Hey there everybody and welcome out to another episode of Redeemed Through His Blood Scott
Durfey here.
Joined as always by David Durfey.
How are you Dave?
I'm good.
How many New Year's resolutions have you broken already?
Well, I haven't actually taken a detailed inventory but I'm sure there are more than
one.
I'm not even sure I said anything anymore.
Yeah, we talked about that.
I kind of like to review my life and review the past year and you know, I don't, I think
goals are important but I don't know, New Year's resolutions are not one of my favorite
things.
Typically that's how I am too but this year it just so happened that there were some things
in my life that had just gotten to the point where it's like, you know what Scott, you
need to tighten some stuff up, you need to do some things different.
So it just happened to coincide with the New Year and I was grateful for that because January
first came and I had a definitive start date and so far.
Awesome.
So far so good.
I recently read President Ballard talking about goals are the end and you know, I think
you need a plan to reach the goals and you know, he was so great on that we miss him,
don't we?
Yeah, yeah.
We're going to miss President Ballard.
Yeah.
Well, that was an important, you know what, I kind of have a business affinity.
I mean guys that are businessmen and he was a great businessman, you know, that's my background
in it.
Yeah, I just love the things that he said, not just about the church but about business
and stuff too.
Great mind.
They all do.
Great, great mind.
Well, Dave, last week we wrapped up the second event of the Atomative, no, the third event
of the Atomative Jesus Christ in that we talked about the cross and Christ's suffering on
the cross.
Today we're going to move beyond that and talk about the resurrection.
Yeah, let's read, let's just quickly review those, you know, four events.
We're going to finish up the events maybe today and then the next few podcasts after
that we'll talk about the effects.
So the events and the effects of the Atomative Jesus Christ where we're at right now.
But there were four basic events that make up what we call the Atonement.
The Sinless Life, Gethsemane, the Cross, and today we'll speak about in more detail number
four, His death and resurrection.
And I think I may have read this, but I want to just maybe reiterate it, Scott, what Elder
Talmadge, Elder Mcconkey, and our dear prophet, President Nelson, have all taught and it all
started, I think, with Jesus the Christ written by Elder Talmadge on page 661 of Jesus the
Christ, Elder Talmadge says, speaking about the cross.
On the cross it seems that in addition to the fearful suffering, incident to crucifixion,
the agony of Gethsemane had recurred, intensified, intensified beyond human power to endure.
In the bitterest hour, the dying Christ was alone, alone in most terrible reality, that
the supreme sacrifice of the Son might be consummated in all its fullness.
The Father seems to have withdrawn the support of His immediate presence, leaving to the
Savior of man the glory of complete victory over the forces of sin and death, which are
the two monsters or negative effects of the false, sin and death.
And it's the cross where all of the Atonement of Jesus Christ, or at least at least the
suffering for our sins was consummated.
It started in Gethsemane.
It was consummated on the cross.
It was Gethsemane intensified, that's the word Elder Conkey uses as well as Elder Talmadge.
And here's our living prophet just a few years ago in October of 2018, he says, speaking
about the Atonement.
In the Garden of Gethsemane, our Savior took upon Himself every pain, every sin, all the
anguish and suffering ever experienced by you and me, and by everyone who has ever lived
or will ever live.
Under the weight of that excruciating burden, He bled from every pore.
All of this suffering was intensified as He was crucified on Calvary's cross.
So again, the idea, Gethsemane recurred intensified.
All of this suffering was intensified on the cross.
I just hope that our listeners can think of the cross a little differently and get beyond
what we put negative connotations sometimes on.
And when we see the cross, we should actually think about Gethsemane intensified.
That's what we should think about when we see the cross.
And we should think about the Atonement or at least the suffering part of the Atonement
has been consummated on the cross.
This is where He finally said at 3 p.m. on Good Friday 2000, almost 2000 years ago.
When He said it is finished, it was started in Gethsemane.
It was finished on the cross.
I just can't overstate really how important the cross is.
And I know we read the scriptures about Jesus Himself preferring when He speaks of the Atonement.
He prefers to speak about the events on the cross.
So I think we are ready to move on to the fourth event of the Atonement of Jesus, which
is His death and resurrection.
I am grateful though that we have spent the amount of time that we have focusing on the
cross.
This is, as you have mentioned, one of those things that in our culture has been something
that maybe we have de-emphasized, I guess I could say in the past.
But I know that when Deb and I, a couple of years ago, went to a French church on, and
I think I have talked about this actually on Palm Sunday, Lutheran church, and they
had crosses and they actually had the palms.
My friend Ray, his daughters, made little crosses out of those palms for us.
They just have such a deep reverence.
I also got to witness one time, actually I didn't witness it, but he has told me about
how they have this cross on Easter.
One of the things that the membership of that congregation do on Easter is they will approach
the cross and they will pound nails in it themselves, just to think about the suffering
that took place there for them.
And Ray tells me, he says, you know, Scotty says, that's one of the most poignant experiences
we have in our churches, in their congregation.
It's not a church-letting, but in their congregation where they do that.
And I have come to have that great reverence as well for those things, Dave.
Well, I think it's really sweet what other churches do.
And I know it's sincere and I know they have faith in Jesus Christ.
But they also have kind of, I think their focus may be more upon the nails and the crucifix
and then it is upon the spiritual, emotional, mental anguish, really the spiritual suffering
that occurred there because they certainly don't really understand what happened in Gethsemane.
And they don't understand.
I've said this before, but Richard Ma, who was the president of the largest Protestant
seminary in America, came to our institute and spoke to us there at UVU, Utah Valley
University.
And we read with him in our faculty meeting before he spoke to our students.
We had a faculty meeting with him.
And we read to Alma 7 that Jesus not only suffered, you know, I asked him a question.
I said, seems like to me, Brother Ma, Dr. Ma, that one of the differences between your
faith and our faith, your theology and our theology is that you believe in a limited
atonement that is the I in the acronym Tulip or the L, the L in the acronym for Tulip, which
is based upon the beliefs of Calvinists that you believe in a limited atonement and we
believe in an infinite atonement, which is summarized, I think, in Alma 7.
And he says, I, Brother Murphy, I know what Alma 7 is.
And he actually had a he said, I have a copy of Book of Mormon.
And I love those verses in Alma 7.
And he says, I hope someday that we can believe them.
He says, I don't believe that right now, but I hope that someday we can believe that.
I love your concept of an infinite atonement, but they don't they don't really understand
that Jesus not only suffered for the sins of his disciples and those who choose to follow
him or even maybe as a Calvinist, those who are predestined to be saved.
That's who they believe Jesus died for is for those who are predestined to be saved.
But as Latter Day Saints got, thank God for the restoration and the Book of Mormon, we
know that Jesus suffered for all the world that not just for all the sins of all the
world, but for all of the sicknesses, all of the suffering, all of the adversity of all
the world.
As sweet as those Easter and crucifixion traditions are in other churches, they have
such a small really understanding of what Jesus really did on the cross.
We should be so grateful and willing to share with the rest of the world, you know, what
what really happened on the cross.
Anyway, 3 p.m.
It's it is finished.
The suffering is over.
And Jesus just simply whispers and I'm grateful it was recorded by John.
It is finished and he yielded up the ghost and he died 3 p.m.
on Friday afternoon.
He's been on the cross for nine hours.
So they have to hurry and bury him because their Sabbath begins at sundown on Friday
and thankful for Joseph of Armitia who offers his his tomb and and they hurry and bury
him and give him a proper Jewish burial and he lies in the tomb.
Beginning Friday before the sun goes down on Friday.
So he's in the tomb for part of Friday all of Saturday and we know by early Sunday morning
that he comes forth out of the tomb and is resurrected and the first mortal that he chooses
to appear to is Mary.
Maybe we should just say something again because because the restoration Scott we were just
so blessed to know something about what he did in that 36 hours that we talk about being
dead for three days but he wasn't dead for 72 hours.
He was dead for about half of that on three different days.
I mean he was dead on Friday all day Saturday and part of Sunday.
But it wasn't three full days.
It was probably like one and a half days in in the at least as you track time and hours.
But no one else knows what he was really doing during that time and we do.
And it's just one of the great revelations that I'm grateful has been canonized in the
doctrine come in section 138 of the doctrine comments and Joseph F Smith and the dream
or vision that he had concerning Christ's visit to the spirit world.
I'm I know that Pete you know he told the thief today that shall be with me in paradise
and there's all kinds of commentaries about that and what that meant and I've re listened
some of those recently and they just don't really know what happened there, Scott. In fact,
even the best of the clergy, the most informed and educated,
they don't really know what happens in the space between death and the resurrection.
We do because of the Book of Mormon. Alma talks about it in Alma chapter 40. And then we have the
teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith and what he teaches us about the spirit world and
the works that's being done in the world of spirits, preaching of the gospel and
the revelations on baptism for the dead and the letters that he wrote in Doctrine and Covenants
section 124, section 128. Anyway, we have so so much more information on that space between death
and the resurrection. One of the great clergy's of our time really. I have so so much respect for
is J.T. Wright or Tom. Tom Wright. He's a great writer. I think he's written something like 70
books and Christian theology was a Anglican bishop and but he's I think back to teaching
theology in St. Andrews, by the way, Scott. That's why it's another reason why I love him so much
because he's in St. Andrews in Scotland. Did you look him up when you were there? And I wanted
to wanted to run into him at the ice cream shop, but he never showed up. Why the ice cream shop?
Because I hung out there a lot. Oh, I see. Okay. Wasn't on the golf course. I was at the ice cream
shop. Okay. Anyway, I just have so much respect for him and people can check him out on on YouTube
or whatever. He has a great faith and he he's a believer for sure. And I would love to
talk to him more sometime and when I see him in the spirit world, I'll say, well, now you know,
because, you know, he openly confesses that, you know, we really don't know about life after death
before life after the resurrection. He calls it life after life after life that we have life and
then he says, I believe we have life when we die, but we don't know anything about that.
And then we have life after the resurrection. So he calls it life after life after life.
And I'm just going, wow, who am I? I'm nobody. I'm nobody. And and I know more about what happens
in the spirit world and after death than the greatest theologians that have ever lived on the
earth just because I'm a member of the restored church of Jesus Christ. So I don't know. What should
we say about life after this life in that space of time between death and the resurrection?
Well, that's a great opportunity for those to hear the gospel. And you know, and the cool thing about
that, that one of the wonderful things about that time between when Jesus was crucified and before
he was resurrected is that we know that he was taking the gospel to those who had passed before.
And while he was there as recorded in Peter and other places, but they just don't understand it.
Right. Well, I mean, with the clarity that the restoration has provided, we can eat more easily
see those things written by Peter and so forth. Right. But you know, what a neat thing because
you know, I know you know, there are a lot of us of our ancestry and there are a lot still to date
that will benefit from the teaching that goes on in the spirit world and Christ started that.
In the spirit world, you know, because Peter talks about that he went to preach to the spirits
that are dead and and how does it read in in first Peter, you know, 3 18? How does that read?
Scott, I mean, the Bible gives us some understanding, thankfully, because I think that some of these
verses in the Bible are what led Joseph Smith to inquire more about it, including the scripture
in 1 Corinthians 15 29. You know, what else shall they do that are baptized for the dead? If the
dead night rise not at all, why should they be baptized for the dead? I mean, Paul uses that
as evidence that there has to be a resurrection. If we're doing work for the dead, if we're
baptizing for the dead and there were no resurrection, then why would we be baptizing for
the dead? I know that that's a simple explanation of how we understand it. But other clergy and
theologians get so lost in that. Yeah, well, Paul thought it was a simple explanation to
yeah, I mean, he wasn't saying, hey, guys, I want you to believe we need to convince you to believe
in life after death. That was a foregone conclusion. Apparently, yeah, the problem here was resurrection.
So he was saying, why are you baptizing them? If you don't even believe they're going to rise
from the dead? It wasn't about whether they're living after they're dead. It was if they're
going to rise from the dead, it was a resurrection issue. Anyway, but others don't don't comprehend
that. So I'm grateful for the few verses that we do have that's been preserved in the in the Holy
Bible. So this is 1 Peter 3 starting in verse 18. For Christ also hath once suffered for sins,
the just for the unjust that he might bring us to God being put to death in the flesh,
but quickened by the spirit by which he also went and preached into the spirits in prison,
which sometimes were disobedient when once the long suffering of God waited in the days of Noah,
while the Ark was preparing. Wherein, few that is eight souls were saved by water.
Well, again, most other religions don't really know what that what that means. And there's
all kinds of different conjecture and commentary on that passage of Scripture. And I'm just so
thankful that Peter felt impressed to record that and the effect that that had on living
latter day prophets, Prophet Joseph Smith inquired about it. I know that that that's the passage
that allowed Joseph F Smith, he was reading that loud Joseph F Smith to have his dream or vision
about redemption for the dead. And this idea of redemption for the dead is completely unique to
to to our beliefs. And I'm just so grateful that we have that understanding, Scott, and that
that's not a whole a black hole that we don't know what happened in during that space when Jesus
died until the time he was resurrected. And if people want to know more about that, they need
to go to doctrine, come and read section 138. And we invite you to do that. And and then what does
he say in his first Peter four, six, I just remember that from my missionary discussions
50 years ago for for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead,
that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
So again, Peter gives us some idea, some glimpse of what Jesus was doing
when he was dead and yet alive as a spirit in the spirit world before his resurrection.
So he ordained missionaries and missionaries went and began to preach to the spirits who were
in prison and in the holy temples, we do vicarious work for those individuals. And
that's that's a sacred holy works, Scott, that I have just really been transforming really for me
as I've been engaged in more depth being in the temple, 10 hours, 10 hours a week. And
for those that don't know, I mean, those ordinances, David has been recently within the last two or
three months been right. Yeah, I guess I was really set apart in April, but didn't really start.
Okay, okay. Well, for the last several months, I guess time flies, but has been serving in the
temple. The Saratoga Springs Temple as a sealer. And I, you know, Scott, it's so sweet and I feel
the presence of God, angels and witnesses, a term that we use in the temple. And I feel the
presence of those angels. And I tell the people that we do the work for that in order for these
individuals to exercise their agency, what to whether to choose whether to receive these ordinances
or not, they must witness it. I don't know if they witness it live, or if it's recorded somewhere
that they can witness it when they're when they're better prepared. But they will. They either do
or they will witness it. And that is really a sacred holy work. And I feel that I feel the power
of that performing those ordinances. And sometimes it has been confirmed by the Holy Spirit of
individuals rejoicing, receiving those ordinances in the temple. And anyway, it's just a really
sacred holy work. And again, I said this too many times, but I guess you can't say it too many times.
How grateful I am for the restoration and the fullness of the gospel of Jesus Christ
that we know what Jesus did and the importance of his mission, which he accomplished in the spirit
world in the some 36 to 40 hours that he would have been in the spirit world after he died.
Anything more we should say about that that period of time?
I think that we've probably said enough, I think that it's important that we do express gratitude.
I know you have. I am now too about that opportunity because, you know, there are just those that
will pass that don't quite have what they need and to know that those things that are taught,
that Jesus taught there are still being taught there now, so that those ordinances can be
in their behalf here. I think that's just a great thing for us to know. So I think it's good for
us now that we can just go ahead and move into the resurrection.
Okay, well, while you were talking, another verse came into my mind. So
you know, this should be probably read at every funeral. This is in Alma chapter 40.
In Alma chapter 40, Alma had inquired, he's talking to Corianton, his wayward son.
Then he's talking to his Corianton and he's telling Corianton, hey, you need to know that there's
life after death. I think that's really important. Maybe we don't talk about it enough with our
families, our children, our grandchildren. There's life after death. And there's a time,
there's a space between the time of death and the resurrection. He talks about that openly
to his wayward son Corianton. Thankfully, it's been recorded in Alma chapter 40,
really beginning with verse nine. Therefore, there is a time appointed on demand that they
shall rise from the dead. And there is a space between the time of death and the resurrection.
And now concerning the space of time, what becomeeth of the souls of men is the thing which I have
inquired diligently of the Lord to know. And this is the thing of which I do know.
So, wow, here we go. We get a glimpse of a prophet who's inquired about the space
of time between death and the resurrection. And he gets an answer, verse 10. And when the time
cometh, when all shall rise, then shall they know that God knoweth all the times which are
appointed unto men. Some great theology in that verse. Verse 11, now concerning the state of the
soul between death and the resurrection, behold, it has been made known unto me by an angel,
that the spirits of all men, as soon as they are departed from this mortal body,
yea, the spirits of all men, whether they be good or evil, are taken home to that God who gave them
life. And then shall it come to pass that the spirits of those who are righteous are received
into a state of happiness, which is called paradise, a state of rest, a state of peace,
where they shall rest from all their troubles and from all care and sorrow. And then shall it come
to pass that the spirits of the wicked, yea, who are evil, for behold, they have no part or portion
of the spirit of the Lord, for behold, they chose evil works rather than good, therefore the spirit
of the devil, they enter into them and take possession of their house, and these shall be
cast out into outer darkness. It's kind of black and white in the scripture, Scott, it's kind of
salvation or damnation in the Book of Mormon, their understanding of the plan, the way they teach it.
And but it says that I've heard, again, prophets and great teachers like Brother Matthews teach
when it says they are taken home to that God who gave them life does not mean that they enter
back into his presence when they die, but they are taken to a place where God again is present.
I mean, God is present with us, God is present there that they are taken to a place where
where God can appear where he can reside or where he can be with them, but it's not the
place we would think of as heaven where resurrected beings dwell in the presence of God.
So they're taken to a place that we call the spirit world and we don't know how that's all
organized over there. We've had a few saints like Jedediah Grant. I love his description
of the spirit world. He died and came back to life and Jedediah Grant gives a rather detailed
description of the world of spirits, the colors and the organization and some of the plant life and
the things that he witnessed in the spirit world, which was fantastic. And anyway, he gives
something of a description of that in the Journal of Discourses, Volume 4. I can't remember what
pages. And anyway, we've had others, you know, and some of these are apocryphal and I don't
necessarily give them any, a lot of credibility about people who have died and come back to life.
I believe that can happen. I certainly don't doubt that. I've seen the movies and read some of the
books and certainly believe that's possible and believe that there's parts of that that actually
may be, may be true, but I don't know. I just believe it at that, I guess. But we know,
we know there is a spirit world. We know that and we know that that there is an organization there.
And we know that people are being taught there and they're being prepared there and there the plan
continues to be fulfilled there all through their their time about Christ and redemption and
the plan of salvation and exaltation and anyway, I just think it's thrilling that
that we know 99.9% more about what happens between the space of death and the resurrection
than anyone else. Another precious part of the restoration. Well, or sometime early in the morning
on on a first day of the week, which is why we celebrate Sunday on the first day of the week,
which is our new Sabbath. The Jewish Sabbath was on Friday night to Saturday night, but it became
the first day of the week when Jesus was resurrected on the first day of the week Sunday.
Sometimes early, he appears to marry and we have four gospel writers and the Apostle Paul over and
over again who bear testimony of the resurrection of Jesus Christ and it's interesting to compare
each of the gospel writers and the points of doctrine that they choose to kind of focus on
and the events really the events of it. The point of all of it is it's it would be an interesting
comparison, I think for our listeners to make that they can go to the chronology gospel harmony
and look at the chronologies and all the events that occur during the resurrection. But
I think Acts chapter one, Scott, let's let's go to chapter one of acts. Luke is writing this. This is
Luke. Some people think he may have been one of the two on the road to Emmaus since he's the only
one who who shares that experience, which is so important as a two individuals are eyewitnesses
of the resurrection of Jesus Christ who eat with him. I just I want to point out that the gospel
writers all make the point that he was physically resurrected. This is another point that there's
so much confusion in the Christian world about Scott. I mean some Christian Gnostics who believe
that that the body is actually evil and that that all led to the Nicene Creed. I mean the Greeks
and their Gnosticism and their whole thing about the physicality or bodies are evil and we can't
have a God who has a body. It all led to the Nicene Creed, which which is why they believe God
still doesn't have a body and that who knows what he did with his body. I think really in
their pure belief they don't believe he was ever resurrected with a body and that maybe somebody
really did steal his body or maybe the Christians even stole his body and hit it but that he was
resurrected in some other strange spiritual form where he could do things. But anyway the point is
we believe we know that he has a body of flesh and bone. That's the revelation and we have many
witnesses of that and and they are there are many witnesses of that in the Bible Scott that he
appeared to 500 at once. Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians but in in chapter one of Acts he
talks about the infallible the infallible proofs. It's in the first few verses I think Scott. So
let's start with verse three. You want to read? Yeah so Acts chapter one verse three. Yeah so
he's talking about Jesus here right. He's writing to Theophilus and he says to again referring to
Jesus to whom he also showed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs being seen
of them 40 days and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God. 40 days. Yeah
infallible proofs many infallible proofs of the physical those are my words physical resurrection
of the Lord Jesus Christ. We have so many witnesses. We we know that Mary I know it's
recorded in John when Jesus says touch me not but in the Joseph Smith translation it says hold me
not that Mary was holding Jesus. That there was a physical body there for her to hold and she
she held him and he says hold me not I'm not yet ascended and he he's got to go see his father
even it's that's so significant to me that he chooses to see Mary before he sees his father
but he he he goes to his father after Mary has held him and then he Luke records that he eats
he eats fish and honeycomb for a spirit hath not flesh and bones as you see me have in Luke 24 we
have I mean it's just it just seems to me and and I know this is through the through the lens or the
the prism the the the the glasses that I see the resurrection is through the the doctrine of the
restoration it's so obvious that he has a physical body Scott any ministers with him for 40 days
anyway I we have so much physical evidence of his physical bodily resurrection in the Bible
and even more so in the Book of Mormon and maybe we can turn to some of those and I mean it gets
pretty pretty specific in the Book of Mormon we we have Paul talks about the resurrection right
in fact oh let's do this before we turn to the Book of Mormon Scott I want to read 1st Corinthians 15
let's just talk about how the resurrection itself is kind of the keystone of Christianity I know we
talk about the Book of Mormon be the keystone of our religion meaning the you know the restoration
but really when it comes to Christianity the resurrection has been called the keystone
of Christianity and here's why because in 1st Corinthians chapter 15 this amazing
letter written to the people of Corinth and Paul's trying to bear his witness of the bodily
resurrection of Jesus and he he talks about in verse 6 after that he was seen of above 500
brethren at once I mean there must have been some priesthood meeting up in Galilee where he appeared
to 500 brethren at once I don't know what we don't know have any more detail about that
but he goes on and he says if there be no resurrection verse 13 Scott verse 13 and 14 if
you want to read those verse 13 but if there is no resurrection of the dead then Christ
then is Christ not risen and if Christ is not risen then is our preaching vain and your faith
is also vain okay now go down to 16 and 17 for if the dead rise not at all then is not Christ
raised and if Christ is not raised your faith is in vain ye are yet in your sins if Christ
hasn't been resurrected you're still in your sins then what the heck are we doing yeah our faiths
in vain yeah if he's not resurrected if he's not alive then what it's we're just wasting our time
we're just chasing a myth I mean it all comes down to this Scott it all comes down to Jesus Christ
him crucified and resurrected if he's not resurrected then it's it's just all in vain
according to Paul and then Paul bears a powerful testimony I think in verses 20 through 22 Scott
you want to read those or even 23 yeah but now is Christ risen from the dead and become the first
fruits of them that slept for since by man came death by man also the resurrection of the dead
for as an atom all die even so in Christ shall all be made alive but every man in his own order
that's verse 23 but every man in his own order Christ the first fruits afterward they that are
Christ at his coming so there's an order to the resurrection Scott this is the first
kind of place in the scriptures where we we see that there's kind of an order and that it's important
I think to understand that order and we kind of have a unique phrase in the church of Jesus
Christ of Latter-day Saints where we talk about the morning of the first resurrection
and I'd like to try to explain that a little bit the order of the resurrection but before we do
that let's still try to make the case and give the evidence of the bodily resurrection of Jesus
Scott so in I think we have well all the prophets in the Book of Mormon bear testimony of the
resurrection divinity of Jesus Christ and that he would come back from the dead and and live again
and take his rightful place at the right hand of the father so all the prophets bear testimony of
that but I think the favorite most detailed examples of witnesses and the teachings of the
resurrection are contained in in 2nd Nephi chapter 9 Jacob's unbelievable inspired sweet
discourse on the resurrection that if it weren't for the resurrection we'd all become
sons and daughters of Satan you know that if it weren't for the resurrection and we didn't get our
bodies back there's something about the body Scott that gives us power over Satan and we all we know
we in the in the gospel of Jesus Christ that in fact all Christians I think understand this that
Satan doesn't have a body and that was his great punishment that he wouldn't have a body then he
and he won't get a body and that because we do have a body and that we will be resurrected with a
body that we it gives us some power over Satan you know that's in 2nd Nephi chapter 9 Jacob's
discourse versus like 8 and 9 right Scott yes 7 8 9 we've read those I think before but others can
check those out if it weren't for the resurrection if we weren't resurrected we'd all become sons of
of the devil how does it say it well yeah and in verse 7 it actually talks about why it needs to
be an infinite atonement right in other words touching everybody all of us let me just read it
7 through 9 of 2nd Nephi 9 wherefore it must needs to be an infinite atonement save it should be an
infinite atonement this corruption not could not put on incorruption wherefore the first judgment
which came upon man must have needs to remained in an endless duration and if so this flesh here it
is and if so this flesh must have laid down to rot into crumble to its mother earth to rise no more
in verse 8 all the wisdom of God his mercy and grace for behold if the flesh should rise no
more our spirits must become subject to the angel who fell from before the presence of the eternal
God and became the devil to rise no more and our spirits must have become like unto him and we become
devils angels to a devil to be shut out from the presence of our God and to remain with the father
of lies in misery likened to himself yay to that being who beguiled our first parents who
transformeth himself nigh unto an angel of light and stirrth up the children of men
unto secret combinations of murder and all manner of secret works of darkness
angels to the devil yeah yeah in word for bodily resurrection in verse 8 it says all the wisdom of
God his mercy and grace and then there's an exclamation point again you know I think that you
know there's there's a heavenly father just putting that exclamation point on guys get how
important this is this is important well that's one of the great jacob's one of the really great
theologians and gives us quite a doctrinal discourse on the resurrection in second efi 9 and
it talks about how everyone will be resurrected the merciful plan of God and will all die and will
all be resurrected that's another point that I think all other Christian churches are confused
about and disagreeing on Scott is they did they they're not really sure if everyone's going to
be resurrected or not I mean many just outright do not believe that we know that everyone including
everyone including sons of perdition will be resurrected not only all people will be resurrected
but all animals will be resurrected we believe that everything that is alive that has a spirit
will be resurrected Scott to a physical bodily form and that could include
could include insects and and plants and everything else I don't know all of that but
we know that anything that had a spirit and anything that lived on this earth because of Jesus Christ
he covers them too I mean when we talk about the infinite tome and I usually say it covers
all mankind well it includes the animal kingdom not just all that all of the dogs that you've
loved and horses all the horses that you've had to put down and yeah all of that Scott is
all of that's covered by the resurrection I just think that's really a really special
precious priceless doctrine yeah yeah I agree and you know I often fantasize of that you know
just a couple of years ago and you know this isn't the point of the podcast but there is
comfort even in our those things that may seem trite to the rest of the world you know but there
is comfort in the through the atonement of Jesus Christ in that I had to put one of my favorite
horses down just a few years ago and I still I still am sad about it yeah you know I I still
grieve that what was his name his name is real real yeah he was an Arabian um gelding that uh we
raised from a baby and he got colic and we had to put him down he just about 15 was 15 years old
beautiful gray white Arabian gelding yeah but anyway those those things those things add comfort
and I think this is one of the things there you know when we talk about the atonement of Jesus
Christ and how through the atonement and you know the resurrection is one of the events right so
let's not forget that it's you know I think sometimes we we just mistakenly when we hear the
atonement of Jesus Christ we just think about how that applies to sin that's not what we're
talking about we're talking about it it's in its completion right in the entirety of the
atonement of Jesus Christ and I think that there's that and so many other little tender
mercies that can come to us when we become aware and aligned with the teachings and the spirit
behind the atonement of Jesus Christ and and that's one of those for me for sure yeah I I agree
uh it's a little sad uh Scott to me um seems like the older you get the more funerals you go to
yeah there's a reason for that yeah I do and the more funerals I go to I'm I'm more aware
that uh oftentimes people talk about individuals going back to the presence of God and then that
they've been you know saved by God or redeemed by God or that the you know all of that but they
never use the word resurrection yeah and I and I think somebody needs to I I in fact I love the
tradition of the Anglican church they have a tradition of their saints when they have a
an Anglican funeral um they will repeat as they're taking the body into the sanctuary
they'll repeat uh John uh I am the resurrection and the life and and they'll they'll they'll kind of
do a a cantation on that verse over and over again as they're I just think it's so important
that we use the word resurrection and that as Latter-day Saints when we use it we're thinking of a
bodily resurrection and it's literal and that people will come forth out of the grave um
I have my sweet son-in-law lost his father recently and his his dad has had his challenges
throughout his life even though he was raised in the church he's been a little bit on and off and
decided that he wanted to be cremated I don't know if he decided that or his wife decided that who's
convert to the church and I that's fine that's fine I know I know I know he'll be resurrected
but if you believe in a bodily resurrection I I'm not sure why one would choose cremation
um and we don't have time for this today maybe another time but the Prophet Joseph Smith taught
in teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith volume compiled by Joseph Fielding Smith that there's
a fundamental principle of everybody's body I think what he was really describing the Prophet
Joseph Smith was DNA and one's DNA will be preserved I don't think you can completely destroy DNA
you know you can get it off a what a cup that you drink or you can get it off of so many things
right there are DNA and then everyone has a unique DNA I mean this is kind of the what this I don't
know what scientists I'm not a scientist but I think what Joseph Smith was was really describing
was an individual's unique DNA and everyone has that and God that's how the resurrection will
will occur is is that the regeneration uh recreation of DNA I mean Scott the resurrection is
just think about that miracle for a minute I mean I know we we see the creation as a miracle
think about the creation of animals and all the life on the earth and Adam and Eve right and we
see that as an amazing miracle and then once God has created the earth and Adam and Eve are created
then they biologically reproduce and animals reproduce and we kind of we see we see that as
a miracle too right and it is so it's a profound sacred miracle but can you imagine the miracle
of the resurrection people coming forth out of the grave yeah I I maybe this is one reason why
people don't believe it is because it's too hard for them to believe it goes way beyond anything
that they've caught they could comprehend but there's going to be a physical resurrection
a body and this is so I was talking about Jacob is one witness Abedadai he talks about the resurrection
in detail he talks about the first resurrection gives us the idea that there's a certain order
and there's a first resurrection if there's a first resurrection there's a second resurrection
John calls it the resurrection of the just and the unjust in John chapter five and and so we kind of
have this order and Abedadai talks about that in mosaic chapter 15 16 then we have Abedadai's
great witness of the resurrection which no doubt he has learned from Alma the younger and they're
in their discussions as missionary companions listen listen to what he says here
this the spirit in the body this is the resurrection the spirit in the body shall be
reunited again in its perfect form limb and joint shall be restored to its proper frame
even as we now are at this time and we shall be brought to stand before God knowing even as we
know now and have a bright recollection of all our guilt now this restoration shall come to all
both old and young bond and free male and female both the wicked and the righteous and even
there shall not so much as a hair of their heads be lost but everything shall be restored to its
perfect frame as it as it is now or in the body and shall be brought and be arraigned before the
bar of Christ the Son of God the Father and the Holy Spirit well what's the reference on that one
more time that's Alma chapter 11 43 and 44 I mean it can't get more plain or simple than that
or definitive than that we believe in a bodily resurrection both limb joint hair of your head
everything will be made perfect yeah as it as it is now in perfect form
yeah anyway and then and then we have Alma himself bearing testimony the resurrection in Alma chapter
40 and it goes on through the Book of Mormon I think the greatest evidence of a bodily physical
resurrection especially of Jesus Christ is 3rd Nephi chapter 11 right he appears to 2500 people
and they feel they feel the Prince they thrust their hand into his eye they they feel the physical
body of Jesus Christ that is important to him that they they become eyewitnesses of his physical
resurrection and I believe that we'll have that same that same opportunity Scott so
so thankful so thankful for the restoration of the fullness of the gospel of Christ
that we believe in the literal resurrection bodily physical resurrection of Jesus Christ
that the soul of man is the spirit reunited with the body and that we will all be resurrected
all mankind all living things will be restored in its perfect form or frame
we'll talk more about the judgment what comes after the resurrection and
probably in the next podcast Scott we will talk let's talk about the order of the resurrection
the first resurrection morning and evening of the term which is unique to I think our theology
and second resurrection morning and evening of the second resurrection so we'll talk maybe more
about that next week as we go through this week our invitation will be for us to start to contemplate
and just wonder and even search the scriptures make it a prayerful meditation perhaps but why
is this important for me why you know we've talked about you know in a general sense why these things
are important but why are these things important to you individually and we will have individual
reasons that why these tender mercies why these instruments of grace why this other pillar of
the atonement of Jesus Christ is so important to us as well as the other ones you know it's easy I
think for me to contemplate Gethsemane it's even easier for me sometimes to contemplate the cross
than maybe the resurrection but let's think about that we'll talk about it again more next week
but then in the meantime between now and then let's think about that especially and again as I say
every week as we particularly the sacrament maybe we consider the things that we've talked about today
why they're so important to us and how they should apply in our lives thanks everybody for being
with us we look forward to being with you again next week and until then be well