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Greetings friends! I'm the host. I'm the lawyer. And this is the Murder You Know Podcast!

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Did you watch Murder She Wrote with your mom as a child and become a weirdo?

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Do you have a borderline concerning obsession with murder?

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Do you want to learn a little bit about the law?

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Do you want to laugh but also potentially cry?

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Yeah, cry.

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If any of that sounds good to you, then join us once a week. We drop our show. We'll be there. We'll be laughing. We'll be crying.

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Mainly crying.

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My mom will be there. That's a good selling point.

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So yeah, that's us. Thursdays. Be there. Be square. The Murder You Know Podcast. You can find us on Facebook, Instagram, and all of your podcast streaming platforms.

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Do do do do do do do do do.

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Hi everyone. This is Deb from Dying to be Found.

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Before we get started, I just wanted to say that episodes contain disturbing discussions on harmful acts and crimes against animals and or humankind.

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Recordings are not intended for young or sensitive audiences due to the content nature of this podcast.

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Listener discretion is strongly advised.

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Hi everyone. This is Deb, your host from the True Crime Podcast, Dying to be Found.

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Thanks for joining me on DB2F's The Dash, which is my personal collection of short true crime stories.

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I thought this would be a great time to give you some good news on our episode today.

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So hang tight. In the meantime, as a bonus, I've even lined up some great fellow podcasters to help me out today.

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I have our hosts from the podcast, The Murderer You Know, who have graciously agreed to join me on the Dash.

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So here we go. Hi guys.

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Hi.

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How are you? Thank you so much for being here today.

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Thanks for having us. Yeah, excited. Yes.

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I'm doing great and I'm really, really excited to be here.

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Well, I am so glad that you are here. The true crime community is so overwhelming with their support.

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Thanks so much for joining me today.

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And I'm going to do my best, as promised, to keep up your mysterious appeal, because I know that that in itself is a great marketing tactic.

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And I think I told you that in an email once that you guys need to market that if you haven't already.

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You did. And I was like, wow, I didn't think of that.

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So mysterious. It's a great concept. And it takes me back to that home show.

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I don't know if you remember this show. You're probably too young, but it was called Home Improvement.

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No, I love I love Tim Allen. I love him.

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Do you remember his neighbor that you could never see his full face over that fence?

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That's actually me. What was the name? Wilson? Yes.

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Yeah. So that kind of gives me the the home improvement vibes and whatever you guys are doing. It is working to our listeners.

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I'm still lining up a few guest spots. So if you are a true crime podcaster, give me a show.

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And as far as my current guests, I always love to hear about your experiences in the massive world of podcasting.

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So get ready. I've prepared a few questions.

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Now, if there are any questions that our listeners are interested in hearing, just send me an email.

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I'll get those on future episodes. You can go to the show notes and click on the link tree to contact me on any of my social medias.

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But for the murderer, you know, podcasters, I've lined up those questions. So here we go. Are you ready?

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Ready. Yeah, I don't know. I'm kind of nervous.

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I hope they aren't too hard. No, I won't. It'll be easy. Trust me. Trust me, she said.

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Famous last words. As podcasters, there are so many things that we have to think about.

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And so I kind of wondered what made you all decide to get together and commit to quality time together at least once a week that I know of.

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What made you guys decide to start a podcast? Who wants to go? Shall I go? You. You'd go.

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You're. Yeah, man. You're you're the boss. What do you want? Let's go. Tell the story.

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I will speak. OK, I'm the host. I call myself the host and I lovingly call my co-hosts lawyer and mom.

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So if you're listening, it is because mom is my mom and lawyer is a lawyer, which seems very straightforward, I guess.

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But nevertheless, we've been talking about this. Honestly, I feel like most people for a very, very long time.

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And we thought that we had sort of a unique dynamic, even in the very populated community of true crime podcasts with a lawyer who can kind of make things fun and approachable and easy to understand and not super dry and super, super legal sounding all the time.

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And we thought now I'll let lawyers speak on this. We thought it would be a good opportunity to spend some quality time together.

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And I think it's been really, really fun. But I'm sure you know, Deb, it is also a whole lot of hard work and we've learned a lot.

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And like I said, we've had a lot of fun. And I think that we are heading in a very fun and fantastic direction personally.

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Good for you. That is amazing. And you're all still talking to each other.

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Just for this interview.

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Literally hate these people. Cancel it, shut it down. Was 20 minutes late on purpose. No, I'm kidding. That was too soon. I'm still upset about that.

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Yeah, so yeah, I echo all of that. I mean, it's been incredibly fun. It's been a huge learning experience.

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Are you learning more about each other?

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I think so. Yeah, I think we're figuring out the way each other thinks, the way, you know, we communicate with one another and the way that we, I guess, investigate to a certain extent.

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It's kind of been fun to see that side of one another for sure.

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Why true crime?

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That's on the host again. This is her. This is like her one true obsession. Can I say obsession? Not in like a bad way.

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I love true crime. I can't really explain why because obviously it's interesting because I was watching there's some cartoon about dinosaurs that my husband was watching the other night.

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And literally in like the first 15 minutes, the baby dinosaurs get killed and eaten by a big bad mean dinosaur.

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And it is a cartoon. And I cried for like 20 minutes to the point that my husband was like, what is actually wrong with you?

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That's what Disney movies do to me.

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They yeah, they're trying to pull out those heartstrings. But yeah, I don't know. It's weird then that I am so interested in true crime, which are actual horrible, horrifying, devastating things that have happened in real life.

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Yeah, for sure. And I can't explain it. And it's a conversation we've had on the podcast a lot. It's a conversation I have with my friends a lot. Why are we also interested in this topic?

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And I do not know what the answer is. But it is something that my mom and I would talk about all the time in our personal lives with each other.

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I remember to this day watching murder she wrote with her watching cops, maybe not with her, but she was watching cops, which she denies.

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I take the fifth.

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Let's talk about the premise of your podcast. If I were to tune in today, what can I look forward to listening to?

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I think that we are a little unique, not only because we have a fun, hip, cool lawyer, but also because.

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Oh, and a fun, hip, cool mom.

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And a fun, hip, cool mom who watched cops.

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But also because we don't cover big sensational stories. We don't cover Ted Bundy and Ed Gein and Richard Ramirez.

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We cover mostly until we run out, because you inevitably will, people that we know, friends from our lives, coworkers, people's husbands and wives that we have sort of been in a friend group or social circle with.

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And then we also cover smaller local stories to our community.

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So it is a little bit of a different vibe.

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The other thing is that there is sort of another layer of mystery, which is we typically don't use the names of the people who are involved in the story that we're telling.

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We're sort of a nameless podcast generally.

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That's what I like about it, though, because it is so mysterious and you guys just have a really good way of communicating and we can still get that message that you guys are trying to get out there.

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So you're doing a great job.

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Thank you.

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What inspires you to tell a story?

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How do you pick your storylines?

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That's a good question, too.

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I think that we like to try to tell stories that have impacted our lives, and we like to try to tell stories that really get you thinking about the people involved and the outfall of the crime that took place.

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So typically, like I said, we were picking small stories that have taken place in our community and have deeply impacted our community.

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That's pretty much our criteria for selecting a story, I would say.

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I don't know what you think, Mom and lawyer.

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Well, I remember when we were first talking about this idea, Ho said, my daughter said something about this, some philosopher who said you walk past 30 murderers in your life.

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It was a philosophizer.

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It's like y'all don't even y'all y'all are even like true to the OG story.

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Maybe he was.

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I don't think it was as deep as a philosopher.

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I think it was a philophilizing.

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So, we actually sort of all started talking about people we knew who had either been murdered, or we knew either the murderer or the victim or both.

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And it was kind of shocking to realize, oh my goodness.

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Yeah, we actually, you know, murder has touched our lives and we don't we don't live in big cities.

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We just live in a very small community.

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And yet it was shocking to think about, you know, even here.

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Right.

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So I think that was the first premise was, wow, we know these people.

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Yes.

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Yeah, hits home and it just makes it more personal.

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And I think, too, when it does that to us as a human being, it certainly certainly makes us be a little bit more cognizant of maybe how it does affect the other person or the family members.

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And so, yeah.

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Well, and I think that's the thing for me that, you know, I love about the show, but it's also honestly hard for me at times because this is what I do.

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I mean, watching this kind of awful tragedies play out in real life is what I do for a living.

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And, you know, I loved when we started talking about this idea, the concept of me being there to kind of walk everybody through the justice system because I think it's misunderstood in a lot of ways.

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Yeah, sure.

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I mean, it's not perfect, but I think I like the idea of being able to make it more accessible to people or at least make people kind of like the host said make people think a little bit more.

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But it's hard to talk. It's hard to talk about these kind of stories for sure, because, you know, I like to be a goofball.

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And that's honestly sometimes how you got to deal with it.

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But it's tough stuff. All of these cases and all of true crime, you know.

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And that's why even in my own podcasts, I try to break it up a little bit so it's not constantly.

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I mean, some of the stories that I give are pretty, pretty rough. But a lot of the times I do those because I feel like the victim needs to have a voice, have a name, even if it's a big name, which I don't really talk about myself very much.

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But the whole point is, is that there are victims out there. And even if it's an unknown or unsolved case, like the boy in the box.

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Oh, my gosh. He literally just as my episode dropped, I couldn't believe it. They gave him a name and that to me, I just I was almost in tears.

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It just made me that happy that he got a name and he just got recognized. And that's all I'm trying to do with my podcast.

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Yeah, that's important. Super important.

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Well, what's the best tip that you guys have to another podcaster or someone who's thinking about starting a podcast?

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My best tip would be trying to think. I have so many. So I'm trying to narrow it down to my brain to top one.

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I think I would say just go for it. Just start researching, start recording. You don't need to worry about what is my concept? What is my name? What's my logo going to be?

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Just start recording. And once you listen to what you have, I feel like the rest of the pieces will fall into place.

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So I think that would be my main piece of advice. Just go for it. There's no one there, maybe a million true crime podcasts out there,

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but there's no one that can tell the stories you want to tell in the exact way that you're going to tell them.

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So just do it. Yeah, because you'll find your niche. And even when you're working with each other a little bit, you may start out with an idea which direction you want to go.

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But as you go, you're going to get better and then you will see each other's quirks, your patterns, your themes and everything else that goes with it.

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Okay, so this question here I thought was a little creative and I really wanted to get this side. This is your personality side here.

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If you were to advertise your podcast on a billboard, what would be on it besides your logo and why?

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I'm not the master. See, this is why I left the private practice of law. I don't do advertisement. I mean, I'm more about justice. I don't know.

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Advertisement doesn't work in my brain. I just don't. So that would be the host figuring that one out again. Sorry about that.

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No, it's okay. I think that most of our current marketing could work pretty well for a billboard. The idea of a lawyer, a true crime fan and the mom who started it all.

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That would probably have to be somewhere on there. And I don't know. We can't really put like our cute little faces or anything.

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Can it play music? Can it go do do do do do do do?

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Do do do do do do do do. Oh, that was good host. That was good host. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

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I think a billboard with just three X'd out faces and say the host, the lawyer, the mom.

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Wait a minute. Oh, no, no. Shut it down. Shut it down. We have to lean into the mystery. Okay. Right. Our niece wants us to be mysterious.

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Well, where can we find you online? Oh, my goodness. Well, usually I have a script pulled up for this part. You can find us on Instagram. Hold on.

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You can find us on Instagram at Murderer You Know podcast and on Facebook also at Murderer You Know podcast.

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You can email us because we are always looking for more stories about the murderer, you know, or the crime that has been a part of your life.

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It's amazing that I still have to have a script pulled up for this as many times as I've said it. I've pre-recorded mine. That's smart. Murderer You Know at Gmail dot com.

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And you can also we have a website, the murderer, you know, podcast dot com. Well, thanks so much. I appreciate you guys giving me a little bit of feedback.

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I hope that our listeners will go check you out. We've talked. I think I think host we talked a couple weeks ago, maybe even a couple months ago that I personally do know somebody that I worked with that ended up putting somebody in a 55 gallon tank.

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I still don't remember that guy's last name. When I do, I am going to email you and say I've got to be on your show. Yes, I'm looking forward to it, Deb. Yeah, I will. I'll see what I can do.

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But in the meantime, so I wondered if we could kind of transition over to the Dash and it's just going to be a little short story about Elizabeth Fritzl.

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And I don't know if you guys have heard about her, but if you are ready, by all means, let me know what you guys think. And I always like to start off my podcast by asking a simple question.

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And this is for anybody that wants to answer. How helpful were you guys around the house as a child?

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I'm going to say not pass. Pass. Maybe I should answer that. Honesty is the best policy, right? Wait, what? Give me an age range.

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Well, I said I got together around.

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Nope, it took me till right around 18 to get it together. But you know, as long as you get it together, that's all that matters. That is so true because eventually we figured it all out and we know that those dishes don't clean themselves for sure.

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I personally grew up in a military household and sitting around was not anything that my dad allowed me to do. We had all sorts of chores.

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We had to do everything honestly, I think, but fix the car. We garden. We hauled logs up a hill. We landscaped and I don't know. I think it builds character. It certainly did us anyway.

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I will say that we definitely had to do all those things too. I guess I should have responded. I responded more to the question of how well did you listen around the house?

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We was mowing the grass and taking care of gardens and all sorts of stuff.

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I just kind of wanted to ask you all that because we are talking about Elizabeth Fritzl today and she ended up. Well, let me just tell you.

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I'm nervous. Wait a minute. Should I should I take my headphones off? Is it one of those?

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Maybe. I know what's going to happen.

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Hook me up. You got to hit me with the sign. Jazz hands. Oh, all right. I'm going to I'm going to bow out. Give me a thumbs up when it's safe.

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The host keeps making faces. Look at her. No, I am only peripherally familiar. I don't think there's anything gory about this story. Did you all go look it up?

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Nothing gory. To answer your initial question, I think generally yes.

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There's there's nothing terribly gory. I mean, it's not the best, but there is a good turnout. It's a good ending.

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I try to do good, happy or at least hopeful endings for the dash, especially because this is my little baby here. I like the sound of that.

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Yeah. So that's my whole concept here is to try to give our listeners a happy ending.

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So, well, on August 28th of 1984, 18 year old Elizabeth was asked to help her dad out with a chore and Elizabeth was considered to be somewhat of a troubled child.

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So a little discipline is good, right? Okay. All right.

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One of the reasons that Elizabeth may have been troubled is that her father, Joseph, did molest her when she was 11 years old.

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And over the years, Elizabeth did run away from home numerous times, but was always brought back one time or another by the police.

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For months, Joseph had been building a bunker in the basement. So remember now this was back in 1984, I believe.

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There was some military tensions with the Soviet Union around that time.

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So it really was not unusual that Joseph would be building a bunker at that time.

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This story, if I have not mentioned, is out of Austria. So he's building that bunker in the downstairs area.

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He's asking Elizabeth to help him hang a door down in the cellar.

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And I kind of understand that because I don't know about you guys, I have hung doors and it's not a one man job.

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You definitely need to have somebody there to help balance it on the hinges. Not only this, but Elizabeth was that difficult child.

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So he may have been trying to redirect her behavior. I don't know. I'm not going to speculate on that.

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Joseph was a very skilled handyman. He was an electric engineer and had a very precise blueprint of this bunker that he had been making in the basement.

182
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Did he just dream this thing up? Did he buy a plan for a bunker somewhere?

183
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Well, I feel like he probably made the blueprint on his own. He did have an engineer's mind.

184
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I don't know what the layout of the basement was, but he certainly did put some thought into it.

185
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Amazing.

186
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And that included installing a steel door in addition to a hinged door with eight additional doors throughout the bunker.

187
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That's fine. That's totally fine. This all seems really fine. Just good.

188
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Were all eight of the doors like a door puzzle just to get in or were the doors going to other places?

189
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I saw pictures of the bunker and it was very cramped. So I'm going to say, do you guys have a storm door on your house at home?

190
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Well, someone has a brand new one.

191
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As a matter of fact, I just got a storm door for Christmas. I'm a storm door person now.

192
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Don't you love them?

193
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Yes, storm door.

194
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If you were to look at the doors, they might have been kind of like a door with a storm door in front of it.

195
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But he probably placed them throughout the bunker in different areas, maybe in the different rooms that he had there.

196
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Okay.

197
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Yeah, that's what I'm imagining.

198
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Why would you want to imagine?

199
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Because you asked a question and I'm trying to answer.

200
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Like I have some kind of intelligence here, but I really don't have an answer for you. So I'm just making it sound intelligent. Am I?

201
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You're doing great. I just I don't want to imagine. I don't want to think about it.

202
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I don't want to make images in my head of the creepy doors with the eight puzzles. I don't want to do it. I don't want to do it.

203
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I was convinced I was hanging on every word. I was imagining the door set up with you.

204
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Yeah, he makes the bunker and he finished the job.

205
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He let Elizabeth go on. Thank you for your help.

206
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She turns to go upstairs and that's when Joseph places a cloth over her face soaked in ether, which made her pass out.

207
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When she woke up, Elizabeth found herself locked in the basement for the next 24 years.

208
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Okay.

209
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Now, listen, you can't say things like it's not gory and then people are in prison for 24 years because my definition of gory.

210
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That's not true. You're right. But for me, it's just worse than gory.

211
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It is. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to mislead you, lawyer. Please don't hate me.

212
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That's okay.

213
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It just seems a little bit too elaborate to me. So anyway, so he does the bunker with the eight doors.

214
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Yes. Elizabeth is now in the basement.

215
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So I have a question. So Elizabeth's in the basement. Yes.

216
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Who is living on the first floor besides the father? Is the mother still around?

217
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Oh, yes. The mother is there. She is there. And Joseph convinced her that Elizabeth had run away.

218
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Remember how I had told you that she was a troubled child?

219
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So she just she just for 24 years never once was like, let me go down into the cellar and get an item from the cellar.

220
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Not in one article that I read. Did the mother ever try to go downstairs?

221
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She just took her husband's word for it. Maybe. I don't know.

222
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She's here for the punishment.

223
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This is why you got to be a little suspicious sometimes.

224
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Don't be suspicious. Don't be suspicious.

225
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I agree. This might be jumping ahead. Is this are there children with her or am I confusing stories?

226
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No, you're not. I'm back to the gory thing again.

227
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I don't know how to answer that, lawyer. There's no blood, no guts.

228
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I'm trying to make this the best I can because I promise you it's a happy ending.

229
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All right, I'm ready. I'm tied in.

230
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Punishment or happy ending. We're there. Let's go.

231
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She's here for the punishment.

232
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Well, Joseph had told Rosemary, like I had mentioned, that Elizabeth had run off and she had joined a religious cult.

233
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And she basically was trying to separate herself and didn't want to have anything else to do with her family.

234
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Now, Joseph did think ahead here because he forced Elizabeth to write letters about her whereabouts.

235
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And Joseph even drove long distances to mail those letters to his home as a proof of life so that he could show Rosemary.

236
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Like the level of psychopath that we have reached.

237
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Absolutely. Yeah, he's thought this through. I know.

238
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Well, Rosemary just seemed okay with that because she didn't ask too many more questions.

239
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But over the next 24 years, Elizabeth was locked away in that bunker, either living in the cold, dark, damp conditions,

240
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or in the summer months, it got to be the equivalent of a sauna.

241
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And I don't know if you guys have ever sat in a sauna before, but it's extremely humid.

242
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You know, her conditions weren't great.

243
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Joseph kept her chained to her bed by her waist.

244
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And he did have relationships with her because over those years that she was held captive, Elizabeth produced seven babies.

245
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Can I just jump in here? Yeah. Not at all to be rude. No, no.

246
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But to say the word for that. Oh, my God.

247
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Got to use the ugly words. Sorry. Had to make it dark if we're going dark.

248
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Yeah. And I'm trying to be sensitive. But by all means, if I need to say the word, I will say the word.

249
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You can correct me. There's no wrong answers here.

250
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No, and I don't mean to do that. I just feel like, oh, I feel like there's a certain value in just being able to say, you know what?

251
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That is what happened. And I feel like, I don't know, I had a meeting last week with a young person who misunderstood something I said and said, well, what do you mean?

252
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Do you not believe that this is what happened to me? And I said, oh, no, absolutely not.

253
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So I don't know. Sometimes for me, it just feels so important that we if you're going to watch that.

254
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Yeah. If you're going to watch the train wreck, you got to you got to call it what it is.

255
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As hard as that is. Yeah, that makes sense. Well, three of the babies stayed in the bunker with Elizabeth.

256
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And unfortunately, one of them did die in her arms when the baby was about 66 hours old.

257
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But wait, did you say she had seven? She had seven. Three stayed in the bunker.

258
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Joseph took the rest upstairs to live in the house and call his own. Where did he say they came from?

259
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Now, he did actually tell family members, friends, anybody who may have questioned that Elizabeth did drop the kids off on the doorstep.

260
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This shit he has concocted is a full time job.

261
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Noddy, it's like a full time job with 80 hours of overtime every week. Like this is crazy.

262
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I literally do not have do not have words. I'm feeling really bad about this story.

263
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You know, no, no, I just I'm flabbergasted.

264
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I'm flabbergasted how the like host said, I mean, the level, the extent of premeditation, of planning, of just so many levels of deception for this whole horrible thing.

265
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Yeah. And there was a lot of mental abuse as well, because he did use threats against the lives of Elizabeth and the children.

266
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If they were ever to try to escape, he did say that he would kill them. Well, that even that goes more to just the preparation.

267
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I mean, the level of thought he's put into it. He actually told them as well that there that those doors that they had installed had electrical circuits in them.

268
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And if they touch the doors, they'd get shocked or a poisonous gas would be released. So he played a lot of mind games with them as well.

269
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Mm hmm. He's thought of everything he really has. But he didn't think about one day when one of Elizabeth's children got sick.

270
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Her name was Kirsten and she did become extremely ill. Well, Joseph actually had a smidgen of compassion one day and he did drive her to the hospital.

271
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Was this one of the kids who was still living in the bunker? Yes. Yeah. OK. How old is the kid?

272
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This would be 19 year old Kirsten. She lived there for 19 years. Yes.

273
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And he thinks he's just going to drive her on over to the doctor and they're not going to notice. Exactly.

274
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Well, they did notice because she was extremely pale. Elizabeth and her children did live in dark conditions with no sunlight.

275
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So she was extremely pale. Her teeth were rotted out. She was very malnourished and she was experiencing kidney failure.

276
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So she had a lot going on. And of course, the doctors did question what was going on.

277
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And although Joseph did state that Elizabeth had abandoned this granddaughter on his doorstep, obviously everything hit the news because back in the day in the 1980s, this is before HIPAA.

278
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This is before all those laws, the privacy laws and things like that. You know, you've heard of ambulance chasers, things like that.

279
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I don't know that Austria has HIPAA laws. No, that's true. You're right. You're right. But still some sort of thing like that, I'm sure.

280
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Yeah, because the news outlets did get a hold of this and they actually got on the news and broadcast a plea to the woman whose child this belongs to please come forward because we need some information to save her life.

281
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Elizabeth saw that on the little TV that Joseph was kind enough to leave in the basement for her. So she saw that.

282
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Wow. I'm blacking out again. Oh, see, he's not so bad. He gave her a TV. What a guy. Oh, wait, no, this is my first blackout of the episode. Okay. All right. I hung in there well. Okay.

283
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You did. You did, lawyer. All right. So Elizabeth saw those pleas on the TV. She begged Joseph to free her and her children.

284
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That would be 18-year-old Stefan and five-year-old Felix. So remember, there were three kids left in the cellar with her. And for some reason, some believe that it could be because of Joseph's age, but he did have a change of heart.

285
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And he literally opened the door and said, out you go, to Elizabeth and her children.

286
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And I'm assuming the four children who lived upstairs moved up there so early they had no clue that they had a mother and siblings just basically under their feet.

287
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Yeah. And so my question too was soundproof because surely they would have heard something going on. The TV was on or the pitter patter of small feet. I mean, I don't know. I wasn't there. I can't speculate.

288
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I don't know what to think. I can't speculate. I can't speculate. I can't speculate. I just can't. I just can't. I just can't believe it.

289
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How absolutely, absolutely awful. I mean, how absolutely awful. Yeah, absolutely.

290
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But Elizabeth and her children were released in April of 2008 and Elizabeth was

291
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42 years old now remember she went in there when she was 18

292
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She did come forward to speak to the doctors about Kirsten's medical condition

293
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She was in very similar health including the rotten teeth

294
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Anemia she had a vitamin D deficiency which weakened her bones and she had poor posture

295
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due to those tight living quarters from the bunker

296
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Originally authorities wanted to charge Elizabeth with child abuse

297
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But when Elizabeth was questioned she gave a completely different story about what had happened over the last 24 years

298
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And she basically said I will give you all the information that you need

299
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But I don't ever want to see him again

300
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So the authorities actually listened to her and Joseph was eventually arrested and charged with child imprisonment

301
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Rape and other charges and during his trial

302
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:27,280
Joseph pled not guilty and argued that he was doing everything for Elizabeth's own good

303
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Because she was a teenage runaway. I mean, but like he argued he did that because she ran away

304
00:34:34,780 --> 00:34:37,780
I mean, I guess maybe that's why he yeah

305
00:34:37,780 --> 00:34:39,780
I'm just curious

306
00:34:40,020 --> 00:34:45,860
Personally, did you say already? I don't think did he he just literally kept her in there with fear

307
00:34:45,860 --> 00:34:51,660
Yeah, like you'll get poisoned. You'll get electrocuted. He didn't try we're not talking like this isn't like an

308
00:34:52,500 --> 00:34:58,540
Unbreakable he didn't tell her like it had been the apocalypse or something. He just was like I'll kill you if you yes

309
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I will kill you if you leave and your children

310
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Oh Joseph's defense was that he was a good father because he supplied Elizabeth with books

311
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:14,080
That TV I had mentioned an aquarium and even a pet canary

312
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:22,040
How is a pet canary going to live in the dark? Very strange. I don't know did it? Oh, well, it's the thought that

313
00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:27,920
Maybe you should have gotten her a bat instead of a canary

314
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:36,440
Well, he was eventually found guilty and was sentenced to life in prison with the eligibility of parole in 2023

315
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:41,920
Oh, wait a minute now. Just wait a minute. How long has he served? He got life in prison

316
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:49,960
So he went to trial in 2008 and he's got eligibility for parole coming up in 2023

317
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:56,160
And he's currently 87 years old and suffers from dementia

318
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:58,160
Dementia, so that's his condition now

319
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:00,840
They'll probably let him go

320
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,400
Probably and that's yeah, that's the unfortunate part

321
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,320
Well, I'm speechless again, so

322
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:13,440
It's a little bit different podcast than what you're used to and my apologies. I feel terrible

323
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,480
This is what she does

324
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:24,160
This is just I should have yeah, I should have warned you that this is kind of this is my stick

325
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:31,800
Because I am stick I am actually dying inside but my love for the host and the mom

326
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:34,360
drives me through my

327
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:36,920
deep deep

328
00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:38,600
emotional trauma

329
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:43,440
Through to the podcast so it's honestly fine. You're doing great

330
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:49,360
Do you thought you were gonna have the night off tonight? Didn't you? No, I still have not recovered from the fact

331
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:51,360
I was like 30 minutes late

332
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,880
You were late and now you're bullying her

333
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:59,680
Sorry for actually sorry for actually making you feel like I was

334
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:07,920
Traumatized I am but it's fine. Ah, that's what I do. I'm sorry. You'll have to blame. You'll have to blame my parents, unfortunately

335
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:11,480
It's always the parents fault, isn't it?

336
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:20,600
Well, I don't know because I have the perfect child, you know

337
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:27,440
Well months after Elizabeth and her children were released from the bunker

338
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:34,720
They maintained residency at a local psychiatric facility that helped treat them for the trauma that they experienced

339
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:37,360
during that isolation period

340
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:44,880
Psychiatrists do praise Elizabeth's for her strength because she obviously formed a very close bond with her children

341
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,880
Which they believe helped in the healing process

342
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:53,200
I know that there has got to be a lot that she needs to overcome here

343
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:59,520
But Elizabeth and her children were given an isolated apartment at that facility

344
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,880
So they're still living together and I think that's amazing. That's nice

345
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:08,800
Yeah, and they were also given a shipping container

346
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:14,640
Think about what you guys see on a train as it goes by you those big metal shipping containers

347
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:18,680
they were given a shipping container just outside of

348
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:24,800
Their apartment in the event that the victims felt like they needed to retreat

349
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:27,640
Pulling back into the cellar that is

350
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:35,240
Beyond words to me. I mean it's good but it just tells you how much trauma that they've lived with which is unfortunate

351
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:42,000
Yeah, right. It speaks to the impact which is just there are no words to yeah after it

352
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:47,640
I just wonder if she ever kind of bonded or formed any kind of

353
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:55,160
Relationship with the other kids and what a shock that had to have been to them to find out their mother wasn't living in some

354
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,160
You know, I don't know hippie

355
00:38:57,160 --> 00:39:03,360
Rastafarian commune that that she actually had been downstairs their entire lives

356
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:10,040
Yeah, and I'm sure that Joseph was telling them that she had run away and just abandoned them too

357
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:12,040
So there's no winners here, right?

358
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:14,320
Didn't love them. Yeah, right

359
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,560
Well after so many years of being held in that dark environment

360
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:25,240
the experts were aware that there could be psychological damage from exposure to daylight and

361
00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:27,240
Open spaces Wow

362
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:32,000
So it's not just being closed up in that environment and you know

363
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,040
Needing that with the storage bin outside

364
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:43,520
It's also the fear of the wide open spaces and that's just a lot of trauma that Elizabeth and her children are gonna have to deal with

365
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:44,720
Oh, yeah

366
00:39:44,720 --> 00:39:51,360
But as of today Elizabeth does still live in isolation, but she was given a new identity

367
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:53,840
to protect her privacy and

368
00:39:53,840 --> 00:40:01,240
There is no further information on her whereabouts the story kind of ends here because she does have her new identity

369
00:40:01,720 --> 00:40:03,040
and

370
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:08,040
Whoever gave her that identity is doing a great job keeping everything private

371
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:13,360
So kudos to them and that is the story of Elizabeth Ritzel

372
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:18,440
Well, we came to a happy or as happy as can be ending

373
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:21,400
So you got us there step by step

374
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:26,920
It was a process for sure. So I personally commend Elizabeth for

375
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:35,640
Finding the voice that she needed when she appealed to her father with letting her go that really probably took a lot of guts

376
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:41,640
But you know her her daughter was in pain and she saw that from whatever was on TV

377
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:46,840
I've got goosebumps upon goosebumps right now because I know Elizabeth is a strong woman

378
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:51,960
and she is a role model for any victims out there. So Elizabeth

379
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:55,160
I know you're probably not listening to this

380
00:40:55,160 --> 00:41:02,160
But I definitely wish you well in this, you know in this whole experience that you had and I just know that you have good things coming

381
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:06,840
Yeah, I think they should have taken the father and stuck him in the bunker for 24 years

382
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:10,800
You know what eye for an eye sometimes that would not be a bad idea

383
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:14,280
Mom is very eye for an eye

384
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:17,280
People have probably learned that by now

385
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,280
I'm very vengeful

386
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:21,280
Retribution

387
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:33,280
But I think more about Elizabeth and her kids and I am just grateful like you, Deb that they did get their freedom

388
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:37,280
And I think that is really due to their mom's strength

389
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:42,280
And I just I cannot I literally cannot imagine like you

390
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:47,280
You and Laura have said there are no words and it doesn't even end up but this is like

391
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:53,280
Happy as it can get ending and most people in true crime stories don't get an ending like this

392
00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:58,280
But it's still to endure all of that and imagine. Amen. Yeah

393
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:02,280
Yeah, and I think that just shows her strength, but I can't speak for her

394
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:07,280
I know she's probably still dealing with a lot and it doesn't go over it doesn't go away overnight

395
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:13,280
But she can certainly certainly be that person we know it's a terrible world out there

396
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:18,280
And she may be helping somebody or you know, even her children

397
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:26,280
I'm glad that they're all sticking together here. So yeah, that's nice. Anyway, yeah, so that's my story today

398
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,280
Oh, okay

399
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,280
Do do do do do do do do

400
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,280
Thank you for telling us that story

401
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:39,280
All right, so to our hosts of the murderer, you know, thanks so much for joining me today

402
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:46,280
I hope I didn't traumatize you too much and I do appreciate how I'm growing my little true crime community here

403
00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:53,280
So listeners, be sure to find the murderer, you know on Instagram or check out their website at the murderer

404
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:59,280
You know podcast calm and don't forget to follow dying to be found in the dash

405
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:03,280
So there we go. Yay

406
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:04,280
Sayonara

407
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:10,280
Thanks for listening to dying to be found true crime podcast in our dash mini series every week

408
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:18,280
We'll bring you a variety of true crime episodes a little dash of hope plus special bonus episodes with some really cool guests

409
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:24,280
Before we go, we'd love for you to share this podcast with your friends and give us a five star review

410
00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:34,280
Follow us on tick tock Instagram Twitter Facebook and Pinterest at dying to be found or visit our website at dying to be found.com

411
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:43,280
Spelled just like you see in our logo better yet click on our link tree account found in the show notes where you'll find all the information in one place

412
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:51,280
Be sure to dash in every Wednesday for our mini episodes plus every Thursday when I get together with some of my family members

413
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,280
Thanks again, everyone and we'll talk to you soon