I'm Carmen.
And I'm Joanna.
And we want to introduce you to our podcast, Live, Laugh, Murder.
On our podcast, I, Carmen, tell my co-host Joanna, say hey.
Hey girl.
I tell her a story and it is not always true crime.
We are true crime with a twist.
With a twist.
Like a twist.
Got it.
The twist here is that sometimes the stories I tell Joanna are true crime and sometimes
they are the plot of a creepy movie.
So listen in and join us as we tease Joanna to see if she can figure out which is which
because she is not the creepy movie buff or the true crime enthusiast.
Nope.
And can you figure it out as well?
Yeah.
So that's us.
Join us.
Live, Laugh, Murder podcast and we love you.
You won't be disappointed.
Hi everyone.
This is Deb from Dying to be Found.
Before we get started, I just wanted to say that episodes contain disturbing discussions
on harmful acts and crimes against animals and or humankind.
Recordings are not intended for young or sensitive audiences due to the content nature of this
podcast.
Listener discretion is strongly advised.
Hi everyone.
It's Deb.
And I'm Beth.
And we want to welcome you to episode number 19 of Dying to be Found.
We're so glad you're here today.
Beth and I are addressing a wide range of true crime cases.
But if you have a story that you would like to hear, please email us at dying the number
two the letter B found at gmail.com.
Before we get started, Beth, we wanted to give a shout out to one of our new friends
in true crime.
We found a really good new podcast that we think our listeners will enjoy and it's called
Live, Laugh, Murder with Carmen and Joanna.
Beth, what do you think of it?
I think it's really cool.
And another cool thing is my son Adam actually listens to it.
That's cool.
So be sure to check that out.
And in the meantime, before we get started on our own story today, Beth, what's going
on with you?
Well, I kid you not, this is going to sound like a joke, but I was in my stamp room this
morning and I was moving things around looking for something as always.
And my head hit the wreath that I have hanging on my door.
That particular wreath usually gets put outside in the summer, but it won't now because when
I banged my head out popped a cookie with teeth marks.
A cookie.
What kind of cookie?
It was just a plain, what do you think happened?
I think one of your kids from way back when was eating a cookie and they decided to play
hide and seek with it.
Uh, wrong.
No?
No.
I don't know.
What happened is I knew immediately it came from a squirrel because I live in an apartment
on the second floor and we have a resident squirrel.
He sprawls himself out to sun and he doesn't even move when, when I'm a foot away from
him.
He's that friendly.
Are you telling me he's gotten into your apartment?
Not into the apartment.
He crawls up the bricks to get to our second floor balcony.
That is so cute.
You all know I'm one with nature.
That is so adorable.
Do you have a name for him?
He needs a name.
No, I don't, but he can be a PESC.
So he must've had the cookie and put it into my wreath because it is a big wreath.
So he was probably squirreling his food away.
Oh my gosh.
The same squirrel when it was raining a couple of weeks ago, I was sitting there watching
TV and knitting.
I happened to glance out the window.
I was eye to eye level with that squirrel.
Oh, that is so cute.
Now is it one of those really, really big black squirrels?
Yes it is.
I think they are so beautiful.
We don't get those where I live.
Well, it sat on the top of my chair and it was looking in at me.
Oh, I kid you not.
He just does that when it rains.
I had two other people, we were all up against the glass and his nose was almost touching
the glass.
It's like he wanted to come in.
Oh, poor little thing.
You should have let him in if he's that friendly.
No, and then he'll get into everything and then it'll turn out bad.
But in here in Canada, we often use the outdoors in the garage or our balcony as a second fridge
in the winter or freezer, depending on the temperatures.
I can't even do that anymore because I had all kinds of Christmas baking out with my
Tupperware containers.
And guess what?
Oh gosh.
It all went to the squirrel.
Not quite, but I had to get rid of it anyways.
It chewed through all my Tupperware lids.
Goodness.
Okay.
He is a pest.
Yeah.
I'm sure he's cute and adorable, but I guess there is a fine line between what he's doing
and being a pest for sure.
For sure.
Oh God.
That's such a cute story though.
So what do you have for us today?
Oh goodness.
So we're going to take a trip.
Where are we going today?
Have you ever been to Hawaii?
No.
Okay.
Neither have I.
What do you know about Hawaii?
Anything?
Well, just what I saw on Dog the Bounty Hunter.
I used to follow that show.
Me too.
I was going to say the same thing.
That and I guess Hawaii Five-O, right?
Oh yes.
Gosh.
You know, they have a updated version of that show.
I've never watched it, but I did once.
All right.
So we are going to go to Hawaii and a lot of people think that this is an excellent
vacation destination full of blue water, volcanoes, beautiful beaches.
But after this story, you'll understand that there are really some seedy areas on the island.
And just like our last story, Beth, when I talked about the increased population in Anchorage
with the Alaskan pipeline, Hawaii was in the middle of a massive telecommunications boom
in Oahu, Hawaii between 1985 and 86.
So there was just an influx of people moving to the area.
And it was also the home to a large military base.
On top of that, Hawaii was a host to 10.5 million tourists in the mid 80s.
So very popular destination.
Wow.
That's a lot.
Well, between 1985 and 1986, the state of Hawaii also encountered their first serial
killer who came to be known as the Honolulu Strangler.
And during this time, the strangler killed five women and some of these cases still remain
unsolved today.
Well, let me start setting up the scene of the island where several of the victims were
found.
Kehi Lagoon was a popular but secluded area of Honolulu and it is an easy access to the
Pacific Ocean and has several smaller islands close by.
Unfortunately, this area is where the Honolulu Strangler preferred to leave his victims,
likely because of how secluded it was.
I have never really taken a look at the map and how the islands are laid out.
I know there's just so many that you can go look at.
I'm going to start going through this story and then I'll start talking about who they
believe the strangler is because believe it or not, Beth, this is an unsolved case.
The authorities think they know who it was, but they've just never had clear evidence
on this.
With the island being so small, I'm so surprised that they have it unsolved.
I know.
And you're going to probably wonder the same things as me as we start talking about who
the suspect was.
I'm perplexed as to why it's still unsolved today.
So victim number one was Vicki Gale Purdy.
And Vicki was originally from North Carolina.
She was 25 years old and married for five years to a helicopter pilot and chief warrant
officer Beth for the United States Army.
The couple had been stationed in Hawaii for somewhere around 16 months and Vicki worked
at a local video rental store.
Remember rental stores?
Yes.
She was known to have quite a sassy personality.
She loved to dance and often went out to the clubs with her friends without her husband
Gary.
This was a pretty regular routine and Vicki was usually home somewhere around nine o'clock
every night.
So I guess he's working on the base and if he's a helicopter pilot, I'm sure that he
probably had some extended days away, just like most military people.
So she had a group of friends that she would go out with.
On May 29th, 1985, Vicki had called her friends to make plans for the evening, but never showed
up to where they had agreed to meet.
When Vicki did not appear at home, her husband Gary began paging her, but she never answered.
And the next morning her car was found abandoned at a local hotel with a fresh dent in the
side, Beth and a local cab driver had said that he had dropped her off at this area somewhere
around midnight.
I don't know where she would have been if she was being dropped off at midnight, but
she never showed up with her friends.
Exactly.
Especially since she was usually home by 9 PM every night.
Yeah.
And then there was really not much on the dent on the car, but I wonder too, if maybe
she was, what do you call that?
Not sabotaged.
I don't know why she would have had the dent.
There was not much on that that I could find.
Well, on May 30th of 1985, Vicki was found deceased, laying in an embankment near the
Cahee Lagoon.
She was wearing the same yellow jumpsuit that she had worn the night before when she was
going out with her friends.
Her hands had been tied behind her back and it was evident upon her autopsy that she had
been raped and strangled with a ligature.
Do you know what a ligature is?
I do, but maybe our folks listening don't.
Yeah.
So ligature could be a tie, a rope, anything that you would wrap around somebody's neck
to strangle them as opposed to just using your hands.
Okay.
Evidence from the autopsy showed that Vicki fought really hard with her assailant to try
to pull that rope away.
Bless her heart.
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, as police began their investigation, they wondered if someone had an obsession
with Vicki because the video store she had worked at was known to rent pornographic videos.
Well, the video store actually had a bad reputation bath of seedy characters coming in because
just six months earlier, two employees had been stabbed to death.
Now that's creepy.
I wouldn't think I'd want to even visit that store.
The likelihood of encountering some more seedy characters was just too much after two deaths.
She may not have been aware of it because if she was an army wife and a lot of the time
they just pick up jobs here and there because their husbands move so frequently, she may
not have known the history because she'd only been on the island for 16 months.
Good point.
Well, regardless on the police's theories on who may have had the obsession with her,
police did believe that Vicki was ambushed before she made it to her car.
And you know what?
A thought just occurred to me.
What?
There was a fresh dent in the car, but I could not find any information on that dent.
Did somebody sabotage her with another vehicle?
Or was it an imprint of a struggle?
Oh yes.
And possibly Vicki trying to ward off her assailant.
Well Gary described Vicki as street smart and was always aware of her instincts, knowing
who she should and should not trust.
I'm going to tell you, I have that too.
I don't know how you are, but I feel like I can read people pretty well and I definitely
go with my gut feelings.
Hopefully it turns out to be true.
That's good thinking.
And Gary also believed that there may have been more than one person involved because
he believed that his wife was a tough cookie.
He had admitted that even one time during their marriage, she basically knocked the
crap out of him.
So yeah, sassy little personality.
Very.
And she definitely put up a fight.
That was unfortunate.
Yes.
Now, victim number two is Regina Sakamoto.
She was 17 years old, who was originally born in Kansas, and she was a senior in high school
and had plans to attend Hawaii Pacific University that fall.
Regina was last heard from on January 14th of 1986 when she phoned her boyfriend at 715
that morning, Beth, from a phone booth to say that she had missed her bus to the high
school, but she had planned to catch a local transit.
Okay, Beth, I can't tell you how many times Kathy and I would ride the public transit
in and around the city as teenagers.
You're talking about 13, 14, 15 year olds, just free reign around the city, going to
the skating rink, going to the park.
If I'm familiar with that area, you just can't be too careful because as we go on, you'll
see that this is going to be probably one of the top patterns that's happening in this
story.
So witnesses that morning stated that she had been seen at one of the bus stops waiting
for the bus, but some speculation is that she may have accepted a ride from someone.
Yeah, I can't imagine because of the amount of times that I have been on the public transit
system and you don't think anything about it.
No.
Regina was described by her brother as bookish, smart, and everyone's friend.
Her parents did not report her missing though, Beth, until after Regina was expected to be
home from school, but she never showed up.
Later Regina's stepfather said that there was a high population of transients taking
the bus system and that she would have stood out as a young Caucasian female, especially
if she was traveling alone.
Yeah, that gives me the willies, especially knowing how many times I've done that myself.
Right.
Well, Regina had been missing for about a month when in February of 1986, she was found
by three teenagers in a drainage canal near the Kahee Lagoon, which was about one mile
from where Vicki Purdy had been found.
And it was also near the airport.
And that's going to be an important fact to come up in just a little bit.
Well, her hands were also tied behind her back with parachute cord.
And just like Vicki, Regina had also been raped and strangled.
Unlike Vicki, Regina was discovered still wearing a blue tank top and a white sweatshirt,
but was nude from the waist down.
And one of her feet was tied to a rock with an electrical cord.
Now that's creepy.
Yeah.
I don't know what the connection is.
No.
Was it trying to slow her down?
Was it trying to keep her in one area with the tide?
Using your phrase, that sounds ominous.
Oh yes.
The autopsy also revealed that Regina had high levels of acid phosphatase in her vagina,
which suggested that she was assaulted by a man who was unable to ejaculate due to having
a vasectomy.
Well, after Regina was found, the Honolulu police began treating both Regina's and Vicki's
siblings as a serial killer because the killer's MO was identical between the two women.
So we're going to move on to victim number three.
The third victim was 21 year old Denise Hughes from Washington state.
She also was a military wife and worked as a secretary with a telephone company because
again, Beth, I had told you that telecommunications was really booming during that period.
Oh yes.
So she was working with a telephone company and coworkers described Denise as always having
a smile on her face.
On February 1st, 1986, just two weeks after Regina was discovered, Denise was also found
by three fishermen near the Mauna Loa stream, which flows into Cahee lagoon and is also
close to the airport.
I had mentioned Beth that that was a clue right there.
Now this is quite different, however, from the two victims because this time Denise was
discovered in a blue tarp wearing a blue dress.
However, just like the other two victims, Denise also had her hands tied behind her
back with parachute cord and was also found to be strangled.
Remember she was found on February 1st.
Well, on February 5th, Denise was identified through her dental records and the autopsy
could not determine if she had been raped, but it seemed likely that she had just because
the MO is very, very close to the other victims.
Well, after this third killing, police immediately set up a task force consisting of 27 police
officers with expertise in sex crimes and homicide.
Both the FBI and the Green River task force were also called in to assist.
Do you know anything about the Green River task force, Beth?
I heard of it, wasn't it to do with the Green River killings?
It was, yeah.
It was the task force that was set up to hunt for Gary Ridgeway, the Green River killer.
Okay.
It's kind of interesting how the cases that we are finding always seem to have the FBI
agent that started profiling people, the Red Baron, and now the Green River task force.
I thought that was interesting when I was doing this research.
It is.
Well, two-way radios were set up between the public transit system and the police station
so that drivers could call if they saw something.
And remember, this was in the eighties, so there was no such thing as a cell phone back
then.
Because the first three killings occurred near the Honolulu International Airport, police
set up a sting operation where women police officers were posing as single traveling women,
but nothing really came out of fruition on this and they dropped that rather quickly.
A profile of this killer was developed and here's what the task force had determined.
The killer was between age 30 and 40 years old, was Caucasian or mixed race.
He was an opportunist who attacked women when they were most vulnerable, such as when they
were walking to their car or waiting alone at a bus stop.
He drove or owned a cargo van.
The killer was not a stalker, but likely engaged in conversation with his victims.
He must have lived near Waipahu or Sand Islands and had no criminal record.
He may have been experiencing relationship problems and selected his victims based on
chance or opportunity.
Yeah, Beth, how interesting that they come up with these profiles based on the clues
that they have.
It always surprises me what they can come up with for profiling.
I know.
And you'll see in just a little while too how accurate this is.
Unfortunately, we had another victim though and her name was Luis Medeiros.
Luis was 25 years old.
She was traveling alone from Oahu to Waipahu to meet her family for the reading of her
mother's will following her recent passing, Beth.
Oh, that's very sad.
Yes.
Well, Luis was considered rebellious during her teenage years and chose to go out on her
own as a teenager to live with friends.
However, she had eventually grown out of that rebellion and had a really good relationship
with her family.
On March 26th of 1986, she had originally taken a flight to Oahu and planned to take
the public transit bus system the rest of the way to her apartment.
She had told her friends these plans, but she never made it home, Beth.
On April 2nd of 1986, Luis was discovered under an overpass near construction site near the
Waikili stream, which was just 12 miles away from where Denise Hughes had been found.
Unfortunately, Beth, Luis was three months pregnant.
That's a sad case.
Absolutely.
Well, just like Regina Sakamoto, Luis was found nude from the waist down and her hands
were tied behind her back just like the others.
Unfortunately, due to her body decomposition, the medical examiner could not determine if
she was sexually assaulted.
Now, we're going to move on to the last victim here.
This was Linda Pesky and Linda was 36 years old, last seen alive on April 29th of 1986.
Her roommate had reported her missing and said that Linda had failed to show up for
a work meeting that day.
By day two, Linda had not reported to work and her light blue Toyota car was found abandoned
near the local interstate highway.
Police believed that Linda had left her car after it had broken down and went to a nearby
bus stop to get back to her house.
However, eyewitnesses stated they had seen a car with its emergency lights flashing and
another cream colored car was parked beside it.
The car was American made and had very distinct black letters in the back window.
Officers by also stated that the person seen possibly assisting Linda was a medium built
Caucasian or mixed race male in his thirties or forties, which fit the profile that the
police had determined after Denise Hughes was discovered way back in February.
Beth, you had just mentioned on how accurate these profiles can be and right there that
is spot on.
It is uncanny.
Yes, there was one weird thing about this case that did not occur with the other women
though.
An anonymous white male had reported to the police that a psychic had told him that Linda
could be located on Sand Island, which was a tiny island located at the entrance of the
Honolulu Harbor.
Interesting that we're talking about psychics, Beth, because again, we just talked about
psychics in our last episode.
It's always fun to hear about psychics.
Well on May 3rd of 1986, the police went to Sand Island and discovered Linda's partially
covered body on a dirt road with a cement block on her back.
That's a little different.
Yeah, very random.
Yes.
She was also found with her hands tied behind her back and unfortunately she was raped and
strangled just like the other four victims.
And similar to Regina Sakamoto, Linda also had high levels of phosphatase around her
genitals.
So the Honolulu police were working very hard to catch whoever was killing young women in
this area.
They set up roadblocks in multiple areas around the city, but unfortunately did not get many
leads at one of the roadblocks though.
A driver said that they had seen a white or mixed race male driving Linda Pesky's car.
Another witness stated that he had seen a light colored van near that car the night
that it was abandoned.
At this point, Beth, the police warned women to be on high alert and to avoid any public
transit systems.
For sure.
Yeah, I would definitely at this point go in pairs if you could.
I don't know what to do if you're traveling by air, but definitely go in pairs.
So I kind of want to move on to who they think the suspect could be in this case, Beth.
And again, the profile is very spot on.
So I'm going to actually talk about who the police were feeling was the prime suspect
in this case, Beth, and you will be absolutely amazed with how accurate their profiling is.
The prime suspect is Howard Andrew Gay.
And on May 9th, 1986, police made their first arrest.
This was 43 year old Howard Andrew Gay, a mechanic who lived in Iwa Beach and reported
to the police, Beth, that the psychic had told him where to find Linda.
Howard actually took police originally to Iwa Beach in an effort to be helpful.
Wow.
I know he's here sometimes where the killer likes to get in the crowd and be an observer.
Yeah.
So he thought he would be helpful to take police to the beach, but police noticed he
had avoided one particular area of the beach.
He originally took them to one spot, but they did not find Linda there.
The police eventually went to another area where it looked like Howard was deliberately
avoiding and guess what?
What?
That's where they found Linda Pesky's body.
Oh my, that sounds like he's guilty.
For sure.
I mean, that's a little sketchy.
Well, Howard's girlfriend, when she was interviewed after he was arrested, told the police that
he had an unusual fetish of bondage and specifically enjoyed tying her up with her hands tied behind
her back.
Bingo.
Yep.
His ex-wife told the police that anytime they got into an argument, he would leave the house
and not come back again until the morning bath, which was allegedly the same night that
all of these murders took place.
Wow.
That's just too coincidental.
Very.
And the sightings of the cream colored van and the Caucasian or mixed race of the suspect,
too many coincidences to me.
Well, as the police continued to investigate, they found that Howard frequented the local
sailing club.
Workers there felt that he had somewhat odd behaviors.
This white or mixed raced man was also said to be a regular and his MO was to talk to
Petit Brunette, many of which were the victims of this Honolulu killer.
I believe that looking at the pictures of the victims, all but one were Petit and Brunette.
Just too many things are adding up here.
Yeah.
Well, employees of the sailing club also stated that Howard had an unusual obsession with
one of their coworkers that fit the same description of the victims.
She was Petit and she was Brunette.
So this employee always went with her gut feeling and told the police that Howard often
stared at her and frequently offered her rides home, which she constantly refused.
And there was one report, Beth, where he had asked her if she needed a ride.
She refused, but she took another ride from another customer and Howard had gotten really
upset about that.
Oh yeah.
So she was going with her gut feeling.
I say always listen to that for sure.
Deb, I'm now really intrigued and hearing more about this Howard Andrew Gay.
Yeah.
Well, good for you because I found some more information on him and this was just great
timing because I was going to mention that Howard Gay was born on January 1st of 1943
and was originally from Buffalo, New York.
At one point he was stationed at George Air Force Base in California where he did serve
in the military.
He was honorably discharged in 1965 and began his career as a telephone lineman before working
as a mechanic in Hawaii.
Howard was married to his college sweetheart, Rita Thompson, and with her he had two sons,
Justin and Jason.
However, Howard and Rita eventually divorced in 1983, just a couple years before everything
began happening in Hawaii.
Howard did have a vasectomy at one point and he had no criminal record.
Working at the air freight as a mechanic at the airport, Beth, Howard likely had access
to parachute cord.
He drove a cream colored van.
So when Howard was eventually arrested in connection with the killings, at one point
during his 10 hour interrogation, Howard had taken a polygraph test that came up inconclusive.
And we talked before on some of the questioning and the wording and the phrases on what they
use.
So it didn't come up as deceptive.
It just came up as inconclusive.
Police felt that they did not have enough evidence to arrest Howard and ended up letting
him go because any evidence they did collect throughout this case was circumstantial.
Okay, backing up here.
Why?
Why is it circumstantial if you have eyewitnesses and he fits that profile to a T?
Exactly.
There's just too many things pointing directly to him.
So police felt that they didn't have enough evidence.
They did let him go because, oh, okay.
Well, here's another thought.
Are you ready?
Yes, I'm ready.
Linda Pesky, the fifth victim here, her boss had written Howard's name down at her office
as a prospect to conduct business with later.
Wow.
They directly linked Howard, Andrew Gay with one of the victims in this case before he
reported to the police that a psychic had told him where to find her body.
How is that circumstantial?
Is it because that the polygraph came back inconclusive and he never confessed?
Could be.
Well, two months later, a woman came to the police to say that she had witnessed the killer
and Linda Pesky together on the night of April 29th.
Police called Howard back in and placed him in a lineup where this witness positively
identified him.
However, this is as far as it went because after she identified Howard Gay, she refused
to cooperate anymore or press charges because she had said that the killer saw her on the
same night of April 29th and she was afraid that he would come after her.
What do you think of that?
That's sad.
That's really sad that she feared him because I was wondering why she wasn't coming up with...
Yeah, I don't know if they ever let all these people go or if they would immediately arrest
them after the lineup.
I mean, wouldn't they just immediately?
I don't know enough about the criminal justice system to know if he would have been arrested
immediately after being identified in the lineup, but I kind of understand where she's
coming from.
You would think so because otherwise he could run and flee the country.
So true.
I never thought of that.
I never thought about that.
Yeah.
And he is on the islands.
I mean, all he has to do is a quick skip and jump over to the main continent, right?
Yes.
Well, the police did end up monitoring Howard for several more years, Beth, years, not just
months.
They could never get enough evidence in any of the cases to arrest him.
In June of 1986, so this was about a year after the last murder, Howard went to California
to see one of his sons, Jason, graduate from high school.
And unfortunately, I don't wish this upon my worst enemy, Beth.
While he was visiting, Jason was killed in a car accident.
Oh, that's very sad.
It is.
Unfortunate.
Yeah.
It was said that soon after this occurrence that Howard became a born again Christian,
which is why these killings may have ceased.
And Howard Andrew Gay died of kidney failure in November of 2003 at the age of 60 and was
never charged in any of these murders.
And that is the story of the Honolulu Killer.
The end.
That was very intriguing.
What I was curious about is could they not get DNA off of phosphatase?
That is a great question.
And today is a day and age.
Absolutely.
They could probably exhume his body if he was not cremated.
I didn't find if he was buried or not, but yeah, we know obviously in 1986, they did
not have DNA like they do today, but you're right.
And genealogy, genealogical DNA is also another way.
She's got other family members that I'm sure could probably see or could probably contribute
to that.
Yes.
But of course, you know, I didn't find anything after the fact that he had passed away and
I didn't look much further than that.
So Deb, do you have a teachable moment for us today?
Teachable moment?
Yes, Beth, I think I do.
It's really going with your gut instinct and using common sense.
I know in today's day and age, there's so many different ways to travel and just going
with your gut instinct.
And if you get the willy nilly's on anybody whose path you cross, go with the gut instinct.
Tell someone, walk up to someone and pretend that like, you know them.
Let me give you an example.
I was downtown at a convention and I had some people with me who noticed that somebody was
following them through a mall.
Are you kidding me?
I am not kidding you.
Nope.
And they use their instinct, which was phenomenal because they literally walked up to another
shopper and began talking with them like they knew them.
So anytime that you get in a situation, especially if you're by yourself, don't be afraid to
walk up to somebody and tell them that somebody is following me or pretend like you know them.
They might look at you funny, but who cares?
That could be a matter of between life and death.
Exactly.
Yes.
Yep.
So there we have it.
That's my teachable moment.
Use your gut instinct and don't be afraid to have people look at you funny.
And with that...
And that's a wrap.
That is a wrap.
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We'll talk to you next Thursday.
Bye!