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Welcome to the finale of Doing It For Ourselves,
Black Women, Salon, and the Science of Health
Equity. I'm Nyesha Frey here with Dr. Shanita
Randolph and Dr. Reagan Johnson as we reflect
on what we've learned, what's next, and how each
of us can advance health justice. Let's dive
in and do it for ourselves. You never know where
you're at and how you may be influencing the
next generation or how you might be feeding into
strategies to advance health equity. And as Reagan
has shared, health justice, building toward health.
justice by just saying, hey, I see you, sister.
Come on over here. I got plenty of people. And
I am an opinion leader, right? They don't listen
to me. Just all you got to do is let your arm
hang there so she can put herself on the press
a couple times. She ain't asking for nothing
else. Just come on now. And that helped you get
to where you are. All right, Shanita, lean in.
Why beauty salons and barbershops? They're definitely
trusted spaces, as Ray said. It's definitely
not a new concept, right? You think about Dr.
Loretta Germont and her work as a nurse scientist
around engaging barbershops in her work as well.
There are others. It has just historically been
that space for communities to have safe conversations.
And so it's a natural space. When we think about
the sustainability of it, it's a natural space.
I think one thing that we have been very specific
about, though, why barbershops and beauty salons
and engaging them in ways that are sustainable,
because although it has been a space, you know,
as we were talking earlier, is it sustainable?
Right. Because they're entrepreneurs now. Much
as they love the community, they are about their
money. Yes. Oh, we can't. We're not asking them
to be interventionist in this study. Right. It's
giving them the tools to do what they already
do. You know, when we think about even our stylists
and barbers who have partnered with us, giving
them a great big shout out and a thank you to
them. We love and appreciate them so very much.
They're doing stuff in their communities. Like
they're not just curling and cutting hair. You
know, I think about Tamika Hughes, who's one
of our partners. She has a nonprofit that she
started, Level Up Parenting. where she is really
trying to be that resource for single parents
is how it started, because that was her lived
experience. She was a single mom. And so how
does she give back? She has started Level Up
Parents and Jean Blackman, who has started establishing
safe cultures. So these are barbers and stylists
are just so engaged in the health and well -being
of their communities naturally. So it's just
an amazing space to really partner with them.
That's awesome. I love it. We're going to get
into how can stylists, salons, and community
members get involved with Up News? Yes. So they
can definitely reach out to upnews at duke .edu.
That's how they can email us and contact us to
get engaged. We are engaging. Six counties across
the state of North Carolina. Let me see if I
can do these without missing one. Durham County,
Guilford County, Forsyth County, Mecklenburg
County, Cumberland County, Wake. I did it. And
Wake County. So right now we are recruiting in
the Cumberland County and Wake County areas.
And so if there are beauty salons or stylists
and owners that you know that are interested,
they can reach out to updos at duke .edu to let
us know that they're interested in being a part
and we can share more information. We're willing
to come have lunch with you, send you information,
have a Zoom call to just let you know what those
steps would look like. And so they can definitely
contact us. I like to say as well that we're
partners in creating. a platform for Black women
because it is a gap. And so really how I'm seeing
this is that you're more than a research participant.
You're really a partner in creating what Black
women need for their health or not need. And
I think this has given us an opportunity to see
how effective Updo would be and will be. And
what are some of the gaps and things that we
need to consider as limitations in order to fix
that? And so we're just asking for the community
to partner with us in those efforts. Yeah. And
I think you can also reach out to us on our website
or follow us at our website, the heat lab, H
-E -E -A -T lab dot org backslash updos. Yes.
And just so everybody is clear, it's U -P -D
-O. Right. So not do like your, like your bill
is due. D -U -E. Not that. Not that. Like you're
going out for the night. Going out. You looking
cute. U -P -D -O -S. Okay. So, and remember there's
two E's in heat. One for equity, one for engagement,
then the A for advocacy, and then that T for
trust. So that's heat. H -E -E -A -T. All right.
And so that's a dot org. What is that backslash
or forward slash? It's a slash. It's one of them
slashes. Right. You'll figure it out when it
don't go through. Try the other side. OK, so.
So so I'm so excited because, you know, by the
time that this comes up, we're going to be. Moving
through Cumberland, we're going to be advancing
into Wake. We're going to be looking toward Durham
and Forsyth and then Mecklenburg. So if y 'all
are there and you are what we like to call high
volume, well -established salons in those counties,
hit us up, updues at duke .edu. So before we
go, and as we start to wrap up, I love to talk
about one. Let's think about what are our future
plans. And then also how, well, let's talk about
this. Let's take it one at a time. So now that
we know how people can get involved, what are
your long -term goals for updos? And what does
success look like? I'll start with you, Shanita,
with what are the long -term goals? And then
Reagan. be on standby for what does success look
like? Yeah. The long -term goal is that updos
will be an evidence -based intervention that
can be accessible for nonprofits, other organizations
doing health promotion around HIV, and just the
lay community to have access to. That it is one
that is, again, in our scientific world, it has
been proven to be effective. That is the long
-term goal. As a researcher, what we realize
is that, you know, we're not going to make it
be something that is not, right? And so if our
results show that there are opportunities for
growth in certain areas, our goal then will be
to address those limitations. So one way or another,
we're going to learn if it works. And if we learn
that there's some things that are not quite working,
we're going to move forward with making those
improvements. The bottom line is that we are
here for the community and making sure that Black
women know what options are available so that
they can maintain and preserve their sexual health
in whatever way that looks like for them. And
so I love that. Reagan, what does success look
like? I mean, maybe I said it, maybe not. Give
me your idea on what does success look like?
Yeah, I think both of those things, what you
and Shanita said, right? I think we could also
kind of, if we were looking to measure success,
I think our states with the top 10 states or
cities that's always highest in HIV, those specifically
reproducing updos in some shape, form, or fashion.
I think women understanding their choice, like
if we could get to all black women across the
south at least understanding that they have a
choice in hiv prevention i think that would give
us some success and then um i think success looks
like freedom freedom to choose choose their method
like you can choose prep you can choose other
things but just understanding that you have that
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going. Yeah, and one thing that we haven't talked
about that I think is really important when we're
thinking about Black women and HIV prevention
is that we don't have to depend on someone else
to tell us their status. right, for us to be
safe. And I think that's the big part of doing
it for ourselves, right, is if we're scared to
ask the question, if we're not trusting the answer,
if we're depending on that other person to be
honest with us and that doesn't really work out,
we have other means and measures to protect ourselves
and not have to be dependent on someone else.
Because there's lots of reasons why people don't
tell. Some of those reasons can be assessed as
good and some of those reasons can be assessed
as bad. But the point is, is that whether you're
a person that's living with HIV, there's treatment.
If you're a person that does not have HIV, there's
effective prevention. And so moving the needle
on awareness. Of those things, especially for
Black women, being able to prevent transmission
of HIV is very, very important. And so I love
what you said about freedom. This is also a type
of freedom is not being dependent. Right. And
so we want people to talk. You know, we want
people to share. We want people to be truthful
and honest. But the data shows that's not what's
happening. So as much as we want that to happen.
We have to provide and innovate other solutions
and strategies. And fortunately, medicine, technology,
science, research has provided PrEP, which is
how effective is PrEP in preventing transmission?
Up to 99%. Up to 99 % effective. So in other
words, if you are a person who is having a sexual
relationship with another person. who does have
HIV, whether you know it or not, if you're having
a sexual relationship with them and you're not
using condoms and you're taking PrEP, the science
says that it's 99 % effective in preventing you
from contracting HIV from that person. That's
powerful. That's huge. It cannot be understated.
And so one of the things that we want to do is
not give away all of our, you know, secret sauce
of our research, right? But we definitely want
to make the point about why this research, why
this approach is so innovative, so powerful,
and why we want people to be involved and why
we are inviting more funders to support this
work, right? More collaborative partners of like
mind, like spirit. to be a part of the heat lab
in this important work. So one of the things
that I also love to leave my audience with are
additional tools, additional, you know, things.
What are the people, organizations, books or
movements that inspire you in your work in health
equity? I mean, we're at a time where I think
I know myself. I am constantly looking for inspiration,
right? To stay filled up, right? And not be discouraged.
So as you're moving through this work and over
the years, right? Because this isn't our first
time of things being difficult. Let's just say
that, okay? But what are some of the things that
really motivate you and keep you moving forward?
A lot of things keep me going. I think faith.
of course, and heart for the work. Right now,
I do a lot of reading to kind of keep me engaged
and give me direction. So right now I'm reading
Let This Radicalize You. And it's organizing
and the revolution of reciprocal care. It's a
book by Kelly Hayes and Mary Ann. It's a really,
really, really good understanding of how you
organize people. to mobilize them for change.
Thank you for sharing that title. I'm going to
have to look into that and lean in some more
into what that has to share. And I hope my audience
does too. Thinking about, you know, even people.
People whose careers that inspire us or organizations
that we look to and say, wow, that's awesome.
I would love to be able to do something like
that. Is there anything like that or any person
like that for you, Shanita, that maybe you look
to? And I definitely appreciate where you're
coming from, Reagan, in regard to lifting up
our faith, which is very critical. The first
thing that comes to my mind in answering that
question. It's an unlikely answer, but it is
actually a faith -based organization that I have
been affiliated with since college. And the leader
has just signed an agreement with a major healthcare
organization where they will build on their faith
-based organization has 65 acres of land. They're
partnering with a health care organization to
build a facility on their land and partnering
with them, this faith -based organization, to
deliver health care, particularly in that particular
community. They have mobile units that will come
to the community for regular screenings. And
I have been inspired by that in terms of health
equity. Because it is holistic and the church
bringing, there's power there, right? This land
belongs to us and we're keeping it. There's a
food desert here. There's health needs that need
to be met here. So it looks at the whole self.
So that has been a movement and an organization
most recently. I think that has inspired me.
Like it's inspired thinking. Around how we are
to address equity. It also puts the ownership
and the power in the community. Right. The power
doesn't lie with us. The power really lies within
the community. How we can position ourselves
to be facilitators and partners with them. Whereas
our normal work has been. We've been seeking
them out as partners. They know how to do this.
The community knows how to do the real work of
addressing health equity. And so how do we position
ourselves to be servant leaders for the community
to be able to continue to build and sustain in
this way? And so it's really caused me to reframe
and rethink my positioning as a researcher and
as a scientist. been very encouraged by the health
equity work that they are that they are doing
that is a business model sustainable and very
impactful and and i appreciate that too because
by sharing these types of resources my purpose
with questions you didn't ask is to make sure
that people understand you are not alone in this
fight to advance health equity and to build towards
health justice there are a number of partners
and organizations and ways to innovate you don't
have to feel helpless you don't have to feel
hopeless you don't have to feel as though your
dreams are you know far off and far away yeah
it's going to take some work and it's going to
take some time and some investment and things
like that but there are examples of people who
are doing it that you may be able to learn from
and cut that timeline down right and so what
we want to do is to help facilitate collective
action so that we can start to be the change
that we wish to see in the world right and so
final thoughts Is there a message you want our
listeners to take away about health equity, community
and the power of doing it for ourselves as we
close out? Yeah, I think I'd say health equity
is everyone's work. And as I said earlier, ain't
nobody coming to save us. So part of. Being radicalized
to organize, it's like Shanita said, organizing
the troops on the ground, the grassroots community
in order to get where they need, how they want
to get there. Yes. Thank you, Reagan. Yeah, I
would just say the last part about the power,
doing it for ourselves, that realizing that this
work is hard. Particularly where we are now in
our society, it's a lot of things. It's hard.
It's disappointing. It causes a lot of emotions.
And continue to do the work, but also continue
to find space of peace, space for restoration,
space for hope, and space for yourself individually.
Because if you cannot take care of yourself,
then... You can't do this work. And so just finding
that whatever that looks like for you as you
continue to do this work around health equity,
just make sure internally that we are taking
care of ourselves holistically. And that's a
message for Shanita. I can relate. I resonate
as well, Shanita. I think it's for you, me, and
everyone else that is listening today is that
we do have to remember that this work is worthy.
It's important. In some cases, it's even critical,
right? It's a necessity. It is hard. But what's
also a necessity is that we have to take care
of ourselves before we can take care of anybody
else. And so that I appreciate that reminder.
And with that. I want to say thank you, thank
you, thank you, Dr. Shanita Randolph and Dr.
Reagan Johnson for joining Questions You Didn't
Ask and making this such a wonderful, rich conversation
and allowing us to learn more about your work,
your leadership, and your research. Thank you.
Thank you for having us.