll often say I'm just not vertical I just

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need to get my relationships more vertical than horizontal.

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Yeah.

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Yep.

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That's that's I think what we're trying to say here.

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So instead of drifting down the river of complacency sometimes with a paddle sometimes not.

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Yeah.

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Like we're on some sort of an inner tube.

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Yeah.

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And we go wherever the wherever the currents sometimes we're getting paddled wherever the

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currents of culture take us.

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We need to be we really do need to be intentional about we really need to sit down.

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You know everyone every individual should sit down and say why do I choose to stay why

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do I believe why do I believe what do I believe.

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Yeah.

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You know and and really to take some time and and increase their awareness and mindfulness

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and intentions about their beliefs and their faith.

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I know we call it a faith crisis Scott but I I still believe so much of it's a fear crisis

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fear of missing out fear of what are what are what are others.

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Why are others leaving what you know there's a sense of panic.

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Sometimes I feel it in myself I think and I see it in the eyes and then the and I hear

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it in the voices of others you know about did you know so and so left the church.

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Did you know you know on and on and and I think it's a not a faith crisis it's a fear

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crisis and people are afraid well they find out something new about church history and

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they go oh no the church must not be true.

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Did you know that this happened and they've been lying to me about it.

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Yeah exactly and they they go off on this this fear crisis that it might not be true

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because of some church historical event.

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Oh man Scott I can't I can't base my testimony on history.

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I can only base my testimony on doctrine and upon the scriptures and I know history influences

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all that.

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I can't get that but I can't I can't judge history but I know that the Holy Ghost can

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can teach me doctrine and I know what the Holy Ghost feels like and I have been I love

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church history and I have been in historical sacred places and I felt the Holy Ghost verify

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and bear powerful witness that events that happened there that the Prophet Joseph Smith

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and others said happened there that I received a witness that they happened there.

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Then I know that there's been lots of messy problems and events and things happen in the

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church because it's it's a it's a human organization even though it's by divine revelation.

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And I read about a or learn about a leader in the past who has done something questionable

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questionable by who and again I don't want to get into any of this but has done something

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questionable or who has made a mistake or who has this or that.

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It has a quite a different effect on me than I think it does others day because I look

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at it and I'm like thank goodness thank goodness because we have never claimed perfection or

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infallibility among any of our members especially our leaders perhaps you know and so when I

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have read about or seen or learn about things that maybe don't just exactly set real right

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with me I'm I'm almost a little bit grateful because I have created in my life a lot of

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things that just don't set right with people.

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And if God can be with it okay with it with them then I know for sure he can be with me

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too.

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Oh it's throughout the scriptures Scott the prophets throughout the scriptures make mistakes.

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They fail.

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I'm glad they they're not always right on and they're not always right and they're not

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always successful and God teaches them and God leads them but God allows them to make

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mistakes you know when Nephi cries out old wretched man that I am he's not just blowing

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smoke or having a bad day.

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He know he's not.

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He knows that he's wretched and and we all are sometimes I think we just we set up these

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certain ideals and we often talk people off talk about the gap well sometimes that gap

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is is just more imagined than it is even real because some of the ideals and the standards

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we set up are just anyway.

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Yeah.

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So I'm I'm grateful we're talking about this too and we we kind of did an outline right

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we went through Roman numeral number one number two number three and talked about that in

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our past podcast and and there is a Roman numeral number four on this outline of why

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I choose to stay and it's and I just called it true points of doctrine.

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I love that phrase that's a quote from a third Nephi twenty one verse six that there are

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true points of doctrine.

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This is just kind of this is an important but it is to me but it's it's not critical.

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There's doctrine the word doctrine Scott is always positive in the scriptures and it's

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always singular.

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The word doctrines plural doctrines are always negative in the scriptures and I've I've kind

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of noticed that it talks about the doctrines of men and devils but there's only one doctrine

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right and that is the doctrine of Christ in the I just and I love that so when I talk

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about doctrines plural I talk about points of doctrine instead of using the word doctrines

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in plural sense.

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I love I love the way it's described here in a third Nephi twenty one six true points

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of doctrine.

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Well because of the restored gospel of Jesus Christ and the restoration there are so many

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true points of doctrine that are unique and very special to me that I I if I ever went

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away if I ever choose to walk away I would be I think walking away from these points

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of doctrine I don't I don't see how some people say that they can throw away the restoration

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but they can hold on to certain truths that are the result of the restoration.

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I don't know my mind doesn't comprehend that to me and if you walk away if you say if you

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say it's not true then you got to leave that doctrine behind for me I'm not willing I'm

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not willing to leave that doctrine.

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I think I have how many of I listed there two four six eight ten ten different points

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of doctrine and we've talked about most of these throughout the podcast the last few

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podcasts and I don't think I need to reiterate them but let's let's just go through these

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quickly the relationship of the father son and the Holy Ghost it's all about relationships

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and talk a lot about that last podcast the new and everlasting covenant and that there's

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a whole there's a whole thing in the October twenty twenty two and Zine President Nelson

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training General authorities on the new and everlasting covenant everybody should read

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that and that's an ancient covenant and it's a new restored covenant and it's one of my

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favorite parts of the restored gospel is the new and everlasting covenant the salvation

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and protection of children meaning that we believe that children are not not only saved

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if they die before the age of eight but we believe Satan can't even tempt them before

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the age of eight doctrine and covenant section twenty nine so nobody understands the real

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true point of doctrine when it comes to the salvation and protection of little children

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Scott this is one of my favorites because I have you know we have buried three stillborns

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we my wife and I look forward to raising those three little boys in the millennium others

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of our listeners I know a few of emailed me about that who have known that our experience

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because they've had that similar experience or witness and no one else no other church

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no other religious organization knows anything about the death of children or the salvation

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of children that is the result of the restoration of the fullness of the gospel of Jesus Christ

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right I'm not leaving that yeah I know that's true families can be together forever Scott

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I this this this one amazes me if I started another church okay let's say I became possessed

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and and I not that I'd have to be possessed to start another church but if if I just went

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off the deep end and and I started another church you know the first one of the first

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points of doctrine I would set up in my church families can be together forever but nobody

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ever has done that right I don't I don't get that I I know what Matthew twenty two says

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and and why some people scripturally believe that families can't be together forever couples

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can't be together forever and yet wow I am so grateful for that restored doctrine Scott

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that families can be sealed together forever such an important point of doctrine no one

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else believes in the premortal existence you know the it's ex knee hello in in Catholicism

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and Protestant religions they believe in ex knee hello which means God created it out

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of nothing did you ever exist before you were born I think most people believe that but no

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other church teaches it I mean just that point of doctrine the premortal existence Scott

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is I and it's taught in the scriptures throughout the scriptures and nobody else believes it

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so the premortal existence and and who we are our divine identity is as spirit sons and

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daughters of God no one else understands that nobody gets it the fall was part of God's

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plan not just that there was a fall but that it was part of God's plan that he planned

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for there to be a fall and the effects of the fall and the purpose of our mortality

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that's all an important point of doctrine that I I can't leave well I want to talk a

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little bit about the fall that to me that's a real critical one you know it seems to me

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and I we talk a lot about this in our we talk a lot about this in our institute class that

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the Christ atonement is really the offset to all of the effects of fall of the fall

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of Adam and even if that's the case and Heavenly Father knew that the fall actually the fall

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became part of his plans one of the pillars of eternity we know that right and so it helps

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me to understand Dave that if the falls part of his plan then then so was maybe perhaps

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some of the challenges that I've taken on in my life and if that's the case then Heavenly

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Father's not mad at me and that's kind of important to me to understand that that's

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the case so then we move into the atonement of Christ and the details of the events and

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the effects you know nobody I think understands really the effects of the fall or excuse me

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the effects rather of the atonement of Jesus Christ quite like we do either you know we

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understand that that it was because of the through the through Christ's atonement his

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effects can help me strengthen me can help redeem me well that they don't help redeem

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me they do redeem me and they can compensate not just me and this one's a big one for me

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too I pray for the compensation of the spirit in those whom I have harmed who I've offended

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who I've hurt in any way who because of any actions or words that I've said Heavenly Father

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through through the atonement of Jesus Christ can help compensate even them I love that

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and then you know we all have this so this is H we all have the potential all of God's

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children have the potential for exaltation and eternal progression again to be errors

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again nobody understands the the doctrine of eternal progressions God that we can become

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like what kind of a father does not want his children to become like him and you know there

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were a lot of early Christian fathers who believed that and taught that yep in 200 AD

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but that was lost and then now that that is one of the first things anti Mormons love

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to to speak about is how we believe that we can become like our Heavenly Father Scott

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we will never be equal to God it's not about being equal to him he will always be our God

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we will always worship him he will always be our Heavenly Father there will always be

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a hierarchy there and a level of respect and relationship that's not going to change it's

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not about being equal to him that's not what we teach we teach that we can become like

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him that we can progress and that he's progressing I know he's sovereign I know he's all present

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I know he's all knowing I know he's all powerful but he's still progressing we believe in eternal

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progression as his children progresses he progresses and there is anyway I think that

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doctrine has been so misunderstood and an overstated we don't believe we can become like him we

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believe that he is willing to share with us everything that he has but to be like him

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doesn't mean that we will be equal with him number nine divine authority by direct revelation

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that's David O. McKay Thomas S. Monson used to love to quote that that the thing that

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sets our church apart from all other churches this time I can hear Thomas S. Monson's voice

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right now quoting David O. McKay the thing that sets our church apart from all other

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churches is divine authority by direct revelation that's a pretty good general synopsis of of

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of who we are really is that their priesthood keys have been restored by divine messengers

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and that we believe in direct revelation personal and church revelation general revelation and

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prophetic revelation and that we really do need as God has proven over and over again

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right the great scripture in Amos God will do nothing except he reveal it through his

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prophets that we have a need for prophets right that that's how God communicates with

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his children that there's an order and there's a law there about revelation and prophetic

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callings anyway and the last one number ten is the gift of the Holy Ghost in his constant

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companionship which I think we talked about last time those are the four bullet points

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with sub bullet points under all of those and sub bullet points under those of why I

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choose to stay and it's it's caused me to reflect over the years of maybe why do some

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people choose not to stay you know I I have I've wrestled with it I've thought about it

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I don't want to I don't condemn or I can't judge anyone I don't know their circumstances

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I don't know but there is this continuum that seems to me Scott on the low end some

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people just you know we have three parables of Jesus in Luke 15 in Luke 15 there are

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three parables and these three parables are a good place to start because Jesus taught

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them about why people leave and we have the parable of the lost sheep the parable lost

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sheep the sheep just wanders away okay that's that's the low end of the continuum the sheep

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just he he just wanders away he gets distracted he doesn't stay intentional he doesn't stay

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intentional he he doesn't pay attention he's not mindful he drifts away he becomes casual

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in his relationship with the water on some patch of grass yeah over on the other side

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of the hill and the sheep move on and he gets lost that's that's one yeah and then you have

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the lost coins where the woman drops the coins there's a certain relationship to I thought

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I've always thought of the woman as being the church and there's some relationship that's

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got a right between the church and these coins and the choice coins get dropped and they get

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lost they get lost in the cracks they get offended they're offended or they offend or they get

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the they don't they don't fit in there they're not they're not into the culture they're not

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into the and so they they stay away as my grandpa you know my grandpa Taylor he got he got dropped

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I think he dropped himself but he he got dropped and never came back so anyway there's this

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there's this parable about the lost coins and then you have the prayer for a parable

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the protocol who sells out sells his birthright yeah wants to go feed him doesn't want to but

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ends up feeding with the swine ends up feeding with the pigs eating with the pigs which is

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the ultimate ultimate non kosher wicked thing to do is to have pigs for a Jew to be not just

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feeding eating pigs but feeding with the pigs with them anyway but he comes back and all

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of these can't come back we know that all those who leave can't come back in fact Scott

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is my opinion I believe most who leave will come back I mean there's I don't know if people

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pay even pay attention to this but there's lots of articles about so many hundreds I

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read an article the other day describe the title of it was hundreds who have come back

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I believe most of those who leave will come back right but the the other extreme of this

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of this continuum from the lost sheep being on the other lost coins in the middle and

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then the prodigal who wants to go live a life of sin and and bases his his testimony upon

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the standards that he's willing to live and you know ends up not believing or not loving

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his father or wanting a relationship with his father because of the life that he chooses

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to live is in rebellion lives at once to live a life of rebellion that's the other continuum

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and there's everything in between right there's everything in between you know in our in our

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culture today in the church there are so many who I think who leave because they they have

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a loved one who leaves that that that's that's troubling to me I've had I've had a child

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who's not in the you know who's not actively who's not actively in the covenant I have

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I have a child who says he's gay and who has he actually attends church and seems to love

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the church but he there's so many who leave because of their children or their loved ones

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friends or others who leave or who are offended or her who feel like they're they're marginalized

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by the church or they're looked down upon by the church or they're judged by the church

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misjudged by the church I I don't that doesn't change the doctrine that doesn't affect my

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testimony I don't my testimony is not based on the church my testimony is based upon the

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doctrine of the restored gospel of Jesus Christ and I'm not even saying the church is wrong

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or right in any of those instances I'm just saying the policies and procedures and standards

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are not what I base I choose to base my testimony on it's based upon doctrine and anyway so

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I know that there's many reasons why why people leave anyway I've got a I have tried to fairly

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list some of those you know there is an interesting scripture that we should turn to and doctrine

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come in section 50 on this point there's a lot of people who leave the church because

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of hypocrisy I know there's hypocrisy in the church I I see there's hypocrisy in me we're

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all hypocrites yep we all don't live up to our beliefs and and that's why we repent and

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we don't see we see how people live but we don't always see them repent right so there's

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many who leave who leave the church I know because they they feel like the the hypocrisy

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in the church is too great for them and and so they they they live they leave and do their

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own thing but I've always loved this verse in section 50 and let's start with maybe

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verse 5 Scott and read through verse 7 but blessed are they who are faithful and

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and endure whether in life or in death for they shall inherit eternal life no those who

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are faithful and endure right but well unto them that are deceivers and and hypocrites

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for thus sayeth the Lord I will bring them to judgment behold verily I say unto you there

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are hypocrites among you who have deceived some which has given the adversary power but

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behold such shall be reclaimed so many leave the church because of hypocrisy and I always

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think of this scripture when I hear of those individuals who have for whatever walked away

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because they perceive of the hypocrisy in the church which is always going to be there that's

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not change it right long as we got to leshiel beings in the church there's going to be hypocrisy

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as long as I'm in the church there's going to be hypocrisy same we're all we're all we're

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all sinners helping sinners those who leave because of hypocrisy I love this promise shall

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be reclaimed that's the compensatory powers Scott of the atonement of Jesus Christ that's

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the atonement of Jesus Christ has got them covered them we've all been offended we've

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all been hurt we've all been treated unfairly unjustly in the church out of the church it's

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life the atonement of Jesus Christ makes life fair the atonement of Jesus Christ will reclaim

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those who have left who have been unfairly used abused offended or hurt because of the

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hypocrisy in the church I I know that's true so again thank God for the doctrine and our

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understanding of the atonement of Jesus Christ and the mercy and the grace of God and nobody

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believes in mercy and grace more than we do I mean just take the doctrine that we just

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talked about in regards to children it 200 years ago the infant mortality rate was was

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50% 50% of children didn't make it to the age of eight I think it was actually 48 point

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something percent based on the research I read how many of God's children will be in

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heaven based on that point of doctrine well nobody believes in more grace more mercy nobody

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believes that that the redemption is so universal among God's children than we do and even those

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who die who rejected the prophets according to the revelation Joseph F Smith's revelation

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of redemption of the dead in doctrine covenants 138 those who rejected the prophets will be

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taught the gospel and they can repent and Lorenzo snow said that the conditions in the

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spirit world Scott are a thousand times more favorable to receive the gospel of Jesus Christ

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than it is on this earth and that very few would not receive it well a very few are not

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going to receive it and how many again of God's children will be in heaven who believes in

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more grace and mercy than we do no one no one and that's an important point of doctrine

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of the restored gospel of Jesus Christ yeah so there are lots of reasons I know why people

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leave but I just want to testify and be a witness of the mercy and grace of God for

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those individuals then that I think very few of them will not come back in time and eternity

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I know there will be sons of perdition I know that the celestial kingdom will be full of

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of people who want to experience that level of glory and there will be several of God's

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children who choose to go the terrestrial kingdom and they'll be comfortable there and that's

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kind of what it's about right is who do you want to have a relationship with and who are

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you comfortable with that's where that's probably going to determine where you where you go in

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the afterlife is who do you want to have a relationship with so I know that but I I believe

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most of heavenly father's children based upon their premortal existence and and God's plan

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that most of them will end up in the celestial kingdom anyway so there are lots of reasons

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why people leave and there's lots of ways that those individuals will make it back on

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the covenant path and be redeemed and there's always hope everything to hope for now so

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Scott let's let's move on and I just know it's been a while ago a year ago maybe I have

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someone that I love and care about who was who was considering walking away from the

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church that's kind of quote I think from them that they were going to walk away for a while

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and so after having a really sweet wonderful conversation with them and I decided that I

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would come back and to my home and try to put into words my perspective of how I saw the

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gospel of Jesus Christ that might be helpful to them to see the gospel of Jesus Christ

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in a different sort of way I mean they they had frankly gotten caught up into the the

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culture of things and they had some loved ones who had left the church recently who you

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know they they other friends family members who had walked away who had maybe quit quit

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wearing their sacred garments and rejected some anyway they'd they'd left the church really

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not necessarily membership they just had walked away and so they were thinking about walking

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away and I I just really wanted to try hard to say listen this is this is my perspective

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on why I choose to stay and this is why I choose to live the gospel and this is why

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I choose it's all a choice this is why I choose to love the restored gospel of Jesus Christ

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and I ended up being I think 14 different perspectives so let's should we just go through

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the yeah yeah and I don't know if you want to read them Scott well yeah let's just read

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the first part of each one of them and then maybe we can point out anything that seems

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pertinent or important it's all important but maybe pertinent at this time but so the

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first one is is our relationship with Jesus Christ should always take precedence over our

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membership in the church we spent a whole almost an entire podcast last last episode

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talking about that David but are there a couple of points maybe in here that you feel like

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that maybe we should re-emphasize it just depends on your focus yeah what do you choose

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to focus on if you focus on the people and on the culture of the church man it's gonna

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be rough to stay if you choose to focus on Jesus Christ and by the way this is the first

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point and I remember this sweet friend bearing her testimony a few months after this she decided

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not to walk away they did they decided not to walk away and her bearing her testimony

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about how her how her perspective and focus had changed and that she before hadn't really

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seen Jesus in the church and now she couldbook and not see Jesus in the church she saw Jesus

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everywhere in the church she saw Jesus in the people of the church she saw Jesus in

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the ordinances of the church she saw Jesus and the hymns of the church in the prayers

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of the church and the lessons in the activities of the church she saw Jesus everywhere in the

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church so it just depends on your perspective and focus what do you choose to focus on if

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you look for Jesus in the church.

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What do you think you'll find?

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You're definitely gonna find him.

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And so if you're, but if you're focused on the culture

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and on the people.

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What do you think you'll find?

384
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It really depends.

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That's the point.

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It really is.

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Whatever you're looking for, you're gonna find it.

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So that's really the first one.

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That's the first one.

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And we quote that scripture over and over again.

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Look unto me in every thought.

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And we should say, we could tweak that.

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Say look unto me in every church function.

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And everything.

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Everything in the church.

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Look unto me.

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In everything you do.

398
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Yeah, right.

399
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But look unto me, not under the church.

400
00:39:36,260 --> 00:39:38,540
Well, and I love that in that scripture too.

401
00:39:38,540 --> 00:39:40,100
It says, doubt not fear not.

402
00:39:40,100 --> 00:39:44,220
As though, as though actually the anecdote

403
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for doubt and fear is looking unto him.

404
00:39:47,180 --> 00:39:48,220
We're gonna have doubts.

405
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We're gonna have fears.

406
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But when they arise, what should we focus on?

407
00:39:51,700 --> 00:39:52,900
Yeah, exactly.

408
00:39:52,900 --> 00:39:54,380
Right.

409
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All right, so then the second one.

410
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And we've talked about this.

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We've, in fact, I think in the very beginning

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of our podcast each season, at least by episode three,

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we have brought this point up that gratitude

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is the beginning of desire.

415
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I'm gonna read this.

416
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When lacking a desire to live the gospel,

417
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you know, we all go through that wilderness.

418
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Yeah.

419
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I mean, I experienced that.

420
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Yeah, that comes.

421
00:40:21,580 --> 00:40:22,860
That comes up for me some way.

422
00:40:22,860 --> 00:40:25,500
My desires are always gung-ho.

423
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Yeah, yeah.

424
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Always go get them.

425
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Mine are more in line with the natural man sometimes.

426
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My desires wane up and down.

427
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So when lacking a desire to live the gospel

428
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or when our love for the gospel wanes,

429
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my experience has taught me that it is because

430
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of my insufficient gratitude for or understanding

431
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of the restored truths of Jesus Christ,

432
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His atonement and doctrine,

433
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especially taught in the Book of Mormon.

434
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Seeing the hand of God in one's life

435
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strengthens the feeling of the love of God

436
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and for God in one's life.

437
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Gratitude includes acknowledging the gift of God's Son,

438
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the sacrifice of the Father,

439
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and the depth of the suffering of the Son,

440
00:41:17,020 --> 00:41:19,980
which brings a level of humility

441
00:41:19,980 --> 00:41:23,620
that makes worship feel unforced and natural.

442
00:41:23,620 --> 00:41:24,460
Right.

443
00:41:26,140 --> 00:41:29,180
I just, I know that principle is true.

444
00:41:29,180 --> 00:41:34,180
When my desire is not what it should be

445
00:41:34,380 --> 00:41:39,380
to worship, to go participate in the ordinances

446
00:41:39,900 --> 00:41:43,060
of the gospel, to go to church,

447
00:41:43,060 --> 00:41:48,060
or to minister even, or to do other things

448
00:41:48,060 --> 00:41:52,780
that I know are part of living the gospel of Jesus Christ,

449
00:41:52,780 --> 00:41:55,140
when my desire is not what it should be,

450
00:41:55,140 --> 00:41:59,300
I always say, okay, so how can I strengthen my gratitude?

451
00:41:59,300 --> 00:42:02,620
And my gratitude changes my desire.

452
00:42:02,620 --> 00:42:03,580
Right.

453
00:42:03,580 --> 00:42:06,940
And our desires dictate our behaviors.

454
00:42:06,940 --> 00:42:07,780
Yes.

455
00:42:07,780 --> 00:42:10,780
And so, you know, you read this and I highlighted it,

456
00:42:10,780 --> 00:42:13,380
seeing the hand of God in one's life

457
00:42:13,380 --> 00:42:17,060
strengthens the feeling of the love of God

458
00:42:17,060 --> 00:42:19,700
and for God in one's life.

459
00:42:19,700 --> 00:42:23,620
So, I mean, again, it comes down to focus, right?

460
00:42:23,620 --> 00:42:28,060
If I'm looking for the hand of God in my life,

461
00:42:28,060 --> 00:42:29,780
I will surely see it.

462
00:42:29,780 --> 00:42:32,980
But if I'm looking for the lack of the hand of God

463
00:42:32,980 --> 00:42:35,580
in my own life, I can justify that too,

464
00:42:35,580 --> 00:42:37,460
especially with the help of the accuser.

465
00:42:37,460 --> 00:42:38,300
Right.

466
00:42:38,300 --> 00:42:40,340
And so, this is going to, this is a big one,

467
00:42:40,340 --> 00:42:42,180
gratitude is the beginning of desire.

468
00:42:42,180 --> 00:42:45,500
And so, an invitation here is,

469
00:42:45,500 --> 00:42:48,500
maybe this week we focus on where do we see

470
00:42:48,500 --> 00:42:50,460
the hand of God in our lives.

471
00:42:50,460 --> 00:42:54,340
And we begin that habit as we approach doing that.

472
00:42:54,340 --> 00:42:59,340
Then I think that our gratitude definitely will increase.

473
00:42:59,660 --> 00:43:01,740
Our desire will increase.

474
00:43:01,740 --> 00:43:05,300
Our behaviors will become more in alignment.

475
00:43:05,300 --> 00:43:07,700
I think journaling, keeping a journal,

476
00:43:07,700 --> 00:43:08,740
a gratitude journal.

477
00:43:08,740 --> 00:43:10,100
Yeah, gratitude journal.

478
00:43:10,100 --> 00:43:11,780
And those things that we've talked about before

479
00:43:11,780 --> 00:43:15,220
can help to strengthen gratitude.

480
00:43:15,220 --> 00:43:17,740
But even when I don't feel like praying, Scott,

481
00:43:17,740 --> 00:43:20,820
if I just, this is kind of just me,

482
00:43:20,820 --> 00:43:23,900
when I don't feel like praying, my desire

483
00:43:23,900 --> 00:43:26,660
is I just feel like, you know, my,

484
00:43:26,660 --> 00:43:28,980
I mean, President Kimball used to talk about this, right?

485
00:43:28,980 --> 00:43:29,820
Yeah.

486
00:43:29,820 --> 00:43:34,020
The distance between him and God got wider and wider.

487
00:43:34,860 --> 00:43:38,900
You know, he said I would immerse myself in the scriptures

488
00:43:38,900 --> 00:43:41,940
and that gap would be quickly closed.

489
00:43:41,940 --> 00:43:44,220
Well, that's true for me as well.

490
00:43:44,220 --> 00:43:48,660
When I don't feel the spirit or desire of God in my life,

491
00:43:48,660 --> 00:43:52,100
I really love to go to the scriptures.

492
00:43:52,100 --> 00:43:55,580
And I always kneel in prayer.

493
00:43:55,580 --> 00:43:58,380
I think part of that is because of my dad.

494
00:43:58,380 --> 00:43:59,220
Yeah.

495
00:43:59,220 --> 00:44:03,540
And you know, I remember my dad who was so sick at one point

496
00:44:03,540 --> 00:44:08,540
and so, so hurting that I remember saying to him once,

497
00:44:08,540 --> 00:44:12,940
I remember saying to him once, it was just me and Chris

498
00:44:12,940 --> 00:44:17,620
there with him and mom and we, we'd come back from Minnesota.

499
00:44:17,620 --> 00:44:21,300
Then it was in the summertime and then he was really not

500
00:44:21,300 --> 00:44:22,500
doing well.

501
00:44:22,500 --> 00:44:25,700
Then I remember saying to him, dad, let's, let's just,

502
00:44:25,700 --> 00:44:27,540
let's just pray.

503
00:44:27,540 --> 00:44:28,980
Let's just sit here and pray.

504
00:44:29,940 --> 00:44:31,220
Oh, no, David.

505
00:44:32,300 --> 00:44:35,020
No, David, I have to kneel.

506
00:44:35,020 --> 00:44:40,020
I remember helping him to kneel and how painful it was

507
00:44:40,300 --> 00:44:41,820
for him to kneel.

508
00:44:43,060 --> 00:44:47,620
And I think about that often, Scott, thinking,

509
00:44:47,620 --> 00:44:49,420
even when I don't feel like it,

510
00:44:51,500 --> 00:44:56,500
even when it may be painful for me, I want to kneel.

511
00:44:56,820 --> 00:44:59,700
Yeah, I remember having meals at Grandma and Grandpa's house

512
00:44:59,700 --> 00:45:02,780
and even for the meal, breakfast, lunch or dinner,

513
00:45:02,780 --> 00:45:04,300
we knelt in prayer.

514
00:45:04,300 --> 00:45:05,140
You know?

515
00:45:05,140 --> 00:45:05,980
Yeah.

516
00:45:05,980 --> 00:45:10,980
And anyway, it's kind of what I don't feel that desire.

517
00:45:11,140 --> 00:45:15,020
I have disciplined myself to kneel

518
00:45:15,020 --> 00:45:18,660
and it's never happened that I've gotten up off my knees

519
00:45:18,660 --> 00:45:22,060
and didn't feel more gratitude and therefore more desire.

520
00:45:22,060 --> 00:45:23,460
Right.

521
00:45:23,460 --> 00:45:24,300
Interesting.

522
00:45:24,300 --> 00:45:25,140
Yeah.

523
00:45:25,140 --> 00:45:26,340
Number three.

524
00:45:26,340 --> 00:45:28,660
People are more important and have greater worth

525
00:45:28,660 --> 00:45:31,100
than doctrine, practices and commandments.

526
00:45:31,100 --> 00:45:32,180
What do you mean by that, Dave?

527
00:45:32,180 --> 00:45:36,700
Well, there's so many people, I think, in the church

528
00:45:36,700 --> 00:45:41,700
who choose to kind of discard their feelings for people

529
00:45:45,460 --> 00:45:49,700
or look down on people or misjudge people

530
00:45:49,700 --> 00:45:54,700
because of the standards, practices they choose to live.

531
00:45:54,700 --> 00:45:59,700
I know God loves people more than he loves standards.

532
00:46:01,220 --> 00:46:06,220
I know God loves people more than he loves principles.

533
00:46:06,260 --> 00:46:09,300
I know God loves people more than he loves doctrine.

534
00:46:09,300 --> 00:46:12,620
He loves his children more than anything else.

535
00:46:12,620 --> 00:46:15,780
Now, I know that, but some people have not thought

536
00:46:15,780 --> 00:46:20,780
that through and for example, just an example, Scott,

537
00:46:20,780 --> 00:46:25,780
the Atonement of Jesus Christ is for people.

538
00:46:27,460 --> 00:46:31,740
People were not created for the Atonement of Jesus Christ.

539
00:46:33,340 --> 00:46:38,340
It's just love the people and loving the people can affect

540
00:46:40,580 --> 00:46:45,580
not only our level of worship, but our desires

541
00:46:45,580 --> 00:46:50,580
to participate with those people in worship

542
00:46:51,220 --> 00:46:53,060
and in the church.

543
00:46:53,060 --> 00:46:55,580
So I just think it's really important

544
00:46:55,580 --> 00:46:57,140
to have that perspective.

545
00:46:57,140 --> 00:46:59,660
And it helps you, actually, it helps parents

546
00:46:59,660 --> 00:47:00,860
with their children.

547
00:47:00,860 --> 00:47:04,460
I know some parents who have discarded, not not,

548
00:47:04,460 --> 00:47:06,660
that's probably too harsh, but it's like

549
00:47:06,660 --> 00:47:10,860
they've discarded their children because their children

550
00:47:10,860 --> 00:47:14,180
have chosen to leave or not live the standards

551
00:47:14,180 --> 00:47:16,420
or keep the commandments of the church.

552
00:47:16,420 --> 00:47:20,620
And so parents put the standards and the commandments

553
00:47:20,620 --> 00:47:22,940
of the church before their children.

554
00:47:24,300 --> 00:47:27,500
I just, oh my goodness, that's just,

555
00:47:27,500 --> 00:47:31,380
who are we to condemn anybody if Christ can't condemn

556
00:47:31,380 --> 00:47:34,340
a woman caught in the very act of adultery?

557
00:47:34,340 --> 00:47:38,060
Who am I to condemn anybody in my family,

558
00:47:38,060 --> 00:47:41,140
in the church, in the world, anybody?

559
00:47:41,140 --> 00:47:45,500
And I just think it's really unhealthy and dangerous

560
00:47:45,500 --> 00:47:48,660
because when you start discarding people

561
00:47:48,660 --> 00:47:52,900
or choosing to prioritize, starting to prioritize

562
00:47:52,900 --> 00:47:57,900
commandments or principles or doctrine over people,

563
00:47:59,140 --> 00:48:02,860
man, Satan, Satan is going to do a number on you

564
00:48:02,860 --> 00:48:07,460
and pretty soon you're gonna be on the outside looking

565
00:48:07,460 --> 00:48:10,580
because there's nothing, there's nothing, Scott,

566
00:48:10,580 --> 00:48:13,780
that Jesus hated more than self-righteousness

567
00:48:15,540 --> 00:48:17,580
to think that you're better than somebody else.

568
00:48:17,580 --> 00:48:21,620
Because you subscribe to a certain set of principles.

569
00:48:21,620 --> 00:48:24,820
Even if I have the truth, even if I know the doctrine,

570
00:48:24,820 --> 00:48:28,700
I'm not any better than the Buddhist over in China.

571
00:48:28,700 --> 00:48:32,100
You have no idea the conditions of anybody.

572
00:48:33,060 --> 00:48:35,700
We strive, Dave, I think it's a real struggle

573
00:48:35,700 --> 00:48:38,340
even sometimes to have a deep understanding

574
00:48:38,340 --> 00:48:40,380
of my own conditions, right?

575
00:48:40,380 --> 00:48:42,220
I mean, we go to therapy.

576
00:48:42,220 --> 00:48:43,580
You can't judge yourself.

577
00:48:43,580 --> 00:48:46,140
We try to understand and we try to.

578
00:48:46,140 --> 00:48:47,620
I don't think you could judge yourself.

579
00:48:47,620 --> 00:48:48,860
It's really hard.

580
00:48:48,860 --> 00:48:51,700
It's really hard for us to have a deep understanding

581
00:48:51,700 --> 00:48:54,940
of even our own conditions, let alone somebody else's.

582
00:48:54,940 --> 00:48:58,620
Well, just letting judgment go,

583
00:48:58,620 --> 00:49:02,620
judging others and it's this idea that,

584
00:49:02,620 --> 00:49:05,700
you know, our responsibility is to love them.

585
00:49:05,700 --> 00:49:08,060
It's not our responsibility to change them.

586
00:49:08,060 --> 00:49:10,740
It's not our responsibility to fix them.

587
00:49:10,740 --> 00:49:12,300
Just love them.

588
00:49:12,300 --> 00:49:14,100
That's our responsibility when it comes

589
00:49:14,100 --> 00:49:16,100
to our children and others.

590
00:49:16,100 --> 00:49:19,180
And if we would live a life like that,

591
00:49:19,180 --> 00:49:24,180
we would be a whole lot less app to let Satan come in

592
00:49:26,620 --> 00:49:28,820
and destroy our relationship with others.

593
00:49:28,820 --> 00:49:32,660
So, anyway, number four,

594
00:49:33,620 --> 00:49:37,180
God is a God of love and a God of laws.

595
00:49:38,740 --> 00:49:42,980
And I say, I'll just, I'm going to read this one too.

596
00:49:42,980 --> 00:49:45,100
Perfectly balanced.

597
00:49:45,100 --> 00:49:49,860
God is not more, he is not one,

598
00:49:49,860 --> 00:49:52,060
a God of love or a God of laws,

599
00:49:52,060 --> 00:49:53,660
more than he is the other.

600
00:49:54,580 --> 00:49:57,260
Without his love, there would be no laws.

601
00:49:57,260 --> 00:50:01,540
And without his laws, his love would be exploited.

602
00:50:01,540 --> 00:50:04,340
God's laws are founded in love

603
00:50:04,340 --> 00:50:07,820
and his love enforces the law.

604
00:50:07,820 --> 00:50:12,780
All truth is circumscribed into one great whole,

605
00:50:12,780 --> 00:50:17,020
which includes, so just try to picture a circle,

606
00:50:17,020 --> 00:50:19,300
circumscribed into one great whole.

607
00:50:19,300 --> 00:50:22,500
And in half of this circle, you have God's love.

608
00:50:22,500 --> 00:50:24,020
His mercy is grace.

609
00:50:24,020 --> 00:50:25,500
I used to do this with my students.

610
00:50:25,500 --> 00:50:27,460
I used to draw a circle on the board

611
00:50:27,460 --> 00:50:29,420
and I would say this represents truth.

612
00:50:30,500 --> 00:50:33,580
What truths do you love about the gospel of Jesus Christ?

613
00:50:33,580 --> 00:50:38,060
And they would start to yell out grace and mercy and love

614
00:50:38,060 --> 00:50:40,620
and all of these nice things, right?

615
00:50:40,620 --> 00:50:41,740
They would describe these things.

616
00:50:41,740 --> 00:50:44,820
I would purposely write them on the board

617
00:50:44,820 --> 00:50:47,060
on one half of the circle.

618
00:50:47,060 --> 00:50:48,260
And the other half of the circle

619
00:50:48,260 --> 00:50:50,540
would almost always be blank.

620
00:50:50,540 --> 00:50:53,020
And then I would draw a line down this circle

621
00:50:53,020 --> 00:50:55,940
and I would say, okay, you've just described God's love.

622
00:50:55,940 --> 00:50:58,700
That's what you love is God's love.

623
00:50:58,700 --> 00:51:02,180
And that's obvious, it makes sense.

624
00:51:02,180 --> 00:51:04,980
What is it you love about God's laws?

625
00:51:06,860 --> 00:51:08,900
You know, in the other half of the circle,

626
00:51:08,900 --> 00:51:13,300
we'd start to work on order, ordinances, covenants.

627
00:51:13,300 --> 00:51:15,220
Safety. Commandments.

628
00:51:15,220 --> 00:51:17,060
Safety, yeah. Deliverty.

629
00:51:17,060 --> 00:51:18,700
Deliverance.

630
00:51:18,700 --> 00:51:22,660
You know, we could start to, anyway.

631
00:51:22,660 --> 00:51:25,500
So all truth is circumscribed into one great whole,

632
00:51:25,500 --> 00:51:28,980
which includes all the Father's love, mercy and grace,

633
00:51:28,980 --> 00:51:33,860
as well as all his laws, ordinances and commandments.

634
00:51:33,860 --> 00:51:37,260
The heavens love law and order.

635
00:51:38,380 --> 00:51:41,740
Without his laws, there would be confusion,

636
00:51:41,740 --> 00:51:44,700
chaos and no accountability.

637
00:51:44,700 --> 00:51:48,940
Without his love, there would be coercion or neglect.

638
00:51:48,940 --> 00:51:53,500
Unholy manipulation and cold mechanical relationships.

639
00:51:53,500 --> 00:51:57,300
Agency would be destroyed in the absence of either.

640
00:51:58,180 --> 00:52:03,180
In love, he gives us laws and his laws prove his love.

641
00:52:04,780 --> 00:52:09,100
God is love and without law, there is no God.

642
00:52:10,140 --> 00:52:15,140
That's just, what, self descriptive.

643
00:52:15,140 --> 00:52:20,140
Yeah, yeah. I know members, individuals, people,

644
00:52:21,460 --> 00:52:23,980
they wanna focus on his love.

645
00:52:23,980 --> 00:52:28,980
And for some reason neglect or not cherish so much his laws.

646
00:52:29,820 --> 00:52:31,340
I think there comes a point,

647
00:52:31,340 --> 00:52:33,740
and it's kind of come this way for me.

648
00:52:33,740 --> 00:52:36,220
We've talked, I think I mentioned this a few weeks ago

649
00:52:36,220 --> 00:52:38,180
in another episode, I won't get into the details,

650
00:52:38,180 --> 00:52:42,420
but as I have progressed in my relationship with him,

651
00:52:42,420 --> 00:52:46,780
I see his love and his law almost one in the same.

652
00:52:46,780 --> 00:52:50,620
They are, it's like justice, justice and mercy.

653
00:52:50,620 --> 00:52:53,220
Justice and mercy are just two sides of the same coin.

654
00:52:53,220 --> 00:52:55,060
That's what I concluded.

655
00:52:55,060 --> 00:52:56,900
They're just two sides of the same coin.

656
00:52:56,900 --> 00:53:00,260
You should love his justice.

657
00:53:00,260 --> 00:53:02,740
His justice is gonna make things fair.

658
00:53:02,740 --> 00:53:06,700
His mercy is anyway, the great equalizer.

659
00:53:07,940 --> 00:53:08,860
Number five.

660
00:53:08,860 --> 00:53:11,140
Inescapable facts of church history.

661
00:53:11,140 --> 00:53:14,580
False teachings of and negative experiences

662
00:53:14,580 --> 00:53:17,140
with church leaders have little to do

663
00:53:17,140 --> 00:53:20,320
with the determinant factors of real conversion.

664
00:53:21,700 --> 00:53:24,580
Well, we talked about that.

665
00:53:24,580 --> 00:53:26,940
Yeah, I think that speaks for yourself too.

666
00:53:26,940 --> 00:53:31,940
Conversion to the Lord is the bullseye.

667
00:53:32,700 --> 00:53:34,140
Which is different than testimony too.

668
00:53:34,140 --> 00:53:35,700
Not conversion to the church,

669
00:53:35,700 --> 00:53:37,100
which is different than testimony.

670
00:53:37,100 --> 00:53:38,620
Right. Exactly.

671
00:53:38,620 --> 00:53:42,140
It's not so much a testimony that we should seek.

672
00:53:42,140 --> 00:53:46,180
It's more conversion to the Lord that we should seek.

673
00:53:46,180 --> 00:53:47,940
Testimony's important.

674
00:53:47,940 --> 00:53:49,940
That's maybe where you can begin.

675
00:53:49,940 --> 00:53:52,860
That's where we would begin with our non-member friends

676
00:53:52,860 --> 00:53:56,620
is to help them begin to get a testimony.

677
00:53:56,620 --> 00:53:59,420
But ultimately it comes to conversion

678
00:53:59,420 --> 00:54:04,080
to the Lord Jesus Christ and a new way of,

679
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:05,860
not just looking at things,

680
00:54:05,860 --> 00:54:09,140
but a new heart and a change of life.

681
00:54:09,140 --> 00:54:11,820
That's what we should be seeking for and focused on.

682
00:54:11,820 --> 00:54:13,620
Yep. Yep.

683
00:54:13,620 --> 00:54:16,140
Yep. That change that we call conversion.

684
00:54:16,140 --> 00:54:20,580
I think there's an impetus lent to that by testimony.

685
00:54:20,580 --> 00:54:22,260
I don't think that without testimony,

686
00:54:22,260 --> 00:54:23,660
the conversion can come.

687
00:54:23,660 --> 00:54:27,340
But that conversion is really the ultimate goal.

688
00:54:27,340 --> 00:54:29,380
That's really what we're going for

689
00:54:29,380 --> 00:54:32,260
is the change that comes through our testimony

690
00:54:32,260 --> 00:54:33,340
of Jesus Christ.

691
00:54:33,340 --> 00:54:35,020
Absolutely.

692
00:54:35,020 --> 00:54:36,260
All right. Number six.

693
00:54:36,260 --> 00:54:39,420
Patience is required in acknowledging

694
00:54:39,420 --> 00:54:43,820
and positively dealing with, in quotation marks here,

695
00:54:43,820 --> 00:54:44,660
the gap.

696
00:54:44,660 --> 00:54:46,540
What people call the gap, yeah.

697
00:54:46,540 --> 00:54:51,460
The hollow space between the real and the ideal.

698
00:54:52,620 --> 00:54:57,620
All the ambiguities, so many ambiguities in the gospel.

699
00:54:57,820 --> 00:55:00,220
All the ambiguities, uncertainties,

700
00:55:00,220 --> 00:55:03,980
and fall the expectations of our limited understanding

701
00:55:03,980 --> 00:55:06,100
and ability to live the gospel

702
00:55:06,100 --> 00:55:09,460
often cause negative thoughts and feelings.

703
00:55:09,460 --> 00:55:12,020
So when we're always coming up short, right?

704
00:55:12,020 --> 00:55:16,900
When we're always coming up based upon some standard

705
00:55:16,900 --> 00:55:21,980
or sometimes some imagined or false ideal or standard,

706
00:55:21,980 --> 00:55:24,060
we get pretty discouraged.

707
00:55:26,140 --> 00:55:31,140
The accuser kicks in, comes and wants to accuse us

708
00:55:31,140 --> 00:55:36,140
that we are not celestial material,

709
00:55:36,740 --> 00:55:38,500
that we're not good enough,

710
00:55:38,500 --> 00:55:41,660
that we'll never measure up.

711
00:55:41,660 --> 00:55:43,580
That we're broken, that, yeah.

712
00:55:43,580 --> 00:55:48,580
And so the accuser, we give him an opening

713
00:55:49,140 --> 00:55:51,220
and he attacks.

714
00:55:51,220 --> 00:55:52,740
I just think it's really important

715
00:55:52,740 --> 00:55:55,620
that we keep the gospel really simple

716
00:55:55,620 --> 00:56:00,620
and our focus should be on the simplicity of the gospel.

717
00:56:00,620 --> 00:56:03,980
Not so much upon the complexities

718
00:56:03,980 --> 00:56:06,700
of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

719
00:56:06,700 --> 00:56:10,700
And anyway, that's all that needs to be said there.

720
00:56:10,700 --> 00:56:13,140
Okay, here's number seven.

721
00:56:13,140 --> 00:56:14,780
Truth should never be determined

722
00:56:14,780 --> 00:56:18,540
or measured by the standards an individual is willing

723
00:56:18,540 --> 00:56:21,100
or wanting to live.

724
00:56:22,780 --> 00:56:24,980
In other words, we don't make up our own truth.

725
00:56:26,660 --> 00:56:28,780
Based upon the kind of life you wanna live.

726
00:56:28,780 --> 00:56:29,860
Exactly, yeah.

727
00:56:29,860 --> 00:56:34,860
We don't suit our beliefs based on what we want to live

728
00:56:36,060 --> 00:56:37,740
or how we want to live.

729
00:56:37,740 --> 00:56:38,580
Should be much better.

730
00:56:38,580 --> 00:56:40,940
Again, I can't judge anybody and we're all guilty.

731
00:56:40,940 --> 00:56:42,780
Yeah.

732
00:56:42,780 --> 00:56:47,540
But there are just so many who, because of the world,

733
00:56:47,540 --> 00:56:52,540
are influenced that if I can't live that life

734
00:56:52,820 --> 00:56:55,100
and then it must not be true.

735
00:56:55,100 --> 00:57:00,100
Or if I don't want to live those standards,

736
00:57:00,300 --> 00:57:04,300
then I'm going to find ways to disprove it.

737
00:57:04,300 --> 00:57:09,300
And in order to alleviate my guilt,

738
00:57:09,900 --> 00:57:14,900
I think sometimes guilt is the culprit here and shame.

739
00:57:15,700 --> 00:57:16,580
Yeah, shame.

740
00:57:16,580 --> 00:57:19,820
And keeping people out of the church

741
00:57:19,820 --> 00:57:23,060
are really being more intentional

742
00:57:23,060 --> 00:57:25,100
in the conversion process.

743
00:57:25,100 --> 00:57:27,260
And they just finally throw in the towel

744
00:57:27,260 --> 00:57:29,300
and say, this is who I am

745
00:57:29,300 --> 00:57:30,780
and this is the way I'm gonna live.

746
00:57:30,780 --> 00:57:32,580
And the accuser wins.

747
00:57:32,580 --> 00:57:36,780
And therefore their willingness to live,

748
00:57:36,780 --> 00:57:39,140
the gospel of Jesus Christ is the reason why,

749
00:57:39,140 --> 00:57:40,740
or their unwillingness to live,

750
00:57:40,740 --> 00:57:42,260
the gospel of Jesus Christ,

751
00:57:42,260 --> 00:57:44,020
is why they choose not to believe it.

752
00:57:44,020 --> 00:57:45,380
That makes it not true.

753
00:57:45,380 --> 00:57:46,500
Right, right.

754
00:57:46,500 --> 00:57:49,780
So they're a leave to many responsibility.

755
00:57:49,780 --> 00:57:54,780
Yeah, it's a belief or a commitment of convenience.

756
00:57:55,020 --> 00:57:55,860
Yeah, yeah.

757
00:57:56,820 --> 00:57:57,660
Number eight.

758
00:57:57,660 --> 00:58:00,500
Number eight, there is opposition in all things.

759
00:58:00,500 --> 00:58:02,420
And acknowledging the war

760
00:58:02,420 --> 00:58:06,060
and wrestle between right and wrong, good and evil,

761
00:58:06,060 --> 00:58:08,740
light and dark, truth and error.

762
00:58:08,740 --> 00:58:12,420
The Messiah versus the accuser is critical

763
00:58:12,420 --> 00:58:16,860
in not drifting or going with the flow.

764
00:58:16,860 --> 00:58:19,500
There is a war, there is a struggle.

765
00:58:19,500 --> 00:58:21,220
There is sacrifice.

766
00:58:21,220 --> 00:58:22,380
It's hard.

767
00:58:22,380 --> 00:58:26,340
The gospel of Jesus Christ is not easy.

768
00:58:26,340 --> 00:58:28,220
It's not broad.

769
00:58:28,220 --> 00:58:33,220
It's straight, S-T-R-A-I-T.

770
00:58:33,860 --> 00:58:38,860
And it can be tough to live in a world of anything goes.

771
00:58:40,060 --> 00:58:40,900
Right?

772
00:58:42,500 --> 00:58:43,820
And to acknowledge that,

773
00:58:43,820 --> 00:58:46,380
to acknowledge that there's a war and a wrestle,

774
00:58:46,380 --> 00:58:48,180
I think is really important

775
00:58:48,180 --> 00:58:51,780
and to be engaged in that, to call it what it is.

776
00:58:51,780 --> 00:58:56,700
And I think that we need to understand

777
00:58:56,700 --> 00:59:00,300
that there's a difference between absolute truth

778
00:59:00,300 --> 00:59:01,820
and relative truth.

779
00:59:01,820 --> 00:59:05,980
And that that's really the same war that was in heaven

780
00:59:05,980 --> 00:59:08,260
is being reenacted here.

781
00:59:08,260 --> 00:59:10,420
And that war and the premortal existence

782
00:59:10,420 --> 00:59:15,420
before anybody was ever born or the earth was created

783
00:59:15,420 --> 00:59:18,860
was really over that one point.

784
00:59:18,860 --> 00:59:20,940
Relative truth or absolute truth.

785
00:59:20,940 --> 00:59:21,780
Exactly.

786
00:59:21,780 --> 00:59:24,700
And Satan basically said anything goes.

787
00:59:24,700 --> 00:59:25,540
Right.

788
00:59:25,540 --> 00:59:27,900
And I'll save you no matter what.

789
00:59:27,900 --> 00:59:28,740
Exactly.

790
00:59:28,740 --> 00:59:33,740
And that's the only way you can absolutely destroy agency

791
00:59:34,020 --> 00:59:38,340
is to completely eliminate accountability.

792
00:59:38,340 --> 00:59:43,340
And that war continues, Scott.

793
00:59:44,180 --> 00:59:45,340
Yeah, and I agree.

794
00:59:45,340 --> 00:59:46,460
I think it does continue.

795
00:59:46,460 --> 00:59:48,300
I'm not sure that I agree with it.

796
00:59:48,300 --> 00:59:50,540
It's being reenacted as much as I believe

797
00:59:50,540 --> 00:59:52,780
that there's a continuation of the same war.

798
00:59:52,780 --> 00:59:53,620
Yeah.

799
00:59:53,620 --> 00:59:54,460
Yeah.

800
00:59:54,460 --> 00:59:58,540
So I just think it's important to be able to separate

801
00:59:58,540 --> 01:00:03,540
in one's mind that the relative truth and absolute truth.

802
01:00:05,060 --> 01:00:06,140
So here's number nine.

803
01:00:06,140 --> 01:00:08,140
Number nine can be one that gets a little tricky,

804
01:00:08,140 --> 01:00:10,500
but policies, procedures and practices

805
01:00:10,500 --> 01:00:12,500
constantly change in the church.

806
01:00:12,500 --> 01:00:15,060
And there's always exceptions to the policy,

807
01:00:15,060 --> 01:00:18,140
but the official doctrine of the gospel

808
01:00:18,140 --> 01:00:20,940
of Jesus Christ never changes.

809
01:00:22,940 --> 01:00:27,780
Now, for me, now I know what other scholars,

810
01:00:27,780 --> 01:00:30,540
how they define doctrine.

811
01:00:30,540 --> 01:00:35,540
And there's some scholars at BYU who I'll leave unnamed

812
01:00:36,140 --> 01:00:41,140
who want to describe policies and procedures as doctrine.

813
01:00:41,180 --> 01:00:44,980
And they have four different levels of doctrine.

814
01:00:44,980 --> 01:00:48,580
I just personally reject that.

815
01:00:48,580 --> 01:00:51,900
And to me, there's only one doctrine.

816
01:00:51,900 --> 01:00:55,020
And there's not different levels of doctrine.

817
01:00:55,020 --> 01:00:57,780
It's doctrine that I choose to focus on.

818
01:00:57,780 --> 01:01:01,860
And I don't see policies and procedures being doctrine.

819
01:01:01,860 --> 01:01:03,940
They just are what they say they are,

820
01:01:03,940 --> 01:01:05,940
their policies and procedures.

821
01:01:05,940 --> 01:01:08,540
And there are always exceptions to them.

822
01:01:08,540 --> 01:01:11,780
There's no policy or procedure that doesn't have

823
01:01:11,780 --> 01:01:16,380
some rare exception that is made by those

824
01:01:16,380 --> 01:01:18,420
who may be in authority.

825
01:01:18,420 --> 01:01:22,460
And I understand that, but there's no exceptions to doctrine.

826
01:01:22,460 --> 01:01:26,340
And the doctrine is absolute.

827
01:01:26,340 --> 01:01:29,020
That's just, that's my perspective.

828
01:01:29,020 --> 01:01:31,460
That's how I choose to define it.

829
01:01:31,460 --> 01:01:35,620
And it seems to help me to clarify the difference.

830
01:01:35,620 --> 01:01:40,420
And I have no trouble with policies and procedures changing

831
01:01:40,420 --> 01:01:45,420
because I know that they're based upon the world

832
01:01:45,420 --> 01:01:47,060
and the circumstances we live in

833
01:01:47,060 --> 01:01:49,380
and the different cultures and the church

834
01:01:49,380 --> 01:01:51,180
becoming an international church

835
01:01:51,180 --> 01:01:54,660
and trying to prepare the church for the coming

836
01:01:54,660 --> 01:01:56,020
of Jesus Christ.

837
01:01:56,020 --> 01:01:59,900
And there's lots of reasons and really practical ones.

838
01:02:01,100 --> 01:02:03,340
Sometimes complicated ones.

839
01:02:03,340 --> 01:02:06,740
Why policies and procedures need to change, Scott.

840
01:02:06,740 --> 01:02:10,820
But doctrine never changes, God never changes.

841
01:02:12,300 --> 01:02:17,300
Beliefs never change really as far as God's beliefs

842
01:02:17,740 --> 01:02:20,300
and his doctrine is concerned.

843
01:02:20,300 --> 01:02:25,300
So focus on doctrine and not upon policies and procedures.

844
01:02:27,860 --> 01:02:31,580
There used to be a seminary guide on doctrine

845
01:02:31,580 --> 01:02:35,060
and they actually had identified like 10 different

846
01:02:35,060 --> 01:02:37,820
what I would call points of doctrine.

847
01:02:37,820 --> 01:02:42,100
For example, Scott, a doctrine is what you really choose

848
01:02:42,100 --> 01:02:43,580
to believe.

849
01:02:43,580 --> 01:02:47,380
A principle may be how you apply that doctrine.

850
01:02:47,380 --> 01:02:52,380
Procedures and policies may be based upon doctrine

851
01:02:52,580 --> 01:02:54,780
of how you organize something

852
01:02:54,780 --> 01:02:58,140
or how you enact something,

853
01:02:58,140 --> 01:03:03,140
but doctrine never changes and it is bedrock.

854
01:03:03,140 --> 01:03:05,180
That's my focus.

855
01:03:06,100 --> 01:03:10,620
And that sort of a focus helps me to be

856
01:03:10,620 --> 01:03:12,820
a little more solid.

857
01:03:12,820 --> 01:03:13,900
The one needful thing.

858
01:03:13,900 --> 01:03:16,020
When I'm attached to the bedrock.

859
01:03:16,020 --> 01:03:17,180
Yeah, exactly.

860
01:03:18,460 --> 01:03:22,860
Number 10, God loves and blesses all of his children.

861
01:03:22,860 --> 01:03:25,940
Yeah, this is one of my favorites, Scott.

862
01:03:27,820 --> 01:03:32,140
The church has no exclusivity on spirituality

863
01:03:32,140 --> 01:03:36,300
and no monopoly on miracles or answers to prayer

864
01:03:36,300 --> 01:03:38,500
or truth for that matter.

865
01:03:38,500 --> 01:03:41,140
All churches have some truth.

866
01:03:41,140 --> 01:03:43,820
I know we say we're the only living,

867
01:03:43,820 --> 01:03:46,300
only true and living church,

868
01:03:46,300 --> 01:03:48,300
but that doesn't mean we have all truth.

869
01:03:49,260 --> 01:03:51,740
We have no monopoly on that.

870
01:03:51,740 --> 01:03:53,420
Other churches have miracles.

871
01:03:53,420 --> 01:03:55,380
Other churches have answers to prayers.

872
01:03:55,380 --> 01:03:58,940
Other churches are loved by God.

873
01:03:58,940 --> 01:03:59,900
We are,

874
01:03:59,900 --> 01:04:04,900
anyway, I know, Scott, that God loves

875
01:04:05,380 --> 01:04:09,220
and blesses all of his children based upon the light

876
01:04:09,220 --> 01:04:10,860
that they have received.

877
01:04:10,860 --> 01:04:14,980
And not only that, but you just highlighted it in there.

878
01:04:14,980 --> 01:04:16,900
In fact, why don't you just read that?

879
01:04:16,900 --> 01:04:18,900
Yeah, the Atonement of Jesus Christ

880
01:04:18,900 --> 01:04:22,100
is for the entire human family.

881
01:04:22,100 --> 01:04:25,380
His grace, mercy, power and blessings

882
01:04:25,380 --> 01:04:28,380
are available to all who seek to follow Him

883
01:04:28,380 --> 01:04:31,660
or who have never even heard of Him.

884
01:04:32,620 --> 01:04:34,180
Now that's a point of doctrine

885
01:04:34,180 --> 01:04:37,060
that I don't think any other church or religion believes.

886
01:04:38,100 --> 01:04:40,780
That is unique to our church.

887
01:04:40,780 --> 01:04:43,860
That, so there's so many others, right,

888
01:04:43,860 --> 01:04:46,700
who think that if you're not a member of this church,

889
01:04:46,700 --> 01:04:48,380
you're going to hell.

890
01:04:48,380 --> 01:04:50,020
Well, we don't believe that.

891
01:04:50,940 --> 01:04:52,740
We do not believe that.

892
01:04:52,740 --> 01:04:57,260
We know that there's gonna be every opportunity

893
01:04:57,260 --> 01:05:00,740
given to individuals to make and keep covenants

894
01:05:00,740 --> 01:05:04,580
with their heavenly Father before the final judgment.

895
01:05:04,580 --> 01:05:09,380
And that any individual, no matter how bad they've been

896
01:05:09,380 --> 01:05:12,740
or where they've been, that they can come back

897
01:05:12,740 --> 01:05:16,580
and that they can receive the gospel of Jesus Christ.

898
01:05:16,580 --> 01:05:20,380
And we don't condemn anybody for their beliefs

899
01:05:20,380 --> 01:05:22,020
or their religion.

900
01:05:22,020 --> 01:05:23,540
And neither does God.

901
01:05:23,540 --> 01:05:24,420
Right.

902
01:05:24,420 --> 01:05:29,100
I mean, I'm sure there's some occult worshipers out there

903
01:05:29,100 --> 01:05:33,900
and I'm sure God's not pleased,

904
01:05:33,900 --> 01:05:36,700
but even they perhaps have some truth

905
01:05:36,700 --> 01:05:38,100
that there's a devil.

906
01:05:38,100 --> 01:05:38,940
Yeah, that's true.

907
01:05:38,940 --> 01:05:39,940
And that he's real.

908
01:05:39,940 --> 01:05:41,420
Yeah, that's true.

909
01:05:41,420 --> 01:05:42,860
Yeah. And it's good to know that too.

910
01:05:42,860 --> 01:05:44,860
I'm gonna read another part of this

911
01:05:44,860 --> 01:05:47,340
that you've also authored here.

912
01:05:47,340 --> 01:05:51,500
David says, the Atonement of Christ makes life fair.

913
01:05:51,500 --> 01:05:54,460
It covers all iniquities, all inequalities,

914
01:05:54,460 --> 01:05:57,420
the unconditional effects of the compensatory blessings

915
01:05:57,420 --> 01:06:00,860
of his sacrifice cover all of God's children.

916
01:06:00,860 --> 01:06:03,620
And in the end, there will be no individual

917
01:06:03,620 --> 01:06:07,140
who will not receive all the salvation and glory

918
01:06:07,140 --> 01:06:09,740
that he or she desires.

919
01:06:10,780 --> 01:06:15,660
And only the true church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day

920
01:06:15,660 --> 01:06:17,460
Saints teaches that doctrine.

921
01:06:17,460 --> 01:06:18,580
He teaches that doctrine.

922
01:06:18,580 --> 01:06:19,420
Yeah.

923
01:06:19,420 --> 01:06:21,380
I love that.

924
01:06:21,380 --> 01:06:22,860
I know that's true.

925
01:06:22,860 --> 01:06:23,700
Yeah.

926
01:06:23,700 --> 01:06:28,580
Number 11, there is nothing that God and Jesus hate more

927
01:06:28,580 --> 01:06:31,420
than self-righteousness, elitism,

928
01:06:31,420 --> 01:06:34,060
or the condemnation of others.

929
01:06:34,060 --> 01:06:36,380
Okay, and I've kind of highlighted this one

930
01:06:36,380 --> 01:06:38,140
and talked about it already.

931
01:06:38,140 --> 01:06:41,620
You know, being the only true and living church

932
01:06:41,620 --> 01:06:44,660
doesn't make us better than anybody else

933
01:06:44,660 --> 01:06:48,180
and no one is excluded, right?

934
01:06:48,180 --> 01:06:51,980
Come all, he invites all to come unto him.

935
01:06:51,980 --> 01:06:53,980
Second, Ephi 2633, by the way,

936
01:06:53,980 --> 01:06:57,700
I think that's Elder President Oaks' favorite scripture.

937
01:06:57,700 --> 01:07:02,200
Now, no one's condemned, nobody is eliminated.

938
01:07:03,220 --> 01:07:07,940
I know that there's certain things that people have to do

939
01:07:07,940 --> 01:07:09,380
to be in good standing.

940
01:07:10,780 --> 01:07:15,780
But I know that through the Atonement of Jesus Christ,

941
01:07:15,780 --> 01:07:18,700
that no one is exempt.

942
01:07:18,700 --> 01:07:23,700
So self-righteousness is not something

943
01:07:23,700 --> 01:07:26,660
that any of us should ever be a part of.

944
01:07:26,660 --> 01:07:30,060
Number 12, symbolic rituals and ordinances

945
01:07:30,060 --> 01:07:32,500
have eternally been the pattern of worship

946
01:07:32,500 --> 01:07:35,300
sanctioned by our Heavenly Father.

947
01:07:35,300 --> 01:07:37,460
This is just kind of understanding,

948
01:07:37,460 --> 01:07:40,820
which we should be so grateful to the Restoration for,

949
01:07:40,820 --> 01:07:45,140
understanding the ancient way God does things,

950
01:07:45,140 --> 01:07:49,380
that an unchangeable God has always had symbolic rituals

951
01:07:49,380 --> 01:07:53,140
and ordinances for his children to participate in,

952
01:07:53,140 --> 01:07:55,620
to strengthen their relationship with him.

953
01:07:55,620 --> 01:07:58,460
And that the power of godliness is manifest

954
01:07:58,460 --> 01:08:01,300
in the ordinances of the gospel.

955
01:08:01,300 --> 01:08:05,840
And that symbols and rituals are part of the gospel

956
01:08:05,840 --> 01:08:10,100
of Jesus Christ, always has been, always will be.

957
01:08:10,100 --> 01:08:13,540
That this is how God chooses to teach

958
01:08:13,540 --> 01:08:17,060
and to lead his people is through symbols and ritual.

959
01:08:17,060 --> 01:08:19,540
I think some people think that the church

960
01:08:19,540 --> 01:08:21,860
is a little bit too ritualistic,

961
01:08:21,860 --> 01:08:23,420
or that we have too many symbols,

962
01:08:23,420 --> 01:08:26,080
or that why do we have ordinances and covenants?

963
01:08:26,080 --> 01:08:29,580
Well, not understanding that is to not understand

964
01:08:29,580 --> 01:08:31,260
the character of God.

965
01:08:31,260 --> 01:08:34,220
And it goes back all the way to Adam and Eve.

966
01:08:34,220 --> 01:08:37,980
And the Bible and the scriptures bear witness of that.

967
01:08:37,980 --> 01:08:42,980
So I think just understanding God's patterns of worship

968
01:08:42,980 --> 01:08:45,220
that he's set up for his children,

969
01:08:45,220 --> 01:08:47,300
because he loves his children,

970
01:08:47,300 --> 01:08:49,660
is an important perspective to have.

971
01:08:51,380 --> 01:08:52,220
Great.

972
01:08:53,660 --> 01:08:56,860
Number 13, clingers never last.

973
01:08:56,860 --> 01:08:59,740
You just have to hold fast.

974
01:08:59,740 --> 01:09:01,780
Too many people in the church are clingers.

975
01:09:01,780 --> 01:09:03,620
Yeah, explain that.

976
01:09:03,620 --> 01:09:07,900
Second Nephi, yeah, second Nephi chapter eight, Scott.

977
01:09:07,900 --> 01:09:11,460
And there's four groups of people described in second Nephi.

978
01:09:11,460 --> 01:09:12,940
First Nephi or second Nephi?

979
01:09:12,940 --> 01:09:13,780
Did I say second?

980
01:09:13,780 --> 01:09:14,620
Yeah.

981
01:09:14,620 --> 01:09:15,460
First Nephi, sorry.

982
01:09:15,460 --> 01:09:18,140
First Nephi chapter eight,

983
01:09:18,140 --> 01:09:21,500
Lehi describes the four different groups of people

984
01:09:21,500 --> 01:09:25,620
in his amazing dream of the tree of life.

985
01:09:25,620 --> 01:09:28,860
And the one that gets the most attention actually,

986
01:09:28,860 --> 01:09:31,020
is the third group.

987
01:09:31,020 --> 01:09:33,220
And the third group are the ones who take hold

988
01:09:33,220 --> 01:09:36,060
of the iron rod, go through the midst of darkness.

989
01:09:36,060 --> 01:09:37,260
They're clingers.

990
01:09:37,260 --> 01:09:40,100
He says that they are clinging.

991
01:09:40,100 --> 01:09:42,660
Every time the word clinging is used in the scripture,

992
01:09:42,660 --> 01:09:44,220
Scott, I think it's negative.

993
01:09:44,220 --> 01:09:45,660
They are clinging.

994
01:09:45,660 --> 01:09:47,420
Which is different than cleaving.

995
01:09:47,420 --> 01:09:49,420
Yes, yes, that's a sacred word.

996
01:09:49,420 --> 01:09:54,260
And I think that that can get mixed up.

997
01:09:54,260 --> 01:09:55,100
But yeah.

998
01:09:55,100 --> 01:09:56,220
Cleaving is sacred.

999
01:09:56,220 --> 01:09:58,380
Cleave to your husband.

1000
01:09:58,380 --> 01:09:59,220
Cleave to your wife.

1001
01:09:59,220 --> 01:10:01,540
There's six things, I think five or six things

1002
01:10:01,540 --> 01:10:03,460
we've been commanded to cleave to.

1003
01:10:03,460 --> 01:10:05,220
Yes, yes, yes.

1004
01:10:05,220 --> 01:10:06,940
Okay, I'm glad we've talked about that.

1005
01:10:06,940 --> 01:10:08,660
But clingers are negative.

1006
01:10:08,660 --> 01:10:10,780
And these clingers, clinging,

1007
01:10:10,780 --> 01:10:12,940
I don't know what you picture, but I just,

1008
01:10:12,940 --> 01:10:17,140
ugh, you know, white knuckled, gritting their teeth.

1009
01:10:17,140 --> 01:10:19,580
They're clinging, this is so hard.

1010
01:10:19,580 --> 01:10:22,460
And they're clinging and they get to the tree of life.

1011
01:10:22,460 --> 01:10:24,260
And they actually partake of it.

1012
01:10:24,260 --> 01:10:27,860
They actually partake of the Atonement of Jesus Christ

1013
01:10:27,860 --> 01:10:29,780
in some manner or form.

1014
01:10:29,780 --> 01:10:31,500
And then they start looking around.

1015
01:10:31,500 --> 01:10:33,260
Like, you know, no big deal.

1016
01:10:33,260 --> 01:10:34,820
And they start looking around.

1017
01:10:34,820 --> 01:10:37,780
And they notice the great spacious building.

1018
01:10:37,780 --> 01:10:39,540
And they say, well, that looks fun.

1019
01:10:39,540 --> 01:10:40,820
That looks more exciting.

1020
01:10:40,820 --> 01:10:44,940
That looks easier than what I just experienced.

1021
01:10:44,940 --> 01:10:47,940
I think I'll go try that for a while.

1022
01:10:47,940 --> 01:10:51,940
And they get in the building and probably few,

1023
01:10:51,940 --> 01:10:55,740
I don't know, I've said many most will come back

1024
01:10:55,740 --> 01:10:58,180
and I believe that, but some of them get trapped

1025
01:10:58,180 --> 01:11:01,220
in that building and never maybe come out.

1026
01:11:01,220 --> 01:11:02,820
And those are the clingers.

1027
01:11:02,820 --> 01:11:06,060
And those are the clingers. And it's so interesting

1028
01:11:06,060 --> 01:11:08,500
that in describing the fourth group,

1029
01:11:08,500 --> 01:11:11,180
it just simply says that they took hold of the iron rod

1030
01:11:11,180 --> 01:11:12,820
and they held fast.

1031
01:11:12,820 --> 01:11:15,100
And they go to the tree and they partake.

1032
01:11:15,100 --> 01:11:18,420
And instead of looking around and being distracted,

1033
01:11:18,420 --> 01:11:19,940
they fall down.

1034
01:11:19,940 --> 01:11:21,420
Again, in gratitude, Scott.

1035
01:11:21,420 --> 01:11:22,260
And worship.

1036
01:11:22,260 --> 01:11:23,860
Their gratitude, their worship.

1037
01:11:23,860 --> 01:11:26,100
And they fall down.

1038
01:11:26,100 --> 01:11:29,380
They don't pay attention to the great spacious building.

1039
01:11:29,380 --> 01:11:32,940
They fall down in worship and gratitude.

1040
01:11:32,940 --> 01:11:35,380
And they're filled with desire.

1041
01:11:35,380 --> 01:11:37,140
Then they stay.

1042
01:11:37,140 --> 01:11:38,860
That's the difference.

1043
01:11:38,860 --> 01:11:41,820
You don't cling.

1044
01:11:41,820 --> 01:11:43,860
You don't white knuckle it.

1045
01:11:43,860 --> 01:11:46,180
You don't have to grit your teeth.

1046
01:11:46,180 --> 01:11:48,380
Just live the gospel.

1047
01:11:48,380 --> 01:11:49,980
It's simple.

1048
01:11:49,980 --> 01:11:51,700
I know it's not always easy.

1049
01:11:51,700 --> 01:11:53,700
There are sacrifices involved,

1050
01:11:53,700 --> 01:11:56,420
but it should be with joy.

1051
01:11:56,420 --> 01:11:57,260
Right?

1052
01:11:57,260 --> 01:11:58,940
There should be joy involved.

1053
01:11:58,940 --> 01:12:03,300
And it should be fun to live the gospel of Jesus Christ

1054
01:12:03,300 --> 01:12:06,380
with the sacrifices comes blessings.

1055
01:12:06,380 --> 01:12:10,420
And that's what I mean by you just have to hold fast.

1056
01:12:10,420 --> 01:12:12,140
You just have to keep moving.

1057
01:12:12,140 --> 01:12:15,900
Enduring to the end, following through, striving.

1058
01:12:15,900 --> 01:12:18,580
Striving is important word here.

1059
01:12:18,580 --> 01:12:20,500
Keep striving.

1060
01:12:20,500 --> 01:12:23,980
Even though we are so imperfect and we sin

1061
01:12:23,980 --> 01:12:25,980
and we make the same mistakes

1062
01:12:25,980 --> 01:12:30,340
and display the same weaknesses over and over again.

1063
01:12:31,220 --> 01:12:33,380
Just hold fast.

1064
01:12:33,380 --> 01:12:35,500
Keep your feet moving.

1065
01:12:35,500 --> 01:12:40,500
And when you repent daily, fall down,

1066
01:12:41,860 --> 01:12:44,100
feel the love of God.

1067
01:12:44,100 --> 01:12:46,900
Thank him in gratitude and worship him.

1068
01:12:47,860 --> 01:12:49,780
Those are the stairs.

1069
01:12:49,780 --> 01:12:52,540
The clingers don't last.

1070
01:12:52,540 --> 01:12:54,340
You just have to hold fast.

1071
01:12:54,340 --> 01:12:55,500
Right?

1072
01:12:55,500 --> 01:12:56,820
And the last one.

1073
01:12:56,820 --> 01:12:58,820
Focus on primary questions.

1074
01:12:58,820 --> 01:13:01,140
There's a great talk given by,

1075
01:13:02,700 --> 01:13:05,060
let's see, Brother Corbridge.

1076
01:13:05,060 --> 01:13:06,260
Lawrence Corbridge.

1077
01:13:06,260 --> 01:13:07,100
Yeah, yeah.

1078
01:13:07,100 --> 01:13:07,940
BYU speeches.

1079
01:13:07,940 --> 01:13:11,580
BYU speeches that I would recommend everybody look up

1080
01:13:11,580 --> 01:13:12,660
if you haven't read it.

1081
01:13:12,660 --> 01:13:15,260
I would recommend you actually listen to it.

1082
01:13:15,260 --> 01:13:17,740
And then read it and study it.

1083
01:13:17,740 --> 01:13:22,300
But I love Brother Corbridge and the passion

1084
01:13:22,300 --> 01:13:26,260
in which he gives this amazing talk after being

1085
01:13:26,260 --> 01:13:30,980
a general authority who had to review some of the cases

1086
01:13:30,980 --> 01:13:35,100
and individuals who are walking away

1087
01:13:35,100 --> 01:13:40,100
in this whole cultural faith crisis that people talk about.

1088
01:13:41,180 --> 01:13:43,540
And he was on some committee for that.

1089
01:13:43,540 --> 01:13:47,300
And after looking at all the anti-Mormon stuff

1090
01:13:47,300 --> 01:13:50,100
and everything, he kind of came up with his own list

1091
01:13:50,100 --> 01:13:53,100
and his own perspective about why people leave

1092
01:13:53,100 --> 01:13:54,700
and why people choose to stay.

1093
01:13:54,700 --> 01:13:57,540
And I just really recommend this talk to you.

1094
01:13:57,540 --> 01:14:00,820
And in the essence, there's really some great points,

1095
01:14:00,820 --> 01:14:04,820
but in the essence of it is that you have to focus

1096
01:14:04,820 --> 01:14:07,020
on the primary questions.

1097
01:14:07,020 --> 01:14:08,460
Does God live?

1098
01:14:08,460 --> 01:14:10,500
Is Jesus the Christ?

1099
01:14:10,500 --> 01:14:13,220
Now, to me, are they separate and distinct?

1100
01:14:14,140 --> 01:14:15,740
Is the Holy Ghost real?

1101
01:14:15,740 --> 01:14:16,980
Can I receive?

1102
01:14:16,980 --> 01:14:19,300
How can I receive revelation?

1103
01:14:19,300 --> 01:14:21,980
Did Joseph Smith see the father and the son?

1104
01:14:21,980 --> 01:14:24,420
Is the Book of Mormon the Word of God?

1105
01:14:24,420 --> 01:14:26,180
There, do we have a living pro...

1106
01:14:26,180 --> 01:14:28,220
These are the primary questions.

1107
01:14:28,220 --> 01:14:32,020
The secondary questions is, well, who decided,

1108
01:14:32,020 --> 01:14:36,020
who made the decisions about the Mount Meadow Massacre?

1109
01:14:36,020 --> 01:14:38,740
What's this polygamy all about?

1110
01:14:38,740 --> 01:14:40,180
What's plural marriage all about?

1111
01:14:40,180 --> 01:14:42,420
Oh, what about gay marriage?

1112
01:14:42,420 --> 01:14:43,380
What about that?

1113
01:14:43,380 --> 01:14:47,060
What about the priesthood and who can have the priest

1114
01:14:47,060 --> 01:14:48,340
and who can't have the priest?

1115
01:14:48,340 --> 01:14:50,180
Those are all secondary questions.

1116
01:14:51,460 --> 01:14:55,340
Focus on the primary questions.

1117
01:14:55,340 --> 01:14:58,500
I'm not saying the secondary questions aren't important.

1118
01:14:58,500 --> 01:15:00,140
They're certainly interesting.

1119
01:15:00,140 --> 01:15:01,780
I love studying them too.

1120
01:15:02,700 --> 01:15:06,160
And I have my own thoughts and feelings about them,

1121
01:15:06,160 --> 01:15:11,160
but conversion and testimony and what really matters

1122
01:15:13,020 --> 01:15:17,060
are discovered and enjoyed by focusing

1123
01:15:17,060 --> 01:15:19,180
on the primary questions.

1124
01:15:19,180 --> 01:15:20,740
Right, right.

1125
01:15:21,700 --> 01:15:26,100
Well, that brings us to a conclusion of our points

1126
01:15:26,100 --> 01:15:28,700
of perspective that you've given us today.

1127
01:15:28,700 --> 01:15:31,340
Dave, thank you so much for doing that.

1128
01:15:31,340 --> 01:15:33,860
We're just trying to empower.

1129
01:15:33,860 --> 01:15:37,500
We hope to give all of us the empowerment

1130
01:15:37,500 --> 01:15:40,820
that we need to have that relationship with him

1131
01:15:40,820 --> 01:15:43,860
so that these things can be alive and well in our lives

1132
01:15:43,860 --> 01:15:45,340
and that we can be benefited

1133
01:15:45,340 --> 01:15:48,020
and receive the grace and blessing that he is intended

1134
01:15:48,020 --> 01:15:51,860
for us to receive in our own individual lives as well.

1135
01:15:51,860 --> 01:15:54,460
We hope that you share this with others.

1136
01:15:54,460 --> 01:15:58,380
We hope that this hope springs eternal within you.

1137
01:15:58,380 --> 01:16:01,460
And most importantly, we hope that you understand

1138
01:16:01,460 --> 01:16:04,860
and have a deep and ever abiding relationship

1139
01:16:04,860 --> 01:16:08,300
with our Heavenly Father, his son and the Holy Ghost.

1140
01:16:08,300 --> 01:16:12,940
That's really all our question is by doing all of this.

1141
01:16:12,940 --> 01:16:14,700
Hey, thanks so much for being with us today.

1142
01:16:14,700 --> 01:16:17,220
We look forward to being with you again next week.

1143
01:16:17,220 --> 01:16:18,580
And until then, be well.

1144
01:16:18,580 --> 01:16:45,260
Thank you.