Hi everyone, this is Deb from Dying to be Found.
Before we get started, I just wanted to say that episodes contain disturbing discussions on harmful acts and crimes against animals and or humankind.
Recordings are not intended for young or sensitive audiences due to the content nature of this podcast.
Listener discretion is strongly advised.
Hi everyone, I'm Deb.
And I'm Shelby.
Welcome to episode number 52 of Dying to be Found.
I love to say that this is a family thing.
And yes, my daughter Shelby, who holds the same fascination of the criminal mind, is helping me finish out our season and grand finale.
Woo!
New sir audience popping here.
For our new listeners, I personally have been spread out from family members my entire life.
And for those who don't know me well, I live in Georgia, at least for now.
Shelby's in the Carolinas.
But we always come together every week to tell you stories that are left open to interpretation.
If you have a storyline you want us to tell, click on the link tree in the show notes and you'll see all the different ways to get in touch with us.
Absolutely.
We'd love to hear your thoughts.
Love to hear what you're interested in hearing about.
Yes, especially going into season two, because we will definitely push down those episodes already got planned.
If you guys want to hear something before we even air.
So yeah, do that.
Shelby on another note, we do have an excellent season ahead of us for sure.
But today I want to give a shout out to Miranda for sending in this request.
Today, we're going to be talking about J.C.
Dugard, which was suggested a little while back and I really knew this story was going to be noteworthy for our season finale.
So I hope I do this justice for you, Miranda.
Thanks so much for listening and making sure I pronunciate J.C.'s last name correctly.
Sometimes it's difficult.
Thank you.
J.C.
Dugard is the story of an 11 year old girl, Shelby, who was ripped off the streets literally by a couple of Whackadoodles.
While she was on the way to the bus stop as a parent,
I was fortunate shelves because your bus stop was at the end of our driveway.
And I would say my recollection is that I may have let you take the bus to the elementary school,
but I was fortunate to drive you and your brother,
Corey to school on my way to work for the majority of your childhood.
I loved being in the car with you.
I don't know how you felt about that.
No, I remember that very well.
It started I guess in sixth grade and then all the way through middle and high school.
You did drive us to school until I could start driving.
I do remember one time.
I don't remember how old I was.
I don't remember if Corey was even in school yet,
but I had been getting off the bus one afternoon and I had to walk across the street to get to our driveway.
So not a very far walk, but I remember a car.
The bus had stopped.
The lights were on.
The stop sign was out and I was I guess getting ready to cross the road when somebody coming into the neighborhood
had decided to just completely disregard the bus and drive around it.
Right.
And you were so mad.
You were so mad.
You literally got in your car and drove through the neighborhood to find that person.
Do you remember that?
Oh, yeah, I remember that.
And I also remember your dad actually was the one that found the car.
I think.
Oh, I don't think I did that.
I was on the porch.
I was like, did you see what just happened?
And yeah, he went ballistic.
Statistically, Shelby, even today that happens all the time.
Yeah, I believe it.
I do bus driving myself and I have to do training every year.
But that's one of the things that you have got to tell these kids.
I mean, just because you're getting off the bus and the lights are turning on doesn't mean people are going to stop.
Yeah, I don't know.
I read a long time ago that even if you're speeding down the road to get to your destination,
let's just say that you left your house a little late.
Statistically, you're only going to get there maybe three minutes early.
So even if you are on time and you're speeding, you're only going to get there three minutes early.
So is it really worth it or beneficial?
Absolutely not.
But it's crazy with the amount of people that pass those buses with the lights on.
Yeah, for sure.
Do you get quality time in the car with your kids?
I would say yes.
But you know where we live, it takes five minutes or less to get anywhere.
Can't even hardly finish one song when we're in the car.
I love that.
When I lived there, I was able to just, you know, go through a couple of traffic lights and I was at work already.
Couldn't even get through a song on the radio.
Like you said, what I liked about being in the car with you is, I don't know if you even know this,
I strategically held those difficult conversations with you and Cory in the car.
Like, I don't know, let's say the birds and the bees.
And why? Because I knew you guys could not get out of the car.
Those were the best times to hold those conversations.
That sounds about right.
Yeah.
So listeners, if you are about to have the birds and bee talk with your child, do it in the car.
They can't go anywhere.
And make sure this day and age, make sure their technology is turned off.
All right.
Are you ready to get into our season finale?
I'm ready.
All right.
On June 10th, 1991, Philip Guarido and his wife, Nancy snatched J.C. Lee Dugard off the streets of South Lake Tahoe, California,
while she was making her way to the bus stop.
J.C. later recalls taking her daily walk up a hill on the morning she was abducted
and how she looked forward to going on a field trip that day.
She remembers that she was wearing her favorite pink outfit with a little kitty cat on her shirt.
Shelby, you'd appreciate that.
And she had this really sweet butterfly ring that her mom had given her.
So she was all dressed up for that field trip that day.
J.C. heard a car approach as she continued her way to the bus stop.
And without notice, a man shot his arm out the window as J.C. walked alongside the road.
He used a stun gun on her to subdue her.
Oh, wow.
Where do you get a stun gun?
Right.
I bet that just has ruined field trips for the entire rest of her life,
even when her kid, you know, the days her kids go on field trips.
I bet that brings back just the worst memories.
Oh, I bet it does.
Yeah.
Well, J.C. remembers feeling tingling and going numb all over her entire body.
And then she just fell into some bushes.
She remembers trying to get away, but said that her body simply would not work.
J.C. was then dragged into a waiting vehicle.
She was handcuffed, thrown onto the floorboard and covered with a blanket.
She immediately heard a man laugh and telling whoever it was with him
that he could not believe they had just gotten away with this.
What psychos?
I mean, what is it that they want with these young children?
I know.
It's a crazy world out there for sure.
J.C. felt the terror as her captors cackled
and she tried not to cry because Shelby, she knew those tears would make her face itch.
She was handcuffed.
She would not be able to scratch her own face.
And that's what she was worried about.
Right.
The car sped off making its way to Antioch, California,
a suburb just outside of San Francisco.
And that's somewhere around 170 miles or 274 kilometers away from J.C.'s town of South Lake Tahoe.
J.C.'s stepfather witnessed her abduction and immediately hopped on his bike to chase after the getaway car,
but was unsuccessful in keeping up.
That's got to be horrifying.
Oh my gosh.
Absolutely.
Shelby, it kind of goes right back to what we were talking about with witnessing that car coming around the bus with the flashing lights.
Same thing, you know, you have a car that just sped off.
Yeah.
That's got to be definitely something that weighed heavily on him, I'm sure.
Yeah, for sure.
At least he was a witness.
He saw the car that had taken her, possibly, probably a very acute description of the people.
Mm-hmm.
And since there was a witness, they didn't have to wait that 24 hours to see if she came back.
Right.
Absolutely.
Well, like you said, he was able to give police a partial description of the car, plus one of the people inside.
The South Lake Tahoe community immediately sprung into action.
Like you said, they did not wait that 24 hours and they did try to locate 11-year-old J.C.
Police canvassed the area by talking to residents and bringing in several search dogs.
Thousands of flyers were distributed and leads began flooding in,
but Shelby, for the next 18 years, J.C. went missing without a trace.
18 years.
That is just crazy.
So sad.
Yeah.
After arriving at the Garrido's home in Antioch, California, J.C. was lifted out of the car
and she remembers somebody asked if she wanted something to drink.
J.C. wasn't even sure who had asked this question.
She did realize that there were two people involved in her kidnapping.
The couple then proceeded to threaten to use the Taser on J.C. again if she ever tried to leave
and they also told her that Doberman Pinschers were roaming the property and were trained to attack if J.C. ever tried to leave.
This poor child from the get-go is already getting mental abuse, you know?
Yeah, for sure.
And Dobermans are not very nice dogs from what I can remember.
No, they're pointy ears.
Pointy-eared dogs have a little bit more aggression for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah, I was chased after one one time when we were at Aunt Jamie's house.
A Doberman?
Yeah, I was running down the hill to the playground and their neighbor's dog, which was a Doberman,
had, I guess, gotten a peek of me because I was running.
I mean, I didn't notice the dog and I ended up running up on the slide and here comes Dad running after me
and probably didn't do very nice things to the dog.
Oh, yeah.
Speaking of which, I did see two Dobermans one time I was working and I was at the front desk
and I happened to look out the window and there were two Dobermans chasing after a cat and they caught it.
Oh, no.
Yeah, that was horrifying.
Well, J.C. was led to a soundproof makeshift recording studio in the backyard, way in the backyard Shelby,
and immediately was shackled inside.
J.C. was ordered to choose a different name to go by and so she chose to go by the name Alyssa going forward.
I'm not going to mention that name too much.
I'm going to continue to call her J.C.
but just for the purpose of her having to come up with a new name, that's what she chose to go by.
Wow.
I mentioned the couple who snatched J.C. from the bus stop that morning were Phillip and Nancy Garrido.
Phillip was 60 years old.
Nancy was 55.
Something you should know is that Phillip was currently on parole for a 1976 rape conviction
after kidnapping and sexually assaulting a woman.
He had an earlier charge placed on him as well, but those charges did not stick.
So he did have one rape conviction under his belt and Phillip was sentenced to 50 years in prison,
but only ended up serving 11 years before he was released on parole.
Isn't that crazy?
I mean, I know that sometimes they put people out if they are on good behavior possibly due to overcrowding.
Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say.
Mm-hmm.
I don't even know the reasons behind why he was released so early, especially with something that violent.
Yeah, for sure.
After living in captivity for three years and enduring drug-induced rape sessions almost daily, Shelby,
Jacey gave birth to her first of two children when she was just 14 years old.
Wow.
During her labor, Jacey was placed inside a room where Dr. Quinn, medicine woman, was playing on the TV set
and she gave birth alone without medical assistance.
Oh my gosh.
I couldn't imagine.
Mm-hmm.
I know she had to be terrified.
Three years later when she was 17, Jacey did this all over again when she gave birth to her second child.
Wow.
During a 2011 interview with Diane Sawyer, Jacey said obviously that she was terrified when she first gave birth,
but the moment her baby was born, she absolutely fell in love and felt at least she wasn't alone anymore.
As a parent, Shelby, I think we can all say that as soon as that baby is born,
I mean that definitely changes the world, may not change the circumstances,
but I'm sure that was probably, if anything, part of her saving grace to deal with what she had to endure
for those years that she was held captive.
Absolutely.
It gave her something to live for, for someone to live for.
Yeah.
And she did say that someone belonged to her and she knew that she was able to protect from the burritos.
Throughout those 18 years of captivity, Jacey did not once attempt to escape
because she wanted to keep her children safe from the monsters, she said, that lived in the house.
Now remember, she was outside.
She wasn't outside the absolute entire time.
She was kept in the house at least until the second baby was two years old,
and that's when the burritos put everybody outside into those sheds.
And when I say outside, Shelby, they put him in such a spot in the backyard that they were really covered
pretty well with trees and that building itself, like I said, was soundproof.
So they were really, really sheltered back there.
Yeah, that's interesting.
Mm-hmm.
Now, since Philip was a convicted rapist on probation, of course, he had a plan all worked out.
Jacey was instructed that if she were in the house and anybody were to come to the door,
like maybe a parole officer unannounced, Jacey and the children would quickly run outside to hide.
And that was pretty easy to do.
If they were discovered inside the house, however, Jacey would tell them that it was perfectly okay
for Philip to be around her children because, you know, and I know that as a sex offender,
that's a big no-no.
They just can't be around kids.
Oh, yeah.
In the event that Philip would be arrested for any reason,
Jacey was instructed to ask for a lawyer so that her lawyer could confer with Philip's lawyer
and everyone could maintain lawyer-client confidentiality privileges.
So basically, once you have a lawyer, you know, they can't say anything
and nothing is going to be held against them, right?
Because it is, I mean, they just, it's all hush-hush after that.
So whatever they said could not be disclosed to the authorities.
I do want to know though what Philip was doing besides exercising false imprisonment of a minor
that he would even put so much thought into getting arrested one day.
I guess he's just what, crossing his t's and dotting his i's?
Yeah, that's a very good question.
After Jacey's youngest child did turn two, they were permanently put outside in the yard
and they slept on the ground plus had a bucket to use as a toilet.
There were also some tents back there, Shelby.
So, I mean, pick and choose, I suppose, where the kids are going to go.
They could go into the tent, into the building, but they just couldn't go into the main house.
Wow. I wonder why that is.
I mean, I guess less chance of being caught.
Yeah, that's true.
And for everyday life, Jacey took great care to teach her children everything she knew
despite her own fifth grade education.
She taught them reading, history, math and science and I thought this was pretty cool, Shelby.
Jacey knew enough about the stars and the constellations that she was teaching her kids
about the scientific aspect of it and she also taught them about plant life in the yard.
I mean, very resourceful for a young, young person.
Absolutely.
Throughout the years, Jacey took to journaling and made daily entries into a notebook
to help her cope with her daily life.
Clearly, she was an emotional rollercoaster because inside these journals, Shelby,
there was evidence that Jacey was thinking about Phillip's feelings as well as her own.
And in case you don't know this, that's called Stockholm syndrome
because you're always taking your captor's feelings into consideration.
I don't know if you know much about that, Shelby.
No, I really don't.
Yeah, so I think I'm going to end up having one of these episodes,
but there was a lady named Patty Hearst.
She was kidnapped in Stockholm and she ended up kind of going along the same lines
of what her captors were doing.
They were robbing banks.
She was part of that because she took, what's the word I'm looking for?
She took, not pity, but she was so brainwashed that she felt compassion,
maybe is a word for that, towards her captors.
But I will say this, expert psychiatrists do criticize this syndrome
because there has never been any research performed to validate how captive victims
do relate to their captors.
And that's understandable.
I have never seen any kind of research outcomes on that.
So that makes sense.
It's not really been validated.
Yeah, no, I mean it does.
If you're with these people all the time, I mean, that's kind of who you know,
who you're around and I mean, I can certainly see how feelings could evolve.
Throughout the years, the Geritos got comfortable taking JC on supervised outings in public,
but only after Philip and Nancy felt that they had pretty much scared JC
or threatened her enough into obeying them when they did have to go somewhere.
That in itself, I mean, that's the Stockholm.
I mean, they're comfortable with each other and they are going out into public.
It kind of reminds me of the Elizabeth Smart case that we did where the captor also took
Elizabeth out into public and the person never runs away because they do have some kind of connection.
Right.
Whether it's, you know, being threatened or I don't know.
I mean, in this case, I think JC was probably just looking out for the safety of her own children.
Yeah, absolutely.
We're going to jump ahead now to August 25th, 2009 where 18 years after JC was first abducted,
Philip, JC and her two kids were observed milling around the University of California on the Berkeley campus.
They were attempting to distribute religious literature.
Some university employees passing by felt that the younger girls were just that.
They were absolutely too young even to be on a university campus and that the group itself
that would be Philip, JC and the two girls were acting a little oddly.
Police were eventually called and two police officers took note of the group's odd behavior as well.
And I'm not sure what behavior stood out.
I couldn't find any information on that shelves,
but it was enough for the police to run a background check on Philip Guarido while they were questioning him.
This is when they discovered his criminal history.
That day Shelby, they didn't have any reason to hold him for anything.
All he was doing was passing out literature, freedom of speech, right?
But yes, he was being a nuisance.
So they sent Philip, JC and the children on their way.
Afterwards though, they promptly placed a call to Philip's parole officer
because Philip was a known sex offender who was being around children and who was in his presence.
JC's two kids.
Wow.
The next day on August 26, 2009, Philip was ordered by his parole officer, do not stop go.
You are to report to this office immediately.
He also ordered to bring along his wife plus the young woman and children that he was with the day before.
Remember now the two police officers from that day witnessed two minors in his presence on University campus
and likely questioned JC as well.
But if you remember when I first told you when she was put in the backyard, she presumed the name Alyssa.
So I'm going to say she likely gave that name to the police that day.
Probably, but they might be starting to put two and two together now.
I mean after 18 years, it's likely that they have what's it called?
The technology where it ages missing children.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
That age progression.
Yes.
Age progression.
Mm hmm.
Yep.
Oh, that's true.
I don't think I've ever seen one of those on her though.
It was during the parole meeting that JC now age 29 Shelby was separated from Philip
and she was able to tell the parole officer what she had gone through for the past 18 years.
Wow.
Yeah, I know I have goosebumps.
Me too.
During this meeting, JC recalls being extremely hesitant to tell the parole officer her real name
because she had used Alyssa for the last 18 years.
But I'm sure that she was coaxed a little bit.
She eventually wrote her name down and she wrote JC Lee Dugard all in capital letters
and pushed it across the table toward the parole officer.
And at that point, Shelby, she asked if she could see her mom.
I am tearing up.
Me too.
This is oh my gosh.
I just these stories, even though I researched them and I know what I'm about to tell Shelby,
I can't help just to be feeling a sense of overwhelming.
It's just heartbreaking.
It's heartfelt.
It's just so many emotions going on right now.
Wow.
I can imagine Shelby, the officers were probably thinking the same thing at this time.
Yeah.
As soon as JC asked that question, they emphatically told her yes.
And what an amazing moment.
All right, now I'm crying.
Well, let me just tell you, let's not forget about Philip here.
He was being held in another room.
Obviously, after JC said who she was, he was immediately confronted by authorities.
And by the way, I don't mean to make you cry, but maybe I'm a good storyteller.
Who knows?
You are.
Obviously, the jig was up and he confessed to his crimes before he even left the parole office.
All right.
Now, let's talk about the reunion.
By August 27th, 2009, JC was reunited with her mother.
And this was just three days after everyone was observed on that university campus, passing out literature.
JC's mom admits that she and JC had a hard time readjusting when she first returned home.
But I want to emphasize that during an interview, her mom said, and I quote,
I knew that no matter how tough it was for all of us, I would never give up hope that we'd get through it.
Just like I knew I'd never give up hope of holding her in my arms again and telling her that I love her, unquote.
Oh, that's sweet.
It is.
I mean, that's family ties right there.
JC also reunited with other family members.
One of her aunts fondly remembers that when JC returned home, they just sat around talking about their favorite foods and really not much about anything besides what they wanted to do for the day.
Unfortunately, JC's mom and stepdad ended up divorcing after JC disappeared.
But I do want to emphasize that JC's stepdad did reunite with JC.
And he was quoted as saying, I've gone through hell.
I mean, I'm a suspect up until yesterday, unquote.
So, yeah, he's the one that witnessed JC being dragged off in that car.
He's the one that chased her on the bike.
And for 18 years, Shelby, he was a suspect.
Wow.
That's got to be hard.
You know, they always look at the people closest to you.
Oh, yeah, for sure.
Yeah. Well, I mean, he had a good disposition because he also went on to say, quote, to have people in custody is a triple win.
It's like winning the lotto, unquote.
So, yeah, he had a lot of positivity.
I mean, at least he didn't have regrets or people could get bitter over the years.
You know what I mean?
Oh, for sure.
But with him being the sole witness, you know, he knew what happened, even though other people were trying to point fingers at him.
I mean, he had no guilt on him whatsoever.
He saw what happened.
So that makes sense to me.
Yeah. And I'm so glad that they reunited.
Me too.
JC and her children were given a medical examination after their rescue.
None of them appeared malnourished, which is good.
When going to the Garrido's home during the investigation, authorities found a primitive campsite on the property that I had mentioned was so well hidden that even if you walked in the backyard,
Shelby, you wouldn't have even known it was there.
Wow.
In fact, the Garrido's were visited by Phillips parole officer at least 60 times and the parole officer never noticed children present on the property, nor the makeshift camp in the backyard.
I will say this neighbors at some point had reported that they had seen children in their backyard.
I don't know if they reported that to the parole officer or who they had mentioned that to.
So, you know, unless they did a thorough investigation, then the Garrido's did a pretty good job of keeping everybody hidden.
They sure did.
Now, I don't know what happens when a parole officer goes to check on the parolees.
Maybe that'd be a good question for Cory to answer.
If they're not really searching, then they weren't really bound to find it, you know?
Yeah.
And they would have to have reason.
It's kind of like a search warrant.
They can't just, you know, start milling all over without a reasonable doubt, I guess.
Yeah.
Too bad somebody hadn't tried to record the children back there.
You know, that could have changed everything a lot quicker.
Oh, gosh.
Are you ever spot on with that?
Absolutely.
All right.
Well, obviously, JC would spend quite a long time recuperating from her 18 years in captivity.
She mentioned that it's very easy to take things for granted, but her experience gave her an appreciation for the small things in life.
I know that we can easily take for granted some of those things.
On some days, JC says she struggles from being overly cautious or wary of others.
Understandable.
And I'll give you an example.
She had taken a trip to New York at some point to receive an award and she found herself unable to enjoy the city as much as she would have liked because she was constantly on guard.
You've been to New York.
I've been to New York.
We know how populated it is.
So I'm sure she was looking over her shoulder.
Oh, there are so many people.
All right.
And then let's see, JC even felt during one of her cab rides that the ride was taking too long and even began wondering where the cab driver may be taking her to.
That is a flashback.
It's so hard.
Absolutely.
And I'm just wondering, you know, if somebody sent her there to receive an award, why wouldn't they have given her bodyguard security, a private car to take her back and forth?
I mean, I don't understand why they didn't give her that extra protection.
I mean, 18 years of, you know, after being kidnapped.
Oh, yeah, you are right.
That's always going to be a thought through her head.
And I'm sure they had to, I don't know.
I don't know.
That's that's my thought.
Why didn't they provide her with more personal support rather than just having her, you know, hop in a cab in the middle of New York City?
So true.
I didn't see any reasons for that when I was doing my research shelves.
The only thing I can say is maybe she was offered it and she rejected it, but I don't know.
Oh, that's possible.
Well, much of the journaling that JC documented during her captivity became a checklist or what we would call a bucket list these days of the things that she wanted to accomplish during her lifetime.
And one of these things was to see her mother again.
Oh, I bet that was the best one.
That was probably at the very top of her list.
I'll bet it was.
And for her mother to meet her grandkids too.
Gosh, I can goosebumps.
JC continued to check items off that bucket list, which included seeing the pyramids in Belize, going up in a hot air balloon, learning how to drive, which Shelby, I thought this was really cool.
Her younger sister taught her how to do that.
Isn't that cool?
Wow.
Oh, I know.
JC also went swimming with dolphins, rode on a passenger train.
Oh my gosh.
I have to stop right there.
If you have never had the experience to take a passenger train, do it.
It may take you a little bit longer to get there.
Never done it.
Holy cow.
The space.
And that's what Aunt Beth typically does, right?
When she goes to see Sarah.
Yeah, she does.
Hi, Sarah.
Hi, Adam.
Hi, everyone in our family.
Hello.
If you're listening, I don't think everybody's listening.
So yeah, JC took a passenger train.
She went sailing.
She went horseback riding and even wrote a book or two.
After living in captivity for 18 years, then putting the pieces of her fractured life back together again, Shelby, JC wrote two books.
Her first book was titled A Stolen Life, which was written in 2011.
And the second book was written in 2016, which is titled Freedom, My Book of Firsts.
Wow.
Oh, that's so cool.
Yeah, I'd like to get copies of those.
I'd love to read them.
Uh-huh.
And then the third book is called The Jace Foundation.
JC has also gone on to be a public speaker advocating for victims' rights.
She began working with law enforcement to create more victim-focused programs and started the Jace Foundation.
And that's J-A-Y-C, which stands for Just Ask Yourself to Care to help those who have been abused or traumatized in similar experiences.
She also started a group called The Jace Foundation, which is a group of women who have been abused or traumatized by women.
They're also doing online therapy in addition to traditional therapy.
And Shelby, this is such a good cause.
I spent some time looking through the Jace Foundation website, and they do a lot of wonderful things.
I'm going to go ahead and add that link to the website.
Shelby, I'm going to add that link to the website.
And then the third book is called The Jace Foundation.
She and her family used equine therapy throughout their own healing process.
Shelby, do you know what equine therapy is?
I do not.
It's using horses as therapy.
Oh, wow.
I've heard really wonderful things about that, and I've known that there are a lot of...
Me personally, I can see that. I mean, I love animals, and horses are my favorite animal.
I would absolutely love to work on a farm and be able to help people overcoming emotional issues, you know?
Oh, yeah.
Jacey was able to move on and purchase her own home for her and her children.
She enrolled her daughters in a real school, and now I believe at this point, Shelby, they may have finished college.
And they were also able to adopt pets that Phillip, throughout the 18 years, would always threaten to take away from Jacey.
Really?
Yep. So she adopted her own pets.
She's living, I guess, what we could say, what we would see as a normal life.
I'm sure she still has a ton of things that she deals with on a daily basis, but from an outsider looking in, it's just a normal existence, you know?
Absolutely.
All right. Jacey eventually filed a $20 million lawsuit claiming physical, emotional, and psychological damages under the pretense that Phillip Garrido's federal parole officers failed to properly manage and supervise him as a registered sex offender.
She was originally awarded a settlement, but the United States Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled against this lawsuit, stating that, quote, holding the government responsible would lead to endless liability for those federal agents who have dangerous people in their care and supervision, unquote.
Wow.
I know. I'm on the fence with that one.
You're going to just say one case here is going to lead to endless liability. I mean, that's not taking accountability at all.
No.
Judge John B. Owens, who oversaw the case, wrote a 44-page document that stated, quote, while our hearts are with Ms. Dugard, the law is not, unquote.
So he's a judge. He kind of has to follow the rules, and that's his job to oversee and literally interpret the law, not the emotion. Does that make sense?
Very much so. Yeah, that makes sense.
I know everybody here is wondering what J.C. had to say about her experiences during the 18 years in captivity. I'm really not going to spend a ton of time here because J.C. is doing extremely well today, but I do want to give you a brief insight as to some of her experiences made from an 11-year-old girl who spent 18 years under the influence of what I like to say, Shelby, is two wackadoodles.
And what they can do to someone's psyche.
I know. I've heard you and Beth talk about that.
Even with the dysfunction that she felt while in captivity, J.C. was paralyzed with fear of the unknown, obviously. She was 11 years old, which is one of the reasons that she never attempted to escape, especially after she had two children.
Much of this fear is what the Garrido's planted in her head about it being a big bad world out there, and she didn't want to go outside the perimeters of the house that she was being held at.
And we didn't really talk much about Nancy Garrido, Phillip's wife, but during one of her interviews, J.C. said that she had a very strange relationship the entire time she was there, emphasizing that Nancy was very, very jealous.
Phillip and Nancy Garrido both pled guilty to 29 felony counts, including kidnapping, rape, and false imprisonment charges.
Because they pled guilty, J.C. was not required to appear in court to face her captors.
She did exercise her privileges, however, to write a letter to them instead.
And I had mentioned J.C.'s journaling that she had done while she was in captivity.
Although she did not appear in court during their sentencing, J.C. did write a victim statement, which read, quote, I chose not to be here today because I refuse to waste another second of my life in your presence.
Everything you did to me was wrong, and I hope one day you will see that. I hated every second of every day for 18 years. You stole my life and that of my family, unquote.
J.C. closed by saying that she was doing well and the Garedos did not matter to her anymore. Good for her.
Wow, I have goosebumps.
Phillip received 431 years in prison. Nancy only received 36 years to life.
As part of their plea deal, both defendants waived their rights to appeal for any of their sentencing.
Geez. Let's hold on. I'm sorry. Hold on.
Okay, no problem.
All right, you all. Shelby has walked away. Let me give you a story because that's what Deb does.
She tells stories about her family members when they walk away.
Um, all right. Let's talk about the fact that Shelby hates, and I mean absolutely hates, for me to pick out her clothes from the age of three.
She went to a concert once, and I think it was the Backstreet Boys. I went out, got her this fantastic outfit that I thought was pretty cool,
but not only was she ticked off that she had to wear it, but you can see it in the picture that she had with the Backstreet Boys.
And to this day, I can't live that down. Here she comes. Hi.
Hi.
Shelby, do you remember the Backstreet Boys concert?
Absolutely. I was just wearing my Backstreet Boys shirt. That's what I wore to Pa's 95th birthday yesterday, and we listened to the song,
Everybody. Yeah. Yeah.
We listened to that song on the way there.
That's amazing. What do you remember about the concert?
I got to meet them, and I was in like second grade, and you dressed me terribly.
Why? What did you not like about that outfit?
Well, I had my shirt tucked in. I had, you know, these jeans on. They were decent. I was wearing these jeans, sparkly shoes that I absolutely hated.
And then I had my hair up in one of those, what's called, what they call claw clips today. So that's back in.
I don't know. Maybe if I can, I've got that picture where my picture with them. I don't know if you can post that on the page, but yeah.
I totally, I met them when I was in second grade, and I was in love with Nick Carter, and he literally like touched my hair in the picture and is making a funny face.
So yes, I met the Backstreet Boys, and I was in the 13th row. Thank you, Amber, for taking me.
That's amazing. And thanks, Mom, for that awesome outfit.
Yes. Thanks, Mom, for that awesome outfit.
I bet you hated so much.
I did.
All right. This is my last thought regarding this case.
J.C. stated during an interview that she and her two children share a story together whenever they feel the need to reflect on their captivity. Because J.C. was not the only one being held captive here, Shelbs, her children were as well. Whenever the need arises, they recite the following, quote, Once upon a time, there was a mom and two daughters, and they lived with a crazy person for a really long time.
And then they came out of the backyard, and there were ups and there were downs, and they met a whole lot of amazing people, and they lived their life, unquote.
Oh my gosh.
I have goosebumps again.
Me too. Oh my gosh.
I mean, honestly, if you're going to get a good story out of a bad situation, this has got to be it. Then this Miranda, my dear listener, this is why I saved this for the finale.
Yes, thank you so much. This was a great one.
What is our teachable moment for today? Well, Shelbs, age 11 seems like a reasonable age to let your children walk to the bus stop unshaperoned. I did the same thing when I was that age, but I also had two sisters and a whole lot of kids in the neighborhood that would come outside around the same time every day to meet up at the community mailbox around the corner.
And I don't ever remember letting you stand outside at the end of our driveway by yourself. Usually, Shelby, what I would do is we wait for the bus to come into the neighborhood and time it just right so as it was pulling up, you'd be going down the driveway as the bus pulled up.
Do you remember that? I do. Yeah. Well, even today, even today I pass other people on my drive into work, and I do see them standing in their driveway with their kids waiting for the bus.
So my teachable moment today is to say that it takes just one time for someone to slow down and talk to or entice a child left alone, even if it's in their own driveway.
Do you want to see a puppy? Do you want some candy? Hey, I've got a really cool video game at home. Want to come with me?
Absolutely. And sometimes it happens way too close to home. I remember there was one time she's my oldest who had been out in the front yard and was just doing flips. It was a beautiful summer day. It was warm outside.
You know, she was maybe eight or nine at the time, and I was I just happened to be standing in the backyard talking with my neighbor and we saw a truck pull up and stop and start talking to her.
And as soon as I saw this, you know, I'm making a beeline to the front yard. Who was talking to my kid? You have no reason to be talking to my kid.
And the closer that I got, the truck ended up pulling off. And when I asked, what is this man saying to you? It was an older man.
And maybe he didn't have bad intentions. But the fact that he just pulled off when I was walking up gave me a very uneasy feeling.
But she, you know, she had said that he had just mentioned, oh, his daughter used to do gymnastics. And that was one of the one of the scariest things.
I mean, like I said, maybe he didn't have bad intentions, but it's like, really? Why would you pull up to an eight or nine year old girl and just say that?
Like, just go on with your day. There's no reason for that.
No, and there wasn't. You're right. I mean, he could have had that memory as he kept on driving past her. He didn't need to stop and say something to her. So, yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
I was going to say too, I mean, obviously kids don't have that spidey sense that you had that day.
No, no.
Especially when they're probably like you said, Shelby, at that tween age mark. They just don't have that yet.
So teach them a moment here. Bundle yourself up. I don't care if it's raining, if it is cold outside, get yourself out to the bus stop to the end of the driveway.
Give the bus driver a friendly wave as they pick up your child.
I think, Shelby, I know from experience that they are just as protective about your child as you are. So that's my teachable moment.
That's a good one.
Thanks.
Kids don't understand, or my kids don't always understand why I don't like them in the front yard by themselves, but when they get older and they have their own kids, they will completely understand.
Might be mad at you for 10 minutes or so, but better than 18 years without them.
Oh gosh, yes. Absolutely.
Well, that's the story of JC Dugard.
We would love to receive feedback from our listeners on what you have to say about this case or any other episode.
Be sure to DM us on Instagram and tell us what you think.
We'd love to hear your thoughts.
Absolutely.
Okay, Shelbs.
Well, guess what? Not only is this a wrap, but this wraps up our very last episode of our very first season of Dying to be Found. And we cannot thank you enough for the storyline requests, your support, DMs, likes, shares, reviews, and all that jazz over our first year.
I know I've said it a few times, but we have an awesome season two coming up. Be sure to check that out as we revamp, rework, and redesign versions of Dying to be Found, including our new bonus episodes called The Dash.
I'm not one to ask for too much from our listeners, but if you like what you hear, consider buying us a coffee by clicking on the link in our show notes.
And there you have it, Shelbs.
What a fun year.
Thank you so much for letting me be a part of this.
Absolutely. Thanks for agreeing to jump on board. I'm loving every minute of it.
Me too. Alrighty. Well, bye guys. Thank you for a great year. You are the reason why we're here.
Absolutely. We will talk to you soon.
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