SUMMARY KEYWORDS juana, homes, people, mother, killer, police, women, anna maria, victims, wrestling, stethoscope, serial killer, bit, murders, killing, began, podcast, thinking, profile SPEAKERS Deb, Beth Deb 00:04 Hi everyone. This is Deb from dying to be found. Before we get started. I just wanted to say that episodes contain disturbing discussions on harmful acts in crimes against animals and or humankind recordings are not intended for young are sensitive audiences due to the content nature of this podcast. Listener discretion is strongly advised. Well, hello everyone, this is Deb. Beth 00:30 And this is Beth. Deb 00:31 And we want to welcome you to episode number 33 of Dying to be Found. As always, we appreciate you joining us today. So thanks so much for being here. If you have a storyline you would like to hear just shoot us an email or you can now go to the link tree account in our show notes. There is a four or five question Google form that you can fill out asking for storyline requests. You can also visit our website at dyingtobefound.com spelled just like you see it on our logo. Before we get started checking in with Beth. I don't think I shared this with you yet Beth, but we've got stickers! Beth 01:09 Stickers, what's that all about? Deb 01:11 Look at our logo. Beth 01:13 Yes. Deb 01:14 So I ordered some stickers. Beth 01:16 Get outta here. Deb 01:18 I have some white ones and I have some black ones because I wanted to up the ante a little bit on some promotional items to our listeners. If you're interested in getting a sticker shoot us your address on Instagram and we'll be sure to mail you one or two. You might even get a handwritten thank you note for being loyal listeners. And Beth, I'm not going to leave you out. I'll send you some too. Beth 01:41 Good thank you. Deb 01:43 Absolutely. So I'm thinking if you want to sticker I would say the first 25 people that want to send us a shout out then by all means send us your address. We'll send you some stickers out there. That way, Beth to you will also have some giveaways for your friends. Beth 01:58 Thank you. Deb 01:59 You're welcome. Hey, anything new with you before we get started? Beth 02:02 Yeah, I'm heading out tomorrow afternoon during the day it's going to be really nice. And we're gonna hike some trails. Deb 02:08 So you're gonna go hiking? Beth 02:09 Yeah, we're gonna go hiking. Deb 02:11 All right, we're going get going because I know you have a busy schedule. On to our own podcast. Beth. I've been looking at our map of listeners and I wanted to branch out just a bit because we have a ton of listeners in North America and Europe, but today we're gonna travel south of the border into Mexico. Beth 02:31 Cool. Who are we going to talk about today Deb 02:34 We are going to talk about Juana Barraza who is a known serial killer who went on a killing spree in Mexico City. I'm going to give you a little bit of history on the killer back in 2005. This is a time period when Mexican authorities didn't really know who they had on their hands. They labeled whoever was going around killing older women. Let me see if I can get this right because I'm not really good at Spanish but I'm going to do my best. It was a serial killer known as El Mataviejita or old lady killer. They thought that this person was a man because in 2005 Beth, it was very uncommon for a woman to take over this title of a serial killer. You know, there's not a ton of women serial killers out there. It's more white males. Beth 03:27 Exactly. Deb 03:28 Well, throughout Mexico City, older women were being strangled with women's tights, phone cables, scarves, bare hands and even a stethoscope. What do you think of that? Beth 03:41 Well, I think that's really strange. The stethoscope but it was probably a doctor and nurse. Deb 03:48 Okay, well, you'll find out soon. It turned out that the killer was Juana Barraza. So, I'm going to actually talk about her childhood for just a moment give you a little bit of a background on her upbringing. Juan Dayanara Barraza was born into poverty in 1958 in Hidalgo, Mexico, just north of Mexico City. She grew up illiterate and never really got past being able to spell her own name Beth. I don't understand how kids can go through a school system and never learn more than how to spell their name. Beth 04:25 I don't understand it neither. She obviously didn't get help at home but you think the teacher would help her along. Deb 04:32 You would think. But then also, Beth, thinking about back in 1958, just from what I know from the Mexican culture, a lot of the times the boys tend to drop out of school somewhere around third or fourth grade. And sometimes girls do too because they always have to help around the house. Beth 04:52 Wow. Deb 04:53 Yep, they just get a third of fourth grade education and end up moving on. So I'm not really sure how much spelling she would have gotten at that age but I will move on to say that her father was Trinidad Barraza, whom she never knew because her mother left him when Juana was only three months old. And get this, Beth. She had left Juana's father for a married man who happened to be one as stepfather. Beth 05:22 That's sad. Deb 05:23 Yeah. Alright. So Juana's mother was Justa Samperio. So think about that for a moment. Juana's mother left her father she be with her own stepfather. That's just gross. Beth 05:39 It is. Well it turns out that one is mother, whose name is Justa Samperio. She was an alcoholic and a prostitute. During her upbringing. Justa barely even interacted with Juana whatsoever other than to beat her every day. Awww, poor thing. Deb 05:58 Yeah, so she does not have that bond for sure. Her mother's living in her own head. Beth 06:05 Right. Deb 06:06 Juana continued to get beaten every day until she was around the age of 13, Beth, when Justa sold Juana to an older man named Jose Luga, and get this...for three beers. Beth 06:21 That's crazy. Deb 06:23 Can you imagine a parent selling off a child for three beers? Beth 06:28 No, that poor little girl. Deb 06:30 She didn't have a head start in life did she? Beth 06:32 No, not at all. And it wasn't her own doing. Over the next five years. Juana was held captive by Lugo who tied her to his bed and repeatedly raped her every day. That's sicko. lt is. And the sad part, Beth, is that no one ever came looking for her. Because like I said, her mother was an alcoholic, and she told everyone that Juana had left on her own free will to be with Jose. Liar, liar pants on fire. Deb 07:02 Uh hum. Well, during this time span, Juana ended up becoming pregnant twice. Once at the age of 13 and again at 16. She eventually gave birth to one son during her capture, and she had miscarried that first time round. Juana's Uncle finally came to her rescue. He was able to track her down. He brought one back home again where she belonged. However, you can obviously say that the damage was already done. And at this point in her life, Beth Juana had a new hatred for...older women. Beth 07:37 Oh, I can see that. She had no buddy to look up to and and no role models. Deb 07:44 Yeah, no mother figure. Not a good one, anyway. Well, in her early life, wanna married multiple times and had a total of four children by three different fathers. Her oldest boy, the one that I had mentioned that she had while she was living in captivity, oh, Beth, this is so sad. He died at the age of 24 during a mugging where he was beaten to death with a baseball bat. Beth 08:08 Oh, that is brutal. Deb 08:11 I know. So she's just going through traumatic experiences one after another Beth 08:11 For sure. Deb 08:16 One is oldest daughter lived pretty close by so she did have at least one of her older children living within her vicinity. And the two younger children, a 13 year old boy and one 11 year old girl, they lived at home when Juana was eventually arrested. Beth 08:35 Those poor kids. They are going to follow on their mom's footsteps. Deb 08:39 Oh gosh, I hope not. Poor things but you're right. Interestingly enough, Beth, I'm going to once again kind of sidetrack just a little bit because this is kind of random. Juana was a well known female wrestler who engaged in Titanic wrestling known as Lucha Libra, or Mexican masked wrestling. Beth 09:00 What? Deb 09:02 She had gotten into the wrestling arena. I had to go to see what Titantic wrestling was all about. It's a type of wrestling that consists of battles that take place between a Techino, or in English terms, a good guy who fights by the rules or a Rudos, also known as a villain. Beth 09:24 Interesting. Deb 09:25 Yeah, so one wrestler is the good guy one wrestlers the bad guy. Take a guess on which one Juana portook in. Beth 09:31 She probably was the villain. Deb 09:33 Uh hum. She admitted that she was Rudos to the core. Beth 09:37 Wow. Deb 09:37 To me, that's a really good way to get your frustrations out. But yeah, get your aggressions out legally and competitively. Beth 09:47 Exactly. I agree because people do need to take out their frustrations, anxiety, just a day to day stress. And what are you doing for that? Deb 09:59 What am I doing for my stress levels? I don't really know I think I'm podcasting. I think I'm looking at these bad cases. So when Juana was not wrestling, she actually went to quite a bit of wrestling matches. I wanted to mention that she went by the stage name of La Dama del Silencio, also known as the Silent Lady. Later she told police that she went by this name because she considered herself to be quiet and often kept to herself. I mean, of course, unless she's out killing people, Beth Beth 10:33 Yeah. Deb 10:34 She earned about 500 pesos, which I had to go look that conversion up. It's $25 US Dollars or $33 Canadian dollars. She earned 500 pesos per night in her wrestling matches, but her wrestling career did and after she experienced a back injury. Could you imagine that type of entertainment? I'm going to call it an entertainment industry. She was only making $25 a night. Beth 11:03 That's crazy. Deb 11:04 You know she's living in poverty. Beth 11:06 Yes, but she's used to it so she probably was just thankful for what she was getting. Deb 11:11 Yeah, you're probably right. It at least got some groceries for the kids right. As she went on to work odd jobs like street vending, gelatin and socks. I thought that was interesting. I love socks man. She also did domestic work and then, get this. She went on to shoplifting, petty theft, and of course killing people Beth, to support her family. The four kids that she had, that was her livelihood is basically she transgressed from domestic work into shoplifting, petty theft and killing people to justify bringing money home to the children. Beth 11:44 I'm interested in hearing more about the shoplifting, petty theft and killing people and how she made money out of that. Deb 11:53 Let me start with this. By 1996. I'm glad you asked, she hatched a plan with one of her friends. Her friend's name was Aracelia Tapia Martinez. And they both began just basically stealing from elderly. Beth 12:09 Oh dear. Deb 12:10 Uh hum. Now you had mentioned it was interesting about stethoscopes earlier, eh? Beth 12:14 Yes. Deb 12:15 Well, Juana and her friend, Aracelia, would dress up as nurses in order to gain entry into elderly women's homes and then that's when they would rob them. Beth 12:27 Okay. Deb 12:27 Araceli and her boyfriend, however, turned on Juana, eventually, after Juan committed one burglary on her own without Araceli. I think that Araceli may have gotten ticked off. Araceli and her boyfriend came to Juana and demanded 12,000 pesos. That's 604 US dollars, or 786 Canadian dollars. They demanded 12,000 pesos from Juana or else she would get arrested. And do you know why she would get arrested? Beth 13:03 No. Deb 13:04 Did I mention era Sally's boyfriend was a corrupt police officer. Beth 13:08 No. Deb 13:09 Yep. So it sounds to me like they were hatching in their own plan to set Juana up. Beth 13:15 For goodness sakes. Deb 13:16 Yeah, so poor Juana. She's just not beating the odds here. And now she's got to come up with 12,000 pesos. And she's only making 25 per night. But of course, now she's got this back injury, o she can't even do that. Now, her killing spree did really start building up in 1998, because Juana's childhood trauma was beginning to catch up with her and she was ready for revenge. Remember, she had a tumultuous relationship with her mother. But in 1998, her mother had already passed away from cirrhosis of the liver. So she took a surrogate approach and began taking her anger out on other elderly women. Beth 14:00 That's so wrong. That's really hurtful. Deb 14:03 Yeah, well Juana dressed up very conservatively in professional looking outfits because she posed as a government worker, but eventually ended up killing a total of 11 elderly women in their homes, although she's suspected of killing upwards of 49. Beth 14:22 My goodness, even 11 is a lot. Deb 14:26 One is to many Beth. Beth 14:27 Yes. Deb 14:28 Well, Juana's reign of terror escalated between 2002 and 2006. But around 2003 is when the Mexican government really started paying attention to these murders. They set up a task force to catch the killer, and like I had mentioned, they had pegged the killer as El Mataviejita, or the man killer of old ladies. Beth 14:55 Okay. Deb 14:56 They didn't even suspect a woman. Beth 14:58 Who would? Deb 14:59 Right now. Juana's modus operandi, or also known as MO, was to attack women over the age of 60, who lived alone near public gardens or parks, and who were enrolled in government assistance programs. Her victims were strangled or bludgeoned to death, and they were often robbed. Now the killers profile from the Mexican authorities was to be that of a possible middle aged psychopath who was highly intelligent, clever, careful, organized and was probably abused as a child. I mean, it's so interesting. Beth 15:39 Don't they have her pegged? Deb 15:40 Right? That it's so interesting that they can profile these people so accurately. Beth 15:47 I'm very intrigued by profiling. They certainly know their stuff. Deb 15:52 I would think as to if they leave a calling card of sorts. I mean, they've been doing this a long time. However, there was that show on TV called the profiler way back in the day. I loved watching that one. Beth 16:03 Strange, I was just saying it's on our Netflix. Deb 16:06 You have to go see it. Beth 16:07 Was it good? Deb 16:08 Absolutely. So the profiles believed that whoever was going around killing these elderly ladies gained trust from their victims before attacking, and also believed that they posed as a government worker who entered people's homes under the guise that they would apply for government welfare. So remember how I told you that she dressed up conservatively? Beth 16:30 Yes. Deb 16:31 Yeah. So she's dressing professionally and going to elderly women's homes trying to convince them that they could sign up for welfare. By September of 2005 in, I would say somewhere in the middle of the year like mid 2005. Juana began a relationship with a taxi driver, and then the two of them began their crime spree together. So now that there were two accomplices Beth, the elderly lady killers MO changed from daytime to nighttime attacks. Beth 17:03 That will really mess with the profiling. Deb 17:06 Absolutely, because it's gonna throw the police completely off the scent. The couple ended up robbing and killing the mother of a prominent criminologist, which caused the police to launch a special operation where they began patrolling the areas where the killer was known to attack. Beth 17:25 Good for them. Deb 17:26 So again, they're looking for a man and so in that area, whether it was day or night at least they got the police patrolling, eh? Beth 17:33 Yes. Deb 17:34 By November 2005, eyewitnesses who helped to identify the elderly woman killer, stated that the perpetrator was a large woman. One eyewitness stated that they saw a woman in a red blouse, leaving one of the elderly women's houses who had found out later to be murdered. And keeping with their original beliefs, police felt that whomever was committing these crimes was a man dressed women's clothing. What do you think of that? Beth 18:06 That's pretty odd. Yeah. What would they do in the area they began investigating trans sex workers. Oh, however, they were very highly criticized for this because of their aggressive approach to the trans population. If you saw her picture, Beth, if you let looked up her wrestling picture, she's not a petite little woman. I was picturing her to be petite. Deb 18:30 She is really not. She's actually pretty buff. She's athletic. I can see how police might think that might be but again, they really once they zoned in on the trans population, that's kind of where they kept their focus. Over 40 transvestites and sex workers were arrested but get this. Not one suspect fit the fingerprint profile or the composite of the killer. So they had fingerprints on file. Beth 18:59 Oh that's good. That's great. Deb 19:02 Now, let me go ahead and tell you about her capture. On January 25, 2006, Juana was eventually caught in the act while she was fleeing from one of her victims homes, where she had just strangled Anna Maria de los Reyes Alfaro, with a stethoscope. Beth 19:22 There's a stethoscope. I guess she went back to her original - I don't want to use the word profile, but maybe that is the word. She went from being a nurse to somebody in suits, and now she's back to a nurse. Deb 19:39 Uh hum. So she's going back to her old ways. Well, Anna Maria had a roommate who had rented either an area in the back of the house or part of the apartment that she lived in. It was not entirely clear on the residence but Anna Maria did have a roommate. He was just coming home when he almost stumbled over Anna Maria's body in the living room and saw someone fleeing from the apartment. So he saw someone running away from the scene, Beth. This roommate immediately ran after the perpetrator and happened to come across two policemen patrolling the area, who quickly apprehended her. Beth 20:21 Fantastic. Yeah, so you remember I told you that the police were really starting to get that task force going. Yeah. Deb 20:29 That's why the police were patrolling. Beth 20:31 Wonderful. Deb 20:32 Now, they were able to apprehend her, like I said, very quickly, and during her interview, Juana admitted to the police that she had approached Anna Marie is home to ask for a glass of water. It creeps me out when neighbors I don't know come up to me. Beth 20:49 Yeah. Deb 20:50 I'm not letting anybody in my house, that's for sure. Beth 20:53 Well, one night here in the apartment, I had some stranger knock on the door at probably 2am. I looked through the people and it was a girl. I opened up the door and she was wanting to know if I wanted to buy any bagels. Deb 21:07 At one o'clock in the morning. Beth 21:09 Yes. Deb 21:10 Was she on crack? Beth 21:12 It looked like it. So I called the superintendent and I says, "You'd better hurry up and come up to this floor because she's going door to door and..." Deb 21:21 Oh my gosh, do they catch her? Beth 21:23 No, but I did recognize her in the laundry room just a couple of weeks ago. She is the tenant and she was cleaned up that time so I guess when she's partying at night she goes off psycho. Deb 21:38 Oh my god, Beth, you could have been stabbed. Beth 21:41 Mum told me not to open up the door to anyone again, so I'm not. Yeah, don't. Do you have a peephole? I do. And I don't have to answer but it's hard not to. Deb 21:52 You should get a little dog to warn you. Beth 21:54 No thank you. Deb 21:55 No thank you! All right. Once Juana entered the apartment, she entered the living room. There she saw a stethoscope lying on the coffee table. She picked it up and that's what she used to strangle Anna Maria with Beth 22:09 For goodness sakes. Deb 22:11 She was an elderly woman so I'm sure she had to have her heart monitored a little bit. So matter of convenience. It's not that she was carrying it around with her but I mean, I'm not going to dispute what you said because she has been known to go into people's homes dressed like a nurse. But this go round, she just happened to have a stethoscope in the area to pick up and use as a weapon. Beth 22:32 Okay. Deb 22:33 Now, police were stunned when they confronted Juana because at age 48, she had two reasons that were a little bit surprising to the policeman. Beth 22:45 Do tell. Deb 22:46 Number one, Juana was a woman. They've been looking for a man this whole time. Beth 22:53 Yes. Deb 22:54 They had been looking for a male serial killer for the past four years. But also Beth, I had mentioned she had that wrestling career. So Juana was already quite famous. She was a female wrestler I told you about his name was la dama del Silencio? Beth 23:11 Yes. And she preferred to wear a mask while she was wrestling to engage in the Titanic mock battles. Wearing a mask she would be incognito. So nobody would be fresh with her face. Deb 23:26 You know what I was thinking about that when I was doing my research and I was not thinking about that today when I'm telling you this story. That is good Beth. Beth 23:34 I'm a detective, you know. Deb 23:38 Amateur detectives. Beth 23:39 Yeah, all these crimes. That we're reading and talking about. Deb 23:44 And I am not a psychiatrist. Alright, looking back at police composite photos, the police did admit that wanna bore a striking resemblance to eyewitness accounts of what the perpetrator looked like. Including close cropped hair dyed blonde and an easily identifiable facial mole. Beth 24:05 Holy moley. Deb 24:07 Uh, no pun intended. Good one Beth. Upon Juana's possessions when she was apprehended was a stethoscope, a social worker ID Card, plus pension forms used to lure Juana's victims. Remember I said that she entered trying to get people to sign up for welfare. Beth 24:29 Yes. I'm glad that she had it in her possession. Deb 24:32 Yeah, absolutely. After Juana was arrested, police were able to link her through those fingerprints found at the scenes of at least 10 murders and up to possibly at least 40. Beth 24:47 Wonderful. Deb 24:48 Well, it's not so wonderful when you hear what she was charged with or what she was convicted for. When asked why she killed Anna Maria, Juana simply stated she got angry and Anna Maria made derogatory remarks. Beth 25:03 For goodness sakes. Deb 25:04 I think that goes back a little bit, Beth, for when she was growing up and her mother was beating her every day. She probably got a lot of verbal abuse as well. Beth 25:13 Yes. Deb 25:14 After Juana's arrest, she confessed that the reason behind her murdering elderly women was because she held a resentment toward her alcoholic mother and the abuse that she endured when she was a child. Gosh, like I just said. Beth 25:29 Well, that's kind of surprising to me. I figured she targeted the elderly woman simply because they were an easy target. It never dawned on me that she was thinking of her mother. Oh for goodness sakes. Deb 25:39 Yep. She admitted to cruising public places to scope for those elderly women, Beth. And then she would gain their trust by helping them with the groceries or offering to clean their homes. Other times Juana posed as a nurse or social worker and offered to come to her victims homes to give free checkups or give information on government benefits. Once she gained access to her victims homes, Juana would immediately attack. Other times, she would wait until they got distracted before she began to strangle them. If they were not distracted, Beth, she would beat them first. Juana eventually went to trial in early 2008. During the proceedings Juana tried to claim insanity and would only admit to one murder. The one that she was caught red handed with with Anna Maria. This is the only one that she ever fessed up to. Beth 26:23 Wow. Deb 26:23 Juana stated that she was a scapegoat in all the other murders besides the one that she had admitted to so, she was not taking ownership for anything. Beth 26:52 No, it sounds like she's getting scared now. Deb 26:54 Yeah. A court appointed psychiatrist deemed Juana sane and fit to stand trial because she knew what she was doing when she committed her crimes. Yeah, she did. Beth 27:06 For sure. Deb 27:07 Juana is quoted as saying when I saw them I felt much anger and more when they acted uppity or believed that because of their money, they could humiliate me. So I'm assuming when she was talking with Anna Maria when Anna Maria had said something derogatory that she got angry, so maybe she was feeling humiliated. Beth 27:30 Very true. Good point. Deb 27:32 On March 31, Wanda was convicted of 11 murders based on those fingerprints found at the scenes of the victims. Although she only fessed up to one she was still convicted of 11. Beth 27:43 Great. Deb 27:44 She was tried for a total of 30 minutes before a sentence was passed down for her to serve 759 years in prison, which is the longest sentencing in all of Mexico's history. Beth 27:59 Wow. I was thinking that was a lot of years and I never heard of such a thing. Deb 28:04 I'd have to do the math and I'm not really good at that. So I'll do that a little bit later and I'll figure out okay, if she was, you know, 11 Murders, 759 years, how many years did she get per? Juana is eligible for parole, Beth, in 2058. She will be 100 years old. Beth 28:23 Wow. Deb 28:23 She will be the elderly lady then. Beth 28:25 Won't she? Deb 28:27 Uh hum. During the sentencing, Juana showed very little emotion, but later stated that she planned to appeal. Beth 28:33 That's a joke. Deb 28:34 Yeah, it is. The list of one is victims is pretty lengthy because Juana's reign lasted between 1995 and 2006. Like I'd mentioned there are believed to be over 40 victims. So I'm gonna go ahead and add the link into our show notes because I found a really good site. There are so many baths I know I feel like I have to say names of victims, but I'm gonna go ahead and add that to our show notes and there is an area if you scroll down there's going to be a box inside of there. You will be able to see all of the victims. One of the reasons that I'm not going to mention them all Beth is because I really do not know how to speak Spanish very well. I do not want to chop up their names. Beth 29:17 Well, that's nice of you to recognize the people. So thank you for putting that up. Deb 29:22 Sure. No, problem. And on that note, this is what I found on Juana Barraza. The El Mataviejita, or old lady killer, la dama del Silencio also known as a silent lady in her wrestling career. So what are your thoughts? Beth 29:40 Well, this is a very intriguing case, especially since it it was a female. It's uncommon. It was a very intriguing story. Deb 29:49 Yeah, I wanted to do something different. Beth 29:51 Yeah. And going into another country like Mexico like you did, just gave us another little aspect of another part of the world. So thank you. Deb 30:00 Absolutely. Beth 30:01 And at this moment, I'm wondering if you have a teachable moment? Deb 30:04 Well, of course I do. I recently had a conversation with someone who said that they heard that you can tell one's character by how you treat people. Yes, I agree with that. Beth 30:16 Yes, me too. Deb 30:17 She gave me an example of talking to custodians, Beth. I don't know if you've ever come across custodians where you work? Beth 30:24 Oh, yes. I like to chat with them. Deb 30:26 Oh, yeah. I also help them that empty the trash cans in my room and trying to clean up as much as I can. I just say if you work an honest living I don't care what your job title is. In this conversation that I was having with this person, you should always treat everyone with the same level of respect. I completely agree with that. Well, last year, the same person, Beth, happened to mention that you are bound to cross paths with at least one serial killer in your lifetime. Did you know that? Beth 30:59 What? Deb 30:59 She took a forensics class and learned that. I don't know if I told you I actually did work with somebody who killed someone once. Beth 31:06 Did you really? Deb 31:07 I did. I'll have to tell you about that another day. But yeah, keep our listeners guessing. too. Yeah, so I guess I agree with that to a certain extent. Beth 31:15 I don't. Deb 31:16 You don't agree with that? Beth 31:17 No. Deb 31:19 Tell me why. Beth 31:20 Because there are so many people in the world. How are you going to be the one that you're gonna cross paths with? Deb 31:26 Apparently that didn't pick you out. It could have been that girl that you opened the door for to buy bagels from at 1am. So my point is, be kind and kindness will always follow you back. Well, not always. But be kind and kindness will follow you back. Beth 31:42 Yes, very true. Deb 31:44 Besides that, you never know who that serial killer may be and you don't want to be put into a compromising position. Beth 31:52 No, you don't. Deb 31:53 You sure don't. So that's my teachable moment. And that's all I got. Beth 31:58 Well, thank you, Deb. And that's a wrap. Deb 31:59 That is a wrap. And we want to thank you for listening to Dying to be Found. Before we go we would love for you to leave a review on your favorite podcast platform. That really helps in the rankings. Be sure to follow us on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook and Pinterest at Dying2bfound. You can access our website, email, social media and storyline request form by clicking on our link tree account found in our show notes. If you like our episodes, consider buying us a coffee at buy me a coffee.com/dyingtobefound spelled just like you see on our logo. Feel free to message us on Instagram and let us know how we're doing. With that, be sure to check back every Thursday wherever you get your podcasts, and we will talk to you next week. Beth 32:28 Bye