1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,040 Hi everyone, this is Deb from Dying to be Found. 2 00:00:03,040 --> 00:00:12,340 Before we get started, I just wanted to say that episodes contain disturbing discussions on harmful acts and crimes against animals and or humankind. 3 00:00:12,340 --> 00:00:18,560 Recordings are not intended for young or sensitive audiences due to the content nature of this podcast. 4 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:34,060 Listener discretion is strongly advised. 5 00:00:34,060 --> 00:00:36,860 Hi everyone, I'm Deb and I'm Shelby. 6 00:00:36,860 --> 00:00:42,460 Welcome back to Dying to be Found where each week I get together with different family members. 7 00:00:42,460 --> 00:00:51,060 Today, my daughter Shelby is here to listen to an unsolved crime that Shelby is going to go all the way back to the 1970s. 8 00:00:51,060 --> 00:00:54,760 I know you had mentioned before we started recording that you had not heard of this. 9 00:00:54,760 --> 00:00:56,960 First of all, I want to wish you a happy new year. 10 00:00:56,960 --> 00:00:59,160 Can you believe it's already 2024? 11 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:00,260 No. 12 00:01:00,260 --> 00:01:01,560 Oh my gosh. 13 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:02,960 This year has flown by. 14 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:04,460 Time flies when you're having fun. 15 00:01:04,460 --> 00:01:07,560 I wouldn't call it fun. 16 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:08,060 Busy. 17 00:01:08,060 --> 00:01:09,160 It's been busy. 18 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:12,360 Yeah, but I do want to say it was amazing. 19 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:14,960 To come up your way this holiday season. 20 00:01:14,960 --> 00:01:19,760 I got to see the town where I began my teaching career. 21 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:22,360 I got to see your awesome new restaurant. 22 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:23,260 How's that going? 23 00:01:23,260 --> 00:01:24,760 It's going wonderful. 24 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:29,760 We have been closed this week just to kind of give everybody a break after the holidays. 25 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:32,860 So starting Tuesday, we'll be back up and running. 26 00:01:32,860 --> 00:01:33,260 Yep. 27 00:01:33,260 --> 00:01:34,660 Oh, you're a good boss. 28 00:01:34,660 --> 00:01:35,860 That's nice. 29 00:01:35,860 --> 00:01:40,760 And interesting fact, the retail space that you have is where I used to get my hair done. 30 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:42,260 So I thought that was pretty cool. 31 00:01:42,260 --> 00:01:44,160 Oh my gosh. 32 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:50,860 Yeah, it was a nightmare cleaning that place to turn it from a hair salon that had been a hair salon for, 33 00:01:50,860 --> 00:01:55,760 I don't know, at least 15 years, I would say, maybe even longer and turning that into a restaurant. 34 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:58,460 Yeah, but you guys opened pretty quickly. 35 00:01:58,460 --> 00:02:00,160 So good for you. 36 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:00,860 All right. 37 00:02:00,860 --> 00:02:06,760 Remember how I have always told you that you will learn a lot about your mother on this podcast? 38 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:07,260 Yes. 39 00:02:07,260 --> 00:02:11,060 Well, I have a little story for you before we get into our case. 40 00:02:11,060 --> 00:02:13,260 Now, you know that I grew up Catholic. 41 00:02:13,260 --> 00:02:17,260 So I still recall quite a bit about Catholicism. 42 00:02:17,260 --> 00:02:20,060 Did you know that I attended Catholic school when I was young? 43 00:02:20,060 --> 00:02:20,860 I did not. 44 00:02:20,860 --> 00:02:21,760 I did. 45 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,860 It was a public Catholic school, but it was a Catholic school just the same. 46 00:02:25,860 --> 00:02:32,960 And I'll tell you, there was one day that we all went on a field trip to the local All Girls Catholic High School. 47 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:38,160 And Shelby, I actually came home and I begged your grandmother to let me go there. 48 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:39,260 Oh, wow. 49 00:02:39,260 --> 00:02:39,960 I know. 50 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:42,660 I love the building. It was so bright and cheery. 51 00:02:42,660 --> 00:02:44,160 It was so clean. 52 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:46,260 I wanted to wear that uniform. 53 00:02:46,260 --> 00:02:51,960 And having had enough religion classes, I was still interested in going to a Catholic school. 54 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:53,260 Are you surprised by that? 55 00:02:53,260 --> 00:02:53,860 I am. 56 00:02:53,860 --> 00:02:54,960 I never knew that. 57 00:02:54,960 --> 00:03:03,260 I knew you were Catholic or grew up Catholic because when I was younger, we would go to Catholic Church, St. Oliver's, I think it was. 58 00:03:03,260 --> 00:03:04,260 Mm-hmm. 59 00:03:04,260 --> 00:03:04,960 Yeah. 60 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:12,260 Well, today we're going to talk about an unsolved case and this is a story of Sister Kathy Sesnik. 61 00:03:12,260 --> 00:03:19,860 Just to backtrack a little bit, Kathy was born and raised in Lawrenceville, Pennsylvania, just across from Pittsburgh. 62 00:03:19,860 --> 00:03:23,560 And she grew up in a very devout Catholic household. 63 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:32,460 Kathy attended Catholic school and eventually joined a convent where she would spend the next seven years serving as a postulant 64 00:03:32,460 --> 00:03:35,360 or a candidate to become a nun. 65 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,260 You know, there are certain steps that you have to take to do that. 66 00:03:38,260 --> 00:03:41,360 And I'm sure it hasn't changed much over the years. 67 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:50,360 But back in the 70s, Shelby, that was a time when nuns still wore their habits, the black and white gown that you see. 68 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:51,160 Oh, yes. 69 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:52,860 I love the movie, The Sister Act. 70 00:03:52,860 --> 00:03:54,760 Oh, yes. 71 00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:55,160 All right. 72 00:03:55,160 --> 00:04:00,560 During this time as a postulant, you take classes to learn more about religious life. 73 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:04,260 You pray and participate in apostolic works. 74 00:04:04,260 --> 00:04:16,860 By July 21st, 1967, Kathy made her vows to begin her life as a nun and she dedicated her life to the convent of the school Sisters of Notre Dame. 75 00:04:16,860 --> 00:04:25,360 Kathy went on to teach at Archbishop Keogh High School, an all-girls school associated with the Archdiocese of Baltimore. 76 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:30,160 By 1969, Sister Kathy began experiencing fatigue. 77 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,560 There were a lot of changes coming from the Vatican. 78 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:39,260 Pope Paul VI at the time declared something called the Vatican II. 79 00:04:39,260 --> 00:04:45,660 And I had to go look this up, Shelby, because I was not aware of these changes in the Catholic Church at the time. 80 00:04:45,660 --> 00:04:49,560 But it's basically an awakening into modern times. 81 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:52,160 There were just a lot of changes going on. 82 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:57,060 Mass was now read in people's language instead of strictly in Latin. 83 00:04:57,060 --> 00:04:59,560 And I will say when I was growing up in the Catholic Church, 84 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:07,160 it was in English, the readings increased and nuns were declared to be equal to Catholic parishioners. 85 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:15,260 So I kind of wanted to go back to when Kathy first began pursuing her life, dedicating her life to becoming a nun. 86 00:05:15,260 --> 00:05:20,760 Nuns at that time, Shelby, were given a higher order, maybe a little bit. 87 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:24,060 I don't know. They were considered to be a little bit closer to God. 88 00:05:24,060 --> 00:05:25,260 Does that make sense? 89 00:05:25,260 --> 00:05:26,360 Yeah, I can see that. 90 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:32,560 So with the Vatican II changes that the Pope had declared, 91 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:39,460 a lot of nuns were feeling set back a little bit because they were no longer at that stature. 92 00:05:39,460 --> 00:05:45,060 So all that work and time and praying and religion classes and everything that they put in, 93 00:05:45,060 --> 00:05:50,660 all that time that they dedicated for the years that it took to become a nun just basically got wiped away. 94 00:05:50,660 --> 00:05:57,360 So this is where it didn't sit very well with the nuns because 90,000 of them left the church 95 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:00,760 feeling like they've lost that special place in the church. 96 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:05,060 Now, Kathy was not one of those nuns who left the archdiocese, 97 00:06:05,060 --> 00:06:08,060 but she did start missing a lot of school. 98 00:06:08,060 --> 00:06:13,860 And this was a time too, Shelby, where nuns were no longer required to wear the habits. 99 00:06:13,860 --> 00:06:20,660 And she just wore regular dresses during those times and she could move off the convent property. 100 00:06:20,660 --> 00:06:26,260 So she actually went out and got a small two bedroom apartment that she shared with another nun. 101 00:06:26,260 --> 00:06:28,960 So she's just out in society just like you and me. 102 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:29,560 Wow. 103 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:35,760 On Friday, November 7th, 1969, Kathy had left to run errands around 7 p.m. 104 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:38,560 but never returned back to her apartment. 105 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:44,560 And by 11 o'clock that night, Kathy's roommate was worried that she had not returned home. 106 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:50,760 I believe Shelby, she was literally going out to get some dinner rolls and maybe pick a couple things up for dinner. 107 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:56,660 Her roommate got worried around 11 o'clock and she didn't call the police right away. 108 00:06:56,660 --> 00:07:03,360 She contacted two priests, a Father Kube and Father McKeon, who lived in a nearby community. 109 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:09,660 So I think that that would be something that I would probably do first before calling the police, 110 00:07:09,660 --> 00:07:12,960 just because, you know, you're going to be checking on people and just saying, 111 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:16,760 hey, have you seen Kathy or something like that? 112 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:19,560 I mean, that's a natural reaction to me, don't you think? 113 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:20,960 Right. Oh, yeah, I agree. 114 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:25,260 Well, the two priests arrived at Kathy's apartment around 1 a.m. 115 00:07:25,260 --> 00:07:32,860 to speak to Kathy's roommate before calling the police and then set out by foot to begin scouring the neighborhood for her. 116 00:07:32,860 --> 00:07:37,160 They found Kathy's car parked nearby the apartment where she lived, 117 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:46,960 but not on the premises of the apartment complex because nothing seems suspicious other than Kathy's car being parked at an odd angle. 118 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:53,660 OK, so the car is off the apartment complex property and it's parked at an odd angle. 119 00:07:53,660 --> 00:07:55,160 So that's not suspicious. 120 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:57,360 Yeah, I would find that pretty suspicious. 121 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:06,360 Well, Shelby had just mentioned that I didn't think it was odd that you would start calling around calling friends first before you call the police. 122 00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:11,360 But police found it rather odd that Kathy's roommate would call the priests before them. 123 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:12,660 Yeah, I would agree. 124 00:08:12,660 --> 00:08:16,460 I mean, I don't know why they would find that odd. 125 00:08:16,460 --> 00:08:17,660 It could have been their behavior. 126 00:08:17,660 --> 00:08:21,560 Who knows? I didn't see anything in the writings, anything in the articles about that. 127 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:25,760 But you just never know because, you know, police are always on their guard anyway. 128 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:26,860 Mm hmm. Right. 129 00:08:26,860 --> 00:08:37,060 On January 3rd, 1970, 26 year old Kathy was discovered by two hunters in Lansdowne, Maryland, just outside of Baltimore. 130 00:08:37,060 --> 00:08:40,760 And Shelby, this is about five miles from her home. 131 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:42,860 Oh, I know. 132 00:08:42,860 --> 00:08:45,960 She was covered with snow and lying on her back. 133 00:08:45,960 --> 00:08:50,360 She was partially nude and on a hillside close to a garbage dump. 134 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:58,060 The interesting thing that I found here, Shelby, is that Kathy's purse and one shoe were within just feet from her body. 135 00:08:58,060 --> 00:08:59,260 Wow. 136 00:08:59,260 --> 00:09:10,660 Unfortunately, Kathy was too decomposed at this time to determine her exact cause of death because it had appeared that she had suffered from blunt force trauma to the head. 137 00:09:10,660 --> 00:09:16,360 And to make matters worse, wild animals had found her before the hunters had. 138 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:25,960 So did the insects, so investigators could only discover her identity with the contents inside that purse that was lying nearby. 139 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:28,260 So interesting that her purse was still there. 140 00:09:28,260 --> 00:09:28,960 Obviously. 141 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:30,160 Wow. 142 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:32,060 And it was only two months. 143 00:09:32,060 --> 00:09:32,960 Exactly. 144 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,160 And it was in the colder weather too. 145 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:37,860 So to me, that's a little odd. 146 00:09:37,860 --> 00:09:38,960 Yeah, same. 147 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:43,560 I mean, I thought that that would have been able to kind of preserve her at least a little longer. 148 00:09:43,560 --> 00:09:45,060 I mean, animals, I guess. 149 00:09:45,060 --> 00:09:47,260 That's a little more difficult. 150 00:09:47,260 --> 00:09:51,360 Yeah, the animals are one thing, but the insects is what surprises me. 151 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:51,960 For sure. 152 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:58,460 Well, after Kathy's discovery, police began focusing on one of those two priests that I had mentioned. 153 00:09:58,460 --> 00:10:07,060 And this was Father Koob, which police had learned that Kathy had written him a letter that was dated November 3rd, 1969. 154 00:10:07,060 --> 00:10:13,360 So I'm going to read the little excerpt from here and you can kind of get a general idea what their relationship was. 155 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:19,460 Quote, my very dearest Jerry, if ever I should leave you is playing on the radio. 156 00:10:19,460 --> 00:10:21,260 I'm all curled up in bed. 157 00:10:21,260 --> 00:10:24,560 My period has finally started 10 days late. 158 00:10:24,560 --> 00:10:26,660 So you may say I'm moody. 159 00:10:26,660 --> 00:10:28,260 My heart aches for you. 160 00:10:28,260 --> 00:10:33,460 I must wait on you, your time and your need even more than I had before. 161 00:10:33,460 --> 00:10:38,660 I think I can begin to live with that more easily now than I did two months ago. 162 00:10:38,660 --> 00:10:40,760 Just loving you within myself. 163 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:41,560 Unquote. 164 00:10:41,560 --> 00:10:43,160 So I'm going to stop there. 165 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:48,460 Kathy went on to tell Father Koob that she wanted to have his children. 166 00:10:48,460 --> 00:10:49,160 Ooh. 167 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:49,560 Okay. 168 00:10:49,560 --> 00:10:59,560 First off, we're going to say that this was a little scandalous because priests and nuns don't have that kind of relationship in the Catholic Church. 169 00:10:59,560 --> 00:11:01,860 Priests don't even get married, right? 170 00:11:01,860 --> 00:11:02,460 No. 171 00:11:02,460 --> 00:11:03,760 I don't think the other of them. 172 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:05,360 No, they do not get married. 173 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:12,960 So interesting that the police are going to show a little bit of interest in Father Koob here because priests at that 174 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:14,960 time were supposed to be celibate. 175 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:18,360 I don't think anything has changed over the years with that. 176 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:22,660 Father Koob did have an alibi on the night that Kathy disappeared. 177 00:11:22,660 --> 00:11:27,160 He claimed that he and Father McKeon had pretty much hung out all night. 178 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:28,160 They went to dinner. 179 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:29,260 They caught a movie. 180 00:11:29,260 --> 00:11:31,260 It was called Easy Rider. 181 00:11:31,260 --> 00:11:34,260 And I think that was a pretty popular movie at the time, Shelbs. 182 00:11:34,260 --> 00:11:36,760 This alibi seemed pretty legit. 183 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:44,760 And I wanted to mention too that the priests took not only one but two lie detector tests just for good measure. 184 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:46,960 They both passed with flying colors. 185 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:52,160 So I'm not really surprised because we know that priests are going to be honest. 186 00:11:52,160 --> 00:12:02,460 Although sexual relationships between the priest and a nun is a no-no, they did to me just from what I read seem to be following an honest life. 187 00:12:02,460 --> 00:12:09,660 I mean, they both passed two different lie detector tests, so that should be a pretty good indication that they didn't do anything. 188 00:12:09,660 --> 00:12:10,960 Yes, absolutely. 189 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:20,960 Police went on to take an active role in the investigation and did come up with some pretty good leads all the way through 1977. 190 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:25,460 So they were on the case for a good seven years since Kathy's death. 191 00:12:25,460 --> 00:12:33,760 But unfortunately, the evidence did seem to run out and Kathy's case went cold for another 15 years. 192 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:40,460 Did it say when she, oh, she left to run errands and they probably wouldn't have had video surveillance. 193 00:12:40,460 --> 00:12:48,160 I was just wondering like maybe could they figure out kind of her track and where she was going and what she was doing before she went missing? 194 00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:54,660 Yes, I think that she distinctly said she was headed for a specific store to pick up dinner rolls. 195 00:12:54,660 --> 00:12:55,660 That's right. Okay. 196 00:12:55,660 --> 00:12:58,060 So kind of like I'm going to run out to the grocery store. 197 00:12:58,060 --> 00:12:59,960 I'll be right back sort of thing. 198 00:12:59,960 --> 00:13:00,460 Okay. 199 00:13:00,460 --> 00:13:03,760 So, Shelley, what do we know about crime and deceit? 200 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:05,560 They don't stay buried forever. 201 00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:11,660 Do they know, you know, somebody's got to talk somebody might become suspicious by 1992. 202 00:13:11,660 --> 00:13:22,260 Two women came forward and filed a lawsuit against the Baltimore Archdiocese claiming that they had been sexually abused by Father Anthony Joseph 203 00:13:22,260 --> 00:13:30,360 Maskell when they attended Archbishop Keogh High School at the same time that Kathy Sesnick taught English there. 204 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:31,660 Now, here's the clincher. 205 00:13:31,660 --> 00:13:43,060 One of the women testified in court that in November 1969, Father Maskell took her to the garbage dump near Lansdowne, Maryland and showed her Kathy's body. 206 00:13:43,060 --> 00:13:44,960 Ooh, I know. 207 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:50,560 Father Maskell told her that she would be next if she did not keep her mouth shut. 208 00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:52,360 So here we go with the scandal. 209 00:13:52,360 --> 00:14:02,360 These two women also went on to testify in court that they knew of several other students at their high school that were also being sexually abused by Father Maskell. 210 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:05,360 And they went to Sister Kathy for help. 211 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:06,360 Oh, wow. 212 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:06,960 I know. 213 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:07,360 Okay. 214 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:17,660 So this woman, this woman of God is just given this information and ethically, morally, I'm pretty sure if I were in that situation. 215 00:14:17,660 --> 00:14:22,460 I mean, I'm an educator and I am mandated to report things like that. 216 00:14:22,460 --> 00:14:29,260 I don't know how the laws were back then, but besides being a mandated reporter, she's also a woman of God. 217 00:14:29,260 --> 00:14:34,260 So she is definitely facing some moral issues. 218 00:14:34,260 --> 00:14:34,760 Right. 219 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:35,560 Absolutely. 220 00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:42,160 I wonder if she went to Father Maskell and said something and that's possibly why he did away with her. 221 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:42,960 You know what? 222 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:45,260 I kind of wonder the same thing. 223 00:14:45,260 --> 00:14:50,860 None of the articles that I read said, of course, you know, he's going to deny, deny, deny. 224 00:14:50,860 --> 00:14:53,160 So we will never know that answer. 225 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:59,360 But I have to in my mind think that she probably had a conversation with him or at least to say, 226 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:06,160 hey, there's a couple of students who came to me to tell me something that I just wanted to ask you about. 227 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:17,560 But ultimately, the courts ruled in Father Maskell's favor because the judge ruled that repressed memories don't count in extending the statute of limitations. 228 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:22,160 So too much time had gone on to prosecute Father Maskell. 229 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:23,860 This was 1992. 230 00:15:23,860 --> 00:15:28,660 So this was 22 years after Kathy's body was found. 231 00:15:28,660 --> 00:15:32,060 I wonder why it took them so long to come forward. 232 00:15:32,060 --> 00:15:33,260 Did he pass away? 233 00:15:33,260 --> 00:15:35,660 Does it? Did it say he had passed away? 234 00:15:35,660 --> 00:15:36,560 I don't think so. 235 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:44,060 No, no, because this was taken to the prosecutors and the judge ruled in his favor. 236 00:15:44,060 --> 00:15:44,460 I don't know. 237 00:15:44,460 --> 00:15:45,160 We'll get back to that. 238 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:47,660 It's been a couple of weeks since I wrote this script. 239 00:15:47,660 --> 00:15:50,660 So I don't believe that he had passed away at this time. 240 00:15:50,660 --> 00:15:51,360 Shelbs. 241 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:51,660 All right. 242 00:15:51,660 --> 00:15:58,860 To make a long story short here, there was never enough evidence to prosecute Father Maskell and Kathy's murder. 243 00:15:58,860 --> 00:16:04,960 But there's a lot more to this story, which I will mention in just a little bit because Shelby, 244 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:09,160 I came across a Netflix documentary out there. 245 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:13,560 It was made in 2017 and it's called The Keepers. 246 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:17,560 Now, Kathy's case was mentioned in this docuseries. 247 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:24,960 I did not watch it simply because I think there is a ton more information that would take me down these rabbit holes. 248 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:33,460 And I really wanted to concentrate on Kathy's case here as opposed to looking at the docuseries that had all this scandal going on with the church. 249 00:16:33,460 --> 00:16:35,560 So I wanted to stay away from that. 250 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:40,660 According to WMAR Channel 2 News out of Baltimore, 251 00:16:40,660 --> 00:16:46,060 filmmakers were not trying to solve Kathy Sesnick's case in The Keepers, 252 00:16:46,060 --> 00:16:51,360 although there was another case involved that they had mentioned and this would be Joyce Maleky. 253 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:57,460 She also was a murder victim, which The Keepers kind of mentioned in there along with Kathy. 254 00:16:57,460 --> 00:17:06,760 Filmmakers of The Keepers were attempting to link Kathy's case to the bigger case of sexual abuse at the Archbishop Keogh's school, 255 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,060 where Kathy worked as an English teacher. 256 00:17:09,060 --> 00:17:15,160 So let's talk about what Kathy probably knew a little bit too much of. 257 00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:22,560 According to eyewitness accounts, girls would be pulled out of class at the high school to be sexually assaulted. 258 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:31,360 They were threatened never to speak of these ordeals or something bad might happen to them similar to what happened to Kathy Sesnick. 259 00:17:31,360 --> 00:17:37,660 Now remember, one victim had come forward years later to say that she had seen Kathy's body. 260 00:17:37,660 --> 00:17:40,660 Why wouldn't they tell their parents? 261 00:17:40,660 --> 00:17:42,960 Well, let me put it to you this way, Shelbs. 262 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,060 This is the 1970s. 263 00:17:45,060 --> 00:17:49,260 That era, you're taught to respect your elders. 264 00:17:49,260 --> 00:17:57,760 And I think, Shelby, if I were in that situation and I were going to that school and I was threatened, I would take it seriously. 265 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:04,160 I mean, I would keep my mouth shut too, because if you're kind of threatened that you're next, wouldn't you keep your mouth shut? 266 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:05,160 Yeah, maybe. 267 00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:12,760 But I mean, if it just kept happening to a bunch of different girls, I would think that there would have at least been one. 268 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:13,460 True. 269 00:18:13,460 --> 00:18:15,260 I don't know. It's very odd. 270 00:18:15,260 --> 00:18:22,960 It is odd, but remember, though, some girls did come to Kathy Sesnick and they told her because she was a trusted adult. 271 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:23,660 Yeah. 272 00:18:23,660 --> 00:18:29,260 They probably trusted that she would go and look into it, which she probably did. 273 00:18:29,260 --> 00:18:32,560 And this is why she disappeared, unfortunately. 274 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:34,660 It's just, you know, there's too much speculation. 275 00:18:34,660 --> 00:18:36,160 I don't want to speculate here. 276 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:43,260 I'm not even an expert, but I'm thinking that had to have been the direction that Kathy was going was trying to get to the bottom of it. 277 00:18:43,260 --> 00:18:43,960 Yeah. 278 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:56,160 Now, according to the Baltimore Banner, the Maryland's Office of the Attorney General released a massive report on sexual abuse in Baltimore's Catholic archdiocese. 279 00:18:56,160 --> 00:19:08,360 More than 150 clergy and personnel were reportedly involved in covering up the abuse of nearly 40 children and teenagers, Shelby. 280 00:19:08,360 --> 00:19:13,060 Sixteen of these victims attended the high school where Kathy Sesnick taught. 281 00:19:13,060 --> 00:19:14,060 Wow. 282 00:19:14,060 --> 00:19:15,460 So what do you think? 283 00:19:15,460 --> 00:19:17,160 Do you think Kathy knew too much? 284 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:18,860 She planned to go to the police. 285 00:19:18,860 --> 00:19:22,160 She went to the priest first to see if it was true. 286 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:27,460 I think it's fair to say that she was probably in the wrong place at the wrong time. 287 00:19:27,460 --> 00:19:32,960 And when she left for errands, yeah, she was probably just at the wrong place at the wrong time. 288 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:35,260 I don't know if somebody was following her. 289 00:19:35,260 --> 00:19:37,360 Did she plan to meet somebody? 290 00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:38,560 I have no idea. 291 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:39,960 So many questions. 292 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,460 So many questions. 293 00:19:41,460 --> 00:19:51,160 Well, I will say this one of the priests recently accused of taking part in the sexual abuse cases in the 1970s was Father Kube. 294 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:55,360 Remember that was the priest that Kathy had written that letter to. 295 00:19:55,360 --> 00:19:55,960 Right. 296 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,260 So he had always maintained his innocence. 297 00:19:59,260 --> 00:20:03,060 But my recommendation here is just go watch The Keepers. 298 00:20:03,060 --> 00:20:05,160 I personally did not watch it. 299 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:07,260 I mean, I'll probably be interested. 300 00:20:07,260 --> 00:20:16,260 I actually wanted to record this first before I go and watch that and make my own decisions because it's again, it's a completely different circumstance. 301 00:20:16,260 --> 00:20:17,960 Yeah, I might have to watch that today. 302 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:18,960 Mm-hmm. 303 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:30,960 Now, I've also put the 2023 Baltimore Banner article in our show notes that has a very different account on Kube's personality and whereabouts of when Kathy went missing. 304 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:33,560 I didn't want to get too much into that as well. 305 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,060 But don't forget he did pass two lie detector tests. 306 00:20:37,060 --> 00:20:44,660 So again, I'm going to let you I'm going to let our listeners kind of make your own decisions on the direction this is going to take. 307 00:20:44,660 --> 00:20:51,060 But I did want to kind of jump forward a little bit because with the advancements of DNA profiling, 308 00:20:51,060 --> 00:20:59,260 the FBI and local detectives began pursuing DNA analysis pretty heavily only back in 2017, 309 00:20:59,260 --> 00:20:59,860 Shelby. 310 00:20:59,860 --> 00:21:03,360 And this is the same year that The Keepers came out on Netflix. 311 00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:10,560 So as we would have it back in the 1970s where crime scene investigators collected evidence, 312 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:15,060 they actually stored quite a bit of evidence from the location where Kathy was discovered. 313 00:21:15,060 --> 00:21:15,960 They had her purse. 314 00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:21,360 They had her shoes and then of course, whatever they may have found around her when they discovered her. 315 00:21:21,360 --> 00:21:28,660 But on February 28th, 2017, the FBI obtained an order from the Baltimore County State Attorney, 316 00:21:28,660 --> 00:21:33,660 allowing them to have Kathy Cisnik's body exhumed for DNA testing. 317 00:21:33,660 --> 00:21:34,660 Good for them. 318 00:21:34,660 --> 00:21:35,460 Oh, wow. 319 00:21:35,460 --> 00:21:38,760 Her DNA samples were compared with Father Maskell. 320 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,460 But unfortunately, there was no match to the crime scene. 321 00:21:42,460 --> 00:21:47,760 An additional half dozen other DNA samples were compared in this case. 322 00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:52,760 Some that investigators believed were related to another crime activity. 323 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:54,760 That would be Joyce Maleky. 324 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:59,660 Now, I didn't really want to look her up either because I'm concentrating on Kathy's case here. 325 00:21:59,660 --> 00:22:03,060 But that would be also quite interesting to take a look at. 326 00:22:03,060 --> 00:22:04,860 I will say this just briefly. 327 00:22:04,860 --> 00:22:12,360 Joyce Helen Maleky was a 20 year old girl that disappeared from the same district just four days after Kathy Cisnik. 328 00:22:12,360 --> 00:22:16,360 She was on her way to a mall to do some Christmas shopping. 329 00:22:16,360 --> 00:22:23,460 There was another girl who had disappeared and this was 16 year old Grace Elizabeth Montane. 330 00:22:23,460 --> 00:22:31,860 She disappeared from another shopping center close by and her body was discovered September 29th, 1971. 331 00:22:31,860 --> 00:22:38,860 All of these murders shall be occurred within a 30 minute distance of the Herondale Mall. 332 00:22:38,860 --> 00:22:43,060 So if you're thinking about somebody out there doing this, 333 00:22:43,060 --> 00:22:49,260 they're all in a crowded shopping area and they're all within 30 minutes of each other. 334 00:22:49,260 --> 00:22:55,360 I can easily say that whoever the perpetrator is, that would definitely be their MO. 335 00:22:55,360 --> 00:23:00,960 Yeah, so obviously we have a creeper who scouts crowded places and preys on young women. 336 00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:04,260 Kathy was just 26 when she disappeared. 337 00:23:04,260 --> 00:23:07,360 So she was a little bit older than the other victims. 338 00:23:07,360 --> 00:23:14,460 But regardless, Shelby, you've got a creeper who is watching women out shopping alone 339 00:23:14,460 --> 00:23:22,160 and is basically either following them or watching their movements and they could be showing up where they live. 340 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:25,860 Yeah, I think I've said it before on our podcast, 341 00:23:25,860 --> 00:23:33,360 but I try to be very aware of my surroundings, especially in parking lots because that honestly tends to be, 342 00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:37,760 I mean, when you hear somebody going missing, a lot of the time it is in a parking lot. 343 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:43,760 Yes, it is. And I've had some people just kind of come up on me as I'm either putting stuff in the car 344 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:45,760 or I'm just getting out of the car. 345 00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:52,060 I literally have had people just coming straight up to where I just parked my vehicle and that's startling. 346 00:23:52,060 --> 00:23:52,760 It is. 347 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:58,560 Well, ultimately DNA from Kathy and these other victims were entered into CODIS. 348 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:03,860 But even today, all cases have come to another screeching halt 349 00:24:03,860 --> 00:24:07,460 because I told you Kathy's case went cold after about seven years, 350 00:24:07,460 --> 00:24:11,960 but things kind of picked up when DNA samples were on the scene. 351 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:18,060 But no leads stemming from those DNA samples could be referenced in the CODIS system. 352 00:24:18,060 --> 00:24:23,860 Baltimore police theorized that it was likely that Kathy was a victim of abduction. 353 00:24:23,860 --> 00:24:26,860 Like you said, you know, when people just pop up on you, 354 00:24:26,860 --> 00:24:31,560 when she was walking to her car to run errands in November 1969. 355 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:36,260 Now, I had mentioned that 2017 was a big year in Kathy's case. 356 00:24:36,260 --> 00:24:38,460 There's a lot of publicity going on. 357 00:24:38,460 --> 00:24:47,160 Kathy's sister was interviewed by People Magazine and believes that Kathy was indeed planning to go to the police to report Father Maskell, 358 00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:48,660 but she just never made it. 359 00:24:48,660 --> 00:24:56,460 And I'll put these articles in our show notes because Kathy's sister provides some very fond memories between the two of them growing up. 360 00:24:56,460 --> 00:24:59,560 So I thought that was refreshing and nice to hear. 361 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,660 So I wanted to add that to our show notes today. 362 00:25:02,660 --> 00:25:07,860 So that Shelby is the unsolved case of Kathy Sesnick. 363 00:25:07,860 --> 00:25:17,860 And I do feel like authorities are close, yet they're still so far because there simply has got to be more to her murderer than what we see on the surface here. 364 00:25:17,860 --> 00:25:21,560 Unfortunately, Shelby, this case is over 50 years old. 365 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:30,460 So the possibilities are pretty slim that it will ever be solved unless, of course, we have somebody who makes a deathbed confession. 366 00:25:30,460 --> 00:25:32,060 I hope they figure it out. 367 00:25:32,060 --> 00:25:34,160 I'm going to have to go watch the docu-series. 368 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:35,960 I'll have to see if I can start that today. 369 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,860 Yeah, let me know because I don't have Netflix right now. 370 00:25:38,860 --> 00:25:41,260 So is it worth getting a subscription for that? 371 00:25:41,260 --> 00:25:42,560 There you go. 372 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:48,860 All right. To our listeners, if you have any information on Kathy Sesnick's case, 373 00:25:48,860 --> 00:25:57,160 please contact the Baltimore City Homicide Unit through Metro Crime Stoppers at 866-7-LOCKUP. 374 00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:02,060 That's 866-756-2587. 375 00:26:02,060 --> 00:26:09,360 There is a $2,000 reward for information leading to an arrest, which is still active in this case. 376 00:26:09,360 --> 00:26:16,160 Kathy was last seen on November 7, 1969, at the Carriage House Apartments in Baltimore City. 377 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:20,060 Zip code, postal code is 21229. 378 00:26:20,060 --> 00:26:23,760 She was on her way to the Edmondson Village Shopping Center, 379 00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:32,360 and her body, unfortunately, was discovered at the Monumental Avenue in Halethorpe, postal code 21227. 380 00:26:32,360 --> 00:26:34,160 So there you have it. 381 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,260 That's the case of Sister Kathy Sesnick. 382 00:26:37,260 --> 00:26:38,160 Wow. 383 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,660 And I hope that we do get some answers for her. 384 00:26:40,660 --> 00:26:43,460 I hate to have a cold case not get solved. 385 00:26:43,460 --> 00:26:44,460 I do too. 386 00:26:44,460 --> 00:26:47,060 Do you have a teachable moment for us today? 387 00:26:47,060 --> 00:26:50,060 I do have a teachable moment, and this is a tough one, Shelbs, 388 00:26:50,060 --> 00:26:57,560 because I think my teachable moment is to do your own research before raising judgments on people that you don't know. 389 00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:04,860 I touched on a couple of accounts here that go all the way back to the late 1960s and early 70s, 390 00:27:04,860 --> 00:27:08,760 which would still be considered scandalous today. 391 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:12,760 Again, Shelby, there's a handful of people being accused, 392 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:18,560 but until they reach a jury of their peers, they should be considered innocent, at least in this country. 393 00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:23,160 But we've heard a lot of stories of abuse in the Catholic Church. 394 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,160 So when I began researching Kathy's case, 395 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:31,560 I was very surprised that her murder could somehow be related to that. 396 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:34,660 Even though I report from reputable sources, 397 00:27:34,660 --> 00:27:39,060 there's still a lot of questions about Kathy's case that go unanswered. 398 00:27:39,060 --> 00:27:43,560 And I've provided a documentary for you, some articles. 399 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:48,060 Any of our listeners can just tap into Beyond a 30-minute podcast here. 400 00:27:48,060 --> 00:27:52,560 So my teachable moment is don't be quick to judge. 401 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:55,160 Sometimes innocent people get accused. 402 00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,460 Sometimes guilty people don't. 403 00:27:57,460 --> 00:27:59,360 It's not our place to say either way. 404 00:27:59,360 --> 00:28:00,560 But we're human. 405 00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:02,060 We all have an opinion. 406 00:28:02,060 --> 00:28:06,960 Just be sure that your opinion is accurate and let authorities handle the rest. 407 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:08,360 And that's my teachable moment. 408 00:28:08,360 --> 00:28:09,960 That was good. That was very good. 409 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:10,960 Thank you. 410 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:13,360 Well, another story in the books. 411 00:28:13,360 --> 00:28:19,760 We would love to receive feedback from our listeners on this storyline or any of our other episodes. 412 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,260 And be sure to DM us on Instagram. 413 00:28:22,260 --> 00:28:24,760 If you have a storyline that you would like to hear, 414 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,460 be sure to click on our Linktree account found in our show notes, 415 00:28:28,460 --> 00:28:33,060 where you can also find our social media, website address, and a little bit more. 416 00:28:33,060 --> 00:28:35,260 Until next time, talk to you soon. 417 00:28:35,260 --> 00:28:36,460 Happy New Year! 418 00:28:36,460 --> 00:28:38,160 Happy New Year! 419 00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,460 Thanks for listening to Dying to be Found. 420 00:28:40,460 --> 00:28:45,660 Before we go, we would love for you to leave a review on your favorite podcast platform. 421 00:28:45,660 --> 00:28:51,360 Be sure to follow us on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, and Pinterest at Dying to be Found. 422 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:56,460 You can access our website, email, social media, and storyline request form 423 00:28:56,460 --> 00:28:59,960 by clicking on our Linktree account found in our show notes. 424 00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:04,860 If you like our episodes, consider buying us a coffee at buymeacoffee.com 425 00:29:04,860 --> 00:29:08,660 slash Dying to be Found, spelled just like you see it on our logo. 426 00:29:08,660 --> 00:29:12,460 Feel free to message us on Instagram and let us know how we're doing. 427 00:29:12,460 --> 00:29:17,460 With that, be sure to check us out every Thursday, wherever you get your podcasts. 428 00:29:17,460 --> 00:29:39,460 We will talk to you all next week!