Hey everyone, welcome back to Buzzworthy. I'm
your host, Shalicia Harris. I dive into the rare
stories entrepreneurs tell about building their
businesses, but most importantly, themselves.
Let's get into it. Hello again, everyone. Welcome
back to Buzzworthy. I'm your host, Shalicia Harris.
And today we have a pair of entrepreneurs who've
co -founded a company called COOCO. And today
we have Allison Leigh and Ria Wu, who both originate
from Vietnam, but have found their way into Hamilton
through a journey where they met each other and
traveled across the seas and now creating a cooking.
community for us here digitally. So welcome to
the podcast. Welcome to Buzzworthy, Alison and
Rio. Thank you. Thanks for having us. It's such
a pleasure. I was so happy when I was introduced
to both of you and got an opportunity to learn
a lot about your story and how you even came
together as co -founders. But your story sort
of started way back when, which we'll dive into
a little bit later. But I want to ask you the
question both individually. Either one of you
can answer first. But what do you think? helped
you become an entrepreneur or allowed you to
become an entrepreneur in your past? So I can
go first. Honestly, I think that nobody born
as an entrepreneur. Yeah, before become have
my own company and I worked for all the company
about eight years, starting from my university
days and before launching my own marketing agency.
And that's what over a decade ago and from there
I graduated, found myself diving into the startup
world. At first, I realized the corporate environment
didn't suit me. I care deeply about the efficiency
and client satisfaction. And I wanted more flexibility
to spend time with my family, not to spend hours
navigating corporate politics. process needs
from my own experience i would say that 40 up
to 60 percent of your time in a traditional job
is spent managing people not the actual work
so i'm very focused and quite introverted so
it makes sense for me to build something on my
own term and as i said before that i have time
to live in japan and i can see that a lot of
people that have a busy life in japan they don't
have time for repair every meal so they need
to make some new plan they need to go for go
to the supermarket like just one or two times
per week. And after that, they need to make a
meal plan and food preparing, just put into the
fridge. And after that, they can use it for the
whole week. So that's why it come up with me.
And during the COVID time, I came up with my
collectors, Alison, to do our old business. That's
amazing. That's amazing. It's, it's incredible
that you really chose entrepreneurship Rio, because
you wanted to spend more time with your family.
And you realize in your day to day, you weren't
actually doing the things you loved the most.
And that's when you first started your marketing
agency, where then you actually hired Allison.
as an intern. And so, Alison, how... Was it,
you know, I know you didn't necessarily start
off with entrepreneurship right away, but you
met an entrepreneur who had, you know, these
incredible goals and values for herself and her
family. And, you know, we talk a little bit more
about it in terms of work life balance. She wanted
to own her time a lot more. But what do you think
in your own experience set you up to be an entrepreneur?
with who was previously your boss? So looking
back, it wasn't a single moment, but rather a
series of experiences that shaped my perspective
and fueled my drive. So just like Rio, I graduated
with a marketing degree and landed an internship
at a big corporate firm, OTV. So that's where
we met. i was her intern at ogilvy and then after
that when she quit a job um i just looked around
the office and i asked myself like do i really
want to stay here and become the corporate employee
like all of the other people in this office and
unfortunately the answer is no like i'm even
i had a chance to work with the global brands
like obv and crap while i learned a tons of about
the system scaling and strategy something just
didn't click for me so i just felt like i was
a small cock in a massive machine executing the
task within the system that was already set um
in the motion it it was stable and but it it
just wasn't me at all i craved being a small
like being a part of a small dynamic team where
we can create a big impact where every like every
decision of us matter and every idea could shift
to a bigger thing that we rebuild so that's why
I also quit my job at Ogilvy. And then later
on, I met Rio. We became friends in the beginning.
And then after that, when I learned about she
was opening her own agency, marketing agency,
I was like, OK, let me help you. I wouldn't ask
to become an official employee at first because
I don't want to become a burden for her payroll.
I just want to help. And then after that, when
we received more and more projects together,
we became like colleagues. And then our relationship
became like a colleague and mentorship. And then
now we become partners in our business. So the
restlessness pushed me to rethink about what
I want to do with myself. I just don't want to
optimize. someone else we don't want to optimize
someone else's system we want to build something
that solves real human problems so that's that
mindset um shape us to the path we become today
yeah that's um that's very inspirational because
you know a lot of people just sort of go about
life doing exactly you know what is expected
of us we go to university which you both did
you and got those corporate jobs like we're all
you know we all dream of when we're in university
but there was something else that was really
missing from your experience there and it's your
ability to really provide value that you can
feel really proud of and you can say that What
I did today in the office is making the world
a better place with the actions that I took.
And like you said, Alison, you felt like a little
bit of a cog in the wheel in this big machine.
And when you sort of stepped out from that and
eventually. yourself and Rio working in your
marketing agency together, you really got to
stretch your flexibility, stretch the strategies
that you have done and be creative in your own
right and see the direct line of impact with
what you did and the results of that. And that's
something I think you're very much right in big
corporate environments, which I've worked in
as well. don't always get to see the direct effect
of what you have specifically contributed yeah
another thing that we want to add to other people
that um to be an entrepreneur is not easy so
uh we do appreciate the time that we worked in
the corporate uh company something like that
because uh we can saw that a lot of people after
graduating from college or from university they
want to be an entrepreneur or they want to get
a startup firm or something like that but i think
that they should have time to work for all the
company to get more information to get more experience
yeah experience and get more connection also
and after that they will be sharpened to open
their own company yeah yeah absolutely absolutely
you wanted to add to that Allison yeah my opinion
is pretty much the same like even though the
corporate life isn't for us but working for the
corporate in the short time really helped me
to sharpen my mindset and learning about the
system how the big company work how those teams
and those employees connect and work together
in um and create a big impact for for the big
firm and then like i i brought all of those in
my experience in working for small firms so uh
that's why in kuko and in our previous marketing
team the our firm is quite small but we we work
in system so we can really solve a lot of problem
with the small team and that's our motto for
now Yes, yes. I love that you both focused on,
you know, it's really important for entrepreneurs
to sharpen their skills before they even jump
into it. Because like you said, entrepreneurship
is very risky. And it's risky, and you require
a lot of flexibility. And if you haven't necessarily
got the experiences, or you don't know how certain
big organizations or different size organizations
work or function, you are only operating in your
own small world. The knowledge of saying, how
do I get from where I am to as big as they are,
it sometimes helps, like you said, sharpen your
goals, sharpen your experiences, sharpen your
skills. And for me, I would say that is absolutely
true. Getting experience before becoming an entrepreneur
definitely gives you a different line of sight.
And it prepares you for so much more success
than if you didn't have those experiences. And
not saying that somebody brand new out of the
world with a work experience can't be successful.
But having something under your belt absolutely
helps you even more so. So I'm glad that you
see that your corporate experience was just simply
part of your journey to be able to get to where
you are now. And before you even created Koku,
you had your marketing agency where you helped
other startups. grow their business like that
was the niche that you had focused on so tell
us a little bit more about that and how you found
yourself simply becoming a growth machine for
these big um these these startups that were scaling
their businesses um actually that um Most of
the startup that we worked before when we are
running a marketing agency is like now they become
some unicorn startup in Asian market. But you
know that if you want to get more consumer or
customer just based on the advertising, it's
kind of... losing a lot of money you're just
throwing the money out to the a lot of the money
from the pocket will go out and try to buy some
customer like this but actually that we found
another way to utilize the money for them like
we focus on the community more than the advertising
only for example For example, before launching
the products or before launching their application,
we try to create some community for them on the
social network like Facebook, Instagram or TikTok
or something like that and sharing about their
function, sharing about their features and help
people with the same interest that they can connect.
together and in this community we try to share
some tips tricks or make them feel that they
was become a part of the community and after
a short of time like three months or six months
when we grow a huge number of the people in the
community we inject the content of the brand
into there And after that, they will be upset
with the brand without their knowledge. And after
that, we try to convert them to be the customer
for our clients. And that's worked really great.
And after, we help these firms to get attraction
from there. they will go with some like some
fund or some capital to get more money. And after
that, they burn their money into the normal advertising
later. Yeah. Wow. So what you did was always
community first. So you really know how to build
a community from scratch and make sure that,
you know, every, every. every level of work that
you do pouring into that community delivers value
to them. And it's sort of a testing ground that
you've created for a lot of these startups that.
push them into that mode of growth and for them
to go and get more investments so they can really
build their company really focusing on that community
aspect of it where the community proves the value
um they test it out and they give you feedback
all at the same time yes so for example if you
want to launch an e -commerce platform if you
just If you just give the customer that very
low price or just the gift vouchers or just buy
the user by spending a lot of money on advertising,
this will be very costly and the customer just
come to you to utilize this coupon or utilize
this benefit and after that they will go away.
and never come back but actually that when we
work for a unicorn e -commerce in vietnam for
example we pick up some category that we think
that very interesting and can build up a community
in the social network for example we create a
committee for the garden lover we build up a
committee for the to selling the skin in the
game for the gamer or something like that. And
we can gather a lot of people that have the common
sense or common interest into a community. And
after that, they believe the admin of the group
more than the advertising. I can say that. So
that's why we can save a lot of money for the
brand, but also have a very loyalty customer
there. Yeah. Because like you said, it's not
buying the customer. It's. It's that constant
value building and the trust that you actually
create within that community. And that's often
very hard to do. So knowing that you have done
this so many times over and over and over again
for companies that are unicorns in the Asian
market, that's that's absolutely exciting. And
I think even more so exciting for the company
that you're building, because. Cuco is for stands
for cooking community, right? Yes. Yeah. Yeah.
So, Alison, you know, over the time, you know,
you're working with Rio in the marketing agency
back in Vietnam, doing these incredible things
together, building all of these different communities.
Tell us about what really started. cuco because
we know you like to spend you know some of your
free time just strolling through grocery stores
and yo is really like you know a solid home chef
everyone loves her cooking she tries different
things all the time and she'll tell us a little
bit more of her background there but where did
the real idea of cuco start like what problem
were you guys seeing happening in the market
for a new community like this to be developed?
Actually, I must give the credit to Adira, to
Rio, because she was the one who think that we
should do a virtual fridge. And then from the
virtual fridge, we kept... expanded to the cooking
community. But the moment that Crystal Light,
the problem Google solved, helped me in my own
kitchen. During the COVID time, when we had a
limitation from going out, so we couldn't get
access to the fresh food as it used to be. Because
in Asian countries, you can go to the supermarket
or you can go to the wet market like every single
day to get the fresh food so the fresh ingredient
of the fresh food is not our big concern but
it was in during the coffee time so and at the
same time when I open the fridge at my house
like it's full of food but i was frustrated because
like half of them all just went back because
we we bought it we took it all the way back in
the fridge and then we tend to far forgot about
it so i was holding like a half used bag of spinach
and the other salad the other veggie and they
all turned slimy and i had to throw it away and
throw them away so on On the other side, on the
new grocery haul, my parents just came home with
another bag of peanuts. They didn't even think
of checking the fridge before going out to buy
new food. So I was like... Half of my energy
was sorting the fridge, pouring the spoiled ingredients
away. And half of the other energy was sorting
the ingredients that my parents just brought
home and placed them in the fridge. And I was
so frustrated. And it's not just me, but when
I discuss about this problem with Rio, with my
other friends or family members, they all do
the same. They think like... pouring food in
the fridge is normal if it went bad just throw
it and buy the new ingredient and that just struck
something for uh from me that this is this isn't
good like just because we have the ability to
access to the wet market or the supermarket doesn't
mean that we can throw away the food without
feeling guilty So I think that we need to have
a plan to use up everything we have before we
go to the supermarket for the next trip to avoid
wasting food because wasting food is wasting
money and time. And at the same time, like at
a friend's dinner party, I watched that friend
of mine scribble a grocery list. admitting that
they had no idea what was in the pantry so they
had to bought everything they had to buy everything
new to create the dishes for the party even though
that they already have the food at home so yeah
i think that is a universal problem that nobody
talked about it we always talk with each other
between me and rio that is an elephant in the
kitchen and no one ever see it And we need to
talk about it. We need to really do something
about it. And I couldn't stop thinking about
it, like throwing the money away, throwing the
food away, because we have the privilege to do
that. And now we need to stop it, not only in
Asia, but also in North America as well. Yeah,
it's like you said, it is truly a universal problem
for anybody that really has access to food all
the time with a supermarket right nearby. And,
you know, as you were describing, you know, you're
throwing out slimy spinach from the fridge and
your parents are bringing home fresh spinach
at the same time. That is absolutely something
that's happened in my house multiple times. Sometimes
I'm the one doing the grocery shopping and I
don't actually even know what's in the fridge
myself either. So from a problem perspective.
there there should be something that helps us
sort of keep track of that because you know more
and more I'm seeing that becomes a lot of mental
work that women typically take on in the household
that others in the house don't really keep track
of but what if you know your kids have to go
and do the groceries that day or you know your
partner has to go and do the groceries that day
They might not even decide to check the fridge
to see what's there and what's not or what's
in the pantry or what's not. So knowing that
that specific experience and you couldn't get
it out of your mind. Was this before or during
the time that Rio had the idea of a digital fridge?
And how did you sort of bring those things together
to eventually evolve into the cooking community?
Actually, I have the idea of the virtual fridge
a long time ago. Before that, I... When I worked
for the marketing agency in Vietnam like Ogivi,
we worked with some very big electronic companies
and they do a smart fit already but that just
allows their customers who purchase intelligent
fish and it costs a lot of money. to use the
smart function but actually that the smart function
that just help you to see through the fish and
know what's still on the still on your fish that's
it so at that time i thought that why don't we
have everybody can access into a smart fish even
even if they don't have a smart fish physically
So I come up with that idea. And another thing
is because we were born in an Asian country,
a place that don't allow us to just throw the
food, just throwing the food into the garbage.
Because when we were young, our mom always said
that never waste the food because it's not just
the money. It's also, yeah, you will... you will
become like when you die you will go to hell
because just because you're throwing the food
something like that's a very interesting story
in England so that's why every time that we just
take some expired food in our fridge or pantry
and put it into the garage bag we feel a little
bit guilty and Day after day, day after day,
I think that it's a very, very big problem. It's
not just a small problem that people think, oh,
it's just a little bit money. We can go to shopping
or something like that. So that's why we came
up with that idea. And I can see that Alison
is also a girl that I know that she loved. She
loves to do something for the Earth. She's the
one who gave me some reusable bag in my home
country and asked me to use it. Don't use the
nylon bag or something like that. So I think
maybe she will like this idea and why don't we
collaborate to make this happen. I love that.
I love that. And Alison, what made you say yes?
Rio just told the whole story, but I think like
when we create Cuckoo and we work on this journey
together, the virtual fish not only help you
not to waste food but also help you to keep track
of the quality of the food also because you you
know like because we we asian and asian moms
they tend to sell everything in the freezer like
i mean like basically everything sometimes i
can't find a canopy in in my freezer and the
inspire day it's like 2022 oh wow yeah so yeah
and i had to tell my mom to throw it away and
she denied because she she was like yeah i put
it in the freezer how can it went bad yeah they
just open it and it is to smell good so they
will use it yeah i also said to alison that is
when you become a mom you will have the same
idea with them and thinking with them because
you need to control the money you need to save
something for the kids there's something for
the study for them or something like that so
you need to save a lot of money so why don't
people use the cuckoo app right now because they
can save the money but they can still use the
good food at a good time and yeah they can save
a lot of for the kids also yeah because like
In the beginning, Kuko is just the virtual fridge.
So our main idea is to help people keep track
of what's on their fridge. But because we see
a lot of mom's behavior around us like this one,
even for my mom, she put like the food in the
freezer from 2020 to 2023 until now. And she
was hoping one day she can use them. so we think
that yeah people should also keep track of their
the expiry date so they can know like when the
food went fast when the food go back and we can
encourage them to do that to use all the foods
they have at home so they don't have to toss
everything in the freezer and forget about and
forget about the food that they already have
So that's why when we built Kuko, it's a journey
that from day to day we observe our own behavior.
We observe the behavior of the people around
us, like our moms, our aunts, our friends. And
we come up with the new function for Kuko based
on those observations and experiences. Yeah.
And so you went from, you know, the idea of the
digital fridge and now the community based on
all of these different experiences of people
around you that are a little bit anecdotal in
terms of, you know, there are people close to
you. But again, you know, this is what happens
to almost everybody that. responsible for a kitchen
and one of the things you mentioned earlier was
you know the elephant in the kitchen is sort
of just throwing food away and nobody's really
talking about it but now you're utilizing your
you know, your previous experience in creating
communities and now creating a new community
about how you manage the fridge, how you utilize
everything in it, and how do you save money around
that as well? But not only that, but how do you
use the food as effectively as possible so it
can give you the most nutrition? Because the
fresher the food, the more healthy the food is
for you as well. Oh, these are so many different
aspects of how you can bring food together to
bring more life to people to bring more joy to
people. So what are one of the first big steps
for, you know, creating this cooking community?
What are some of the things you hope people can
use the cooking community for? we will have our
website launched hopefully at the end of this
month and application will by the end of this
year but now we are helping people that we are
create some some community in our social platform
to help people to connect together and sharing
the tips tricks how to utilize this coupon for
shopping or utilize the flyer and actually that
as i said before for people they um two main
important thing that i think that's the first
thing is community every peop every people was
born and they need to communication so a community
for them for communication and sharing their
like hobbies or something like that. We have
them a lot. They are not feeling lonely in this
journey. For example, they don't feel like they're
just like a weird guy who is just trying to find
a lot of flyers to save money, save every single
loonie, something like that. Yeah, they can come
in the community that every people will be. like
exactly the same sharing the tips sharing the
coupon or sharing the flyer and share and help
each other how to save the money in this inflation
time and in that community they can have other
people to explore the new things like try the
curry not just in an indian way or in japanese
style or in thai style or vietnamese style something
like that and we want to make something that's
very fun in a smart way so the slogan of us is
also the make home cooking smart and fun like
that smart is for the ai for the chatbot that
can help you and fun is help you to know to know
that cooking is not just the, you're responsible
for just doing it every day. It's a choice. It's
a fun. It's have to connect the people in the
home. Yeah. I love the idea of, you know, having
a space where people that just love food and,
but also want to save money can do both of those
things in one place. Because like you said, inflation
is very high right now a lot of people don't
have a lot of jobs so where you can save money
becomes very very critical and eating is something
we all have to do on a daily basis so no matter
how high inflation goes we still have to eat
so how can we make sure we're throwing away less
food but and using the food in a very creative
way by seeing what is my neighbor down the street
who's also in this community doing with you know
i don't know their empty jar of peanut butter
where they're just like there's still some peanut
butter in this jar what can I do with it maybe
they can make a sauce using peanut butter like
the slightly empty peanut butter jar and just
shake all the ingredients up in there and make
a salad dressing or something like that that
I think is It's really exceptional because there's
so many reasons for us to come together around
food, but we don't always have to do it at restaurants,
right? We can start to do it inside of our own
houses. And like you said, sharing the kitchen
and sharing the experience with the people in
our own homes when it comes to the kitchen. And
I remember Allison saying to me the other day,
You know, the kitchen felt like a space where
only somebody that knows how to cook should be
in. Right. And a lot of people are scared of
the kitchen and believe this community really
releases the fear from stepping into the kitchen
and starting to cook. How how do you think somebody
who. wants to cook but is scared they're just
gonna burn everything they burn water they burn
their eggs they don't even know how to make eggs
how can this cooking community help them feel
more comfortable in the kitchen I think yes you
can go first and then I'll add up actually that
I think that cooking is not just like very hard
thing. I think the kids need to be taught how
to cook when they were young. And actually that
in Coco, we also have a session for kids, a mini
chef or junior chef or something like that because
we want everybody, want every mom, every dad
to encourage their kids to help them. First thing
first that they will have, they will be, they
need to have the responsible for their food every
day. And after that, they can help mom and dad
to prepare for the food for them, for the lunch
box or something like that. It's very fun. And
another thing is we want them to join in. in
a very soon time because cooking is not just
a cooking they can learn how to be patient they
can learn how to be sharpen their skill and learn
to how to explore more information in the internet
utilize them to make a new dishes something like
that so for your question i think that if you
have a try let them download the google app and
learn some fun cooking recipe. If you are an
adult now but you don't cook for your whole life
and now you wanted to start, just start it. Just
do it. Don't be afraid because no one wants to
be a home cook. I just want to add up that right
from the start, For both Rio and I, we didn't
want to build just a product. We want to foster
a moment around reducing food waste and making
mindful, impactful cooking accessible to everyone.
So even for me, the first time I entered the
kitchen and cooked something for myself was when
I was 18. I was forced, not forced, but I was
sad. to the state as an exchange student. And
before that, I lived with my parents. So basically,
my parents put the food on the table and I just
need to enjoy the food. And that's the way it
is. But when I was living alone in the state,
I had to feed myself. And that's when I first
go to the grocery store. That's when I first
create my own dishes and it wasn't perfect like
you you don't need to be perfect for the first
time when you when you work when you learn how
to drive it it isn't perfect so why should you
expect that your first cooking need to be perfect
so you can burn the egg you can still the milk
or so ever but you you will learn for the next
time so for our community even though that we
have the small community but some people just
don't don't just sharing their perfect cooking
perfect dishes or tip and trick sometimes they
just share photos of their their messed up fried
rice and they ask the other people like yeah
i create the fried rice with um eggs with fries
but they all became messy what did i do wrong
and how can i improve it for the next time and
you will see the other people with skills will
analyze like why is the rice so messy why why
is the fried rice so wet and what can they improve
so they will give out the tip and trick and that's
the community that we we want to build and we
are building it And we are proud of it. So people
are connecting and helping each other through
the dishes. It's not just a place where you show
up your cooking skill, but it's a place that
you can help people enhance their cooking skill
as well. Yeah, I really like that because you
never really see the failure of the processes
before people become these exceptional cooks
that share all of their recipes and things like
that in the kitchen. And I know that happened
to myself. So I've really gotten into making
sourdough breads over the last year. earlier
this year i made my first big batch of sourdough
breads which was about 10 loaves i made all at
once and i made the unfortunate mistake of not
letting them raise enough out of taking them
out of the second fermentation long enough. Those
that know sourdough bacon will know what this
means. But and I just put it into the oven. And
so my bread came out really flat. I was documenting
the whole journey up to that point. And then
I never posted the photo of. The 10 breads that
came out, they were still very delicious, but
they weren't big and round and fluffy. They were
very flat. And it's moments like that, that I
think we should share a little bit more knowing
that, you know, the journey is not perfect every
time. And now what, like you said, Alison, I've
learned from that experience to that I need to
give my bread at least. four hours outside to
get nice and warm and fluffy again before I put
it in the oven to bake. And I didn't share that.
And I think if I were just learning and didn't
know enough about it, that's something I could
take and post in the group and say, I tried,
this is what happened. And maybe an expert chef
can, you know, not an evenness or an expert chef,
but somebody more experienced than me in this
specific thing can come in and say, well, maybe
you could do this next time or do that next time.
And I think that's exactly how communities are.
are created is people saying, raising their hand
to say, I need help here. And then somebody actually
showing up to help, which I think the kitchen
is a place that a lot of people feel like they
need a lot of rescue from. And they're scared
of it. And I think you're absolutely right for
creating a space where people can feel more comfortable
in the kitchen. And like Rio talked about, bringing
your kids into the kitchen a little earlier,
because our moms, of course, our moms love to
cook, we love their food. But maybe we aren't
doing the kids, you know, good service by not
teaching them how to cook at younger ages and
then they're afraid of the kitchen once they
once they get a little bit older as well yeah
yeah Amazing. So Cuckoo is launching very, very
soon. At the end of May, your website will be
ready for people to come in and start tracking
like what's in their fridge, what's in their
pantries. They'll be able to share some of their
recipes as well in the cooking community. And
so get get help from a safe space, you know,
somebody that has a lot of experience, hopefully
in that area to help them. build up their confidence
in the kitchen. And I can absolutely see a world
where Kuko can can absolutely create this opportunity
for so many people. So on this journey now, you
know, going from you know, Rio being your boss
at one time, and now Alison and Rio coming together
to co -create a community and a company. How
has that experience worked for you guys? Because
I see... I see this as very exceptional, especially
on your behalf, Rio, to see that Alison, who
you first got into, got... introduced to um during
her internship when he worked corporately to
now trusting her as you know a co -founder in
a company and approaching her with that problem
how how did you decide that allison had all of
these skills and she was the right partner for
you in in this business venture actually that
um When I worked in Olivia, I had more than four
interns, not just one. And besides interns, I
also had some executives who worked for me at
that time. I see some things in Alison, that's
why I invite her to jump out with me and open
the marketing agency, not all the people, because
I can see that she's kind of people that love
to explore the new information, love to adapt
the more. the new information the new knowledge
or something like that and use into our system
but yeah sometimes you know that um sometimes
you don't have enough the energy to do that like
her she can go around she can work with other
people she can explore more new um connection
it's not It's not work for me, but she can do
that. And I can do something like back office
or something like that. And after that, we can
work together to make things done. And another
thing is I can be her mentor, but I cannot be
the mentor for a lot of people. a lot of a lot
of other people so but she kept the ability to
do that so when I taught her how to do this how
to do that she can share that spirit share that
kind of style of work to all the people behind
her and she helped me a lot in that so I think
that we are kind of Yeah, perfect couple in walking.
I really like that. And I think it's so impressive
because people often see people that are younger
and less experienced and they don't see them
as having the opportunity necessarily to elevate
to that level of. of being an equal. And I think
your ability to trust Alison and see her potential
and actually give her the experience and the
space to do what she's doing. And now working
with you, she's obviously proved herself over
the years. But I think it's, I think it's incredible.
And because you didn't underestimate her in any
way, you really leaned into her potential. And
now your partners in this and I think a lot of
people can learn from that. It's not necessarily
about age, it's not necessarily about what experience
they have, but can this person use the skills
they have and really know what they're good at?
And you identified what you're not good at as
well, Rio. You saw that in Allison and you said,
she's the perfect partner for me in this. So
Allison, I'd love to turn it over to you to see,
you know. Were you a little bit scared to work
with Rio, who was, you know, sort of your boss
at some time? Were you scared to step into this
role as a partner in this business? as we all
just mentioned before our pros and cons complement
each other and also our mindset our working styles
also click so that's why we can work together
for over 10 years even though that uh for those
10 years of course we are not the perfect couple
we um we fight sometimes we disagree sometimes
but eventually um we pocket out and we find the
solution that matches both of our expectations.
So that's the way it goes. And for me, I'm thankful
to meet Rio because, as you mentioned, she trusts
me enough to delegate and build the skill set
for me. And she knows what I'm good at and what
I'm... not good at to to upgrade enhance my good
skill set and eliminate my limitations so yeah
it's good to have someone um like that and the
the way i'm working with real um is that until
now even though that we are people other people
can see us as equal partners but for for me in
my portfolio she's still my mentor and i can
still have a lot to learn from her yeah yeah
i'm not sure that um this way is um Not just
for me and Allison, it's also applied for all
the people in our team. Actually that for the
UI UX designer or from the tech team or the content
team that we work like this. Every people in
our team will have the voice and they will have
the pros and cons and we try to find what they're
good at. what they're not good at and try to
help them and we are we like a family exactly
because when we try to mentor anyone we put a
lot of effort on that so that's why we don't
usually have a lot of intern or usually hire
a lot of staff because we need to have the responsibility
for them and try to help them to roll off yeah
that's i think that's Absolutely paramount when
you're growing a company. And you've done this
before as well, Rio. So to be doing it again,
I think is very exciting. And you've certainly
learned. And I hope everyone listening to this
podcast can absolutely learn, especially from
learning how to trust and bring people into your
team and really being able to look at yourself
to say, what am I not good at and how do I find
those opportunities in other people where we
can work together and we're all willing to continually
learn and grow. And to see that goes beyond just
your relationship and partnership with Alison
and extended to the rest of the KUKO team is
very, very, very exciting to hear about and something
I will learn because as a founder myself, I struggled.
and never actually there was a point in time
I was actively looking for a co -founder for
over over two years consistently very very hard
test -drived a couple people but it never it
never worked out so I'm always very curious about
what how these partnerships that come together
work really well. Um, and for that to happen
with you guys over such a long period of time,
um, is I think very exceptional. So as we wrap
up the podcast, um, we have the three questions,
um, we want to ask you. So, and you can provide
a one word answer or short sentence. Um, what
is one thing, um, You are leaving behind from
last year in your entrepreneurship journey. What's
the one thing you want to make sure that does
not come with you into the future? For me, it's
overthinking. Yeah. Last year, I spent too much
time second -guessing decisions, trying to find
the perfect path before taking the first step.
I've learned that clarity often comes after action,
not before. Yeah. Yeah. So now I'm leaving overthinking
behind and choosing the momentum over the hesitation.
I really, really like that. Yeah, I think we're
going to have to clip this one because I think
it's so... powerful is clarity comes with action
um i love that a lot rio i'm gonna take that
one away from me for sure and what about you
allison what are you leaving behind so what i'm
leaving behind is also perfection so um like
before that we have worked together for over
nine years in advertising agency so we basically
create plans and strategy for other companies
on the clients of us and we need to make sure
that everything is perfect everything has a backup
plan so that we can deliver the best to our clients
and i brought up myself into my first year as
an entrepreneur i chased the idea of the version
of our product our pitch and our strategy and
that pursuit of perfection often paralyzed process
and prevented us from getting valuable real world
feedback. So that's what I'm trying to leave
behind the perfectionist myself and trying to
embrace the progress, trust the progress and
accept the thing that is good enough to go. 80
% is better than spending more time just to get
to 100 % because 100 % is probably never going
to happen, right? Yeah, and it's a different
perspective also because now we are an entrepreneur,
we need to speed up. And time is not our friends
anymore. It's our enemy. So the faster we can
launch our product, the better. But before that,
when we work for our clients, we need to perfect
everything because they also trust us with our
expertise. So, yep, that's the different mindset
that I need to work with. Sometimes we just blend
all of them. They also don't be a professional
like us. Yeah. Because we don't know. Yeah. Interesting.
That's a very good one too. Okay. So our next
question is, what is one thing that you have
learned? The biggest thing that you've learned?
Yeah. Resilience. The Chinese had taught me how
to bend without breaking. There were tough days,
unexpected. pivots and moments of down, a lot
of moments of down. But I kept going. Resilient
isn't just about enduring challenges. It's also
about growing stronger because of them. Yeah.
Yeah. So you can bend a little bit more and a
little bit easier and it's not going to hurt
as much. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. How about
you, Allison? So it's the same but different.
For me, it's persistent. So the most valuable
lesson I learned was that entrepreneurship is
fundamentally about continuing to move forward
despite the obstacles. So someday you will feel
really tired. Someday you will doubt yourself,
like, why are you doing this? But every day is
a fresh day to start. So if you... have that
moment just think that maybe I just need to work
for five minutes today and if I still don't feel
like it I can stop and do something else and
then while working for the first five minutes
you will get into the zone where you keep working
and working and another day has passed and it
wasn't the technical uh challenges emerged or
wasn't the expertise or connection that got us
through it's just simple the persistent showing
up from day after day to solve the problem gradually
transform the impossible into the achievable
yeah the impossible into the achievable um that
is um I just need to have a word wall with all
the things that our entrepreneurs are saying
on these podcasts. But though like this, like
your answers right now, and I know we have one
more question to answer is one of the absolute
reasons I love doing this podcast and getting
to speak to entrepreneurs because this is such
a hard journey and having hear other entrepreneurs
say the things that you have to say to yourself
or say the things that really resonate with you
is, I think, so important to keep you going.
And a lot of people that listen to this podcast
are actually other entrepreneurs as well, too.
And so this is why I ask these questions, because
I realize that other people are thinking about
them, but not necessarily thinking about them
in this structure. But when you can, it helps
you create like this marker of where am I going
to start this thing? And then next year, I'm
going to look back and say, this is how I actually
did it and achieve it. So in a way, just setting
goals for yourself, but personal goals to like
help you keep moving forward. And so our last
question is, what is one thing you are taking
into the future with you and that you hope will
show up in every single way in your future selves
in this entrepreneurial journey? For me, it's
clarity. After everything we built and learned,
I'm moving into the future with a sharper sense
of purpose. I'm clearer than ever about our mission
with Coco, who we are serving, and the kind of
positive change we want to create. The clarity
is my compass now. Oh, I love it. Love it. Alison?
So for me, it's connection. And we all know,
because we're entrepreneurs, we all know that
it takes a village to build a product. And it
takes a connection to build a village. So the
magic doesn't happen in the feature or in the
code. It happens in the space between people.
So connection is the difference between making
something that people need. and making something
that people care about so at Google we are not
just connecting the ingredient with the fridge
or with the recipe we have cooked now we are
connecting the human to the possibility so in
the world of transactions we are betting on transformation
and because when we are now connecting the dots
we hopefully we can solve the problems but when
you connect the people we can create the movement
and what a better way to end the podcast in you
know leaning into transformation and leaning
into creating a movement I I absolutely love
it. I have no other words other than that. And
so it has been such a pleasure chatting with
both you Rio and Allison about Cuco. And we can't
wait to see what Cuco is going to be doing in
the future. We're excited to celebrate your launch
with you as we help people save more money, reduce
their food waste and make sure that people are
just feeling. more confident in the kitchen through
the community that you're creating, where newbies
and experts and home chefs can all come together
and help people create connection around food
again, because that's what that's ultimately
what you're building. So we will be sure to Definitely
put all of your social media handles and everything
in the podcast description. That's where you
can find Kuko and absolutely support their launch
and start knowing what's inside your fridge.
So thanks again, Alison and Rio. It's been a
pleasure. Thanks for having us. Thank you. And
just want to shout out to your listener who is
also entrepreneur. I just want to say that for
everyone out there thinking about starting something,
just focus on the community, building something
that people can feel a part of, whether it's
food, art, or tech. If people feel seen and supported,
they will help you to grow it. And as Hokuko,
as you said, before right now we are super excited
about our upcoming web and application launch
and we already built a community of nearly 200
000 people who are ready to join we hope you
will be a part of it too wow wow um so if you
miss that You need to be part of over 200 ,000
people that have already registered to be part
of the Cuckoo Launch. So don't miss out. I will
be joining and we will certainly be reminding
you once we launch this podcast. We will see
you next week. Take care. Bye. Bye -bye. Thanks
for tuning in everyone. We're so glad to have
you as part of our Buzzworthy community as we
grow our network of Buzzworthy businesses. Continue
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