WEBVTT

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Welcome to In the Scenes, a podcast by Broken

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and Mended. And now your host, David Heflin.

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Well, hello and welcome you back to In the Scenes.

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It's actually our first podcast of this year.

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So I hope all of you had a wonderful holiday

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season. I hope that your new year is off to a

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good start, despite I know the fact that many

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of our listeners, of course, the reason why they're

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listening to this show is they have challenges

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that can make some of these things difficult,

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including the holidays. But I hope and pray that

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you've been able to find blessings in the midst

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of your difficulties. I'm excited to have as

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my guest today, Miles Washburn. And Miles is

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here to talk about his story with and he'll help

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us if I need any extra help on the pronunciation

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there, but it's something I know that probably

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some of our listeners struggle with. And yet

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a lot of people might not even know what it is

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and probably some people in between. I'm becoming

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educated on it myself as I've gotten to know

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Miles. And it is something that's a very difficult,

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incapacitating autoimmune disorder. He's going

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to tell us about it and what happened to him.

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But like so many of the stories that we have

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on this podcast, it doesn't just end in the...

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event itself, but an inspiring story that will

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be a benefit to others has come out of that.

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And that's why Miles is here on the show so he

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can share about that today. And I think it will

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help in two ways for those of you listening.

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Number one, for those who want to give to Miles's

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cause, which he'll tell us about, we certainly

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want to encourage that. And he'll explain that,

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where it goes, how it's used, all that kind of

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thing. But number two, just as important, is

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there may be people with GBS out there who are

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listening to this, who need to know about the

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resource he's going to share with us, and I hope

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will just simply be inspired and encouraged by

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this story. And as a reminder that You know,

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you're not alone in this. So, Miles, I want to

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just welcome you to the show and thank you for

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joining us today. Thank you, David. It's a real

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honor and a privilege to be here on your podcast.

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I'm looking forward to this and I'm looking forward

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to helping to raise some awareness about the

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GBS CIDP Foundation and of course about GBS.

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Unfortunately, when you talk to most people...

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you know the common phrase of nine out of ten

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people have never heard of something this is

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more like you know 999 out of a thousand have

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never heard of gbs and when i mentioned gbs they

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go what what's that and it turns into a long

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explanation Well, and I think even for me, I've

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been in chronic illness ministry since 2018.

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And certainly, I've heard of it. I've come across

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it. But to be truthful, I didn't have any understanding

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of it until you and I began talking. So I've

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already benefited from our conversations here

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off air and even talking to you before today.

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So, I mean, just a few minutes ago, basically,

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we were talking about how You know, everyone,

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before they have some kind of health crisis that

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changes their lives, they have a before life.

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They had a life with expectations and the way

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things were going. And it gets interrupted certainly

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quite drastically by whatever happens, in your

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case, GBS. I'm wondering if you can just share

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a little bit about who you are, what your life

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was like, what your interests were before GBS,

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and what you were doing when this difficult journey

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began. Absolutely. The first thing I'll say is

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I'm a Christian, first and foremost, a big believer

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in God and prayer, and those certainly came into

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play during my hospital stay. I've been an athlete

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all my life. I was an avid bicycle racer at a

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pretty high level as a young man. I had a very

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serious accident, which pretty much ended the

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racing career. I played competitive hockey for

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years. As I got older, took up the game of golf

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and wound up playing on an amateur tour for five

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years, enjoyed a lot of success to that. Thanks

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to God and the talents that he gave me. I've

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been a small businessman, worked in the corporate

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world, ran my own consulting firm for years,

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wound up again with golf, being an assistant

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golf pro for a bunch of years and eventually

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retired. Happily married, couple of dogs, got

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a two year old. Almost two -year -old golden

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retriever puppy who is wide open. It's like having

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a dozen six -year -olds in the house at the same

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time Just play play But really happily married

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and and got a great -grandson wonderful stepson

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and family and just happily living my life I'm

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enjoying retirement if you will and then You

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know got slapped in the face with GBS Well, tell

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us a little bit. Thank you for sharing that,

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by the way, and just the background there. And

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obviously, when you have been athletic and being

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able to do the things that you love to do and

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to be able to do them at a higher level, when

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something like this comes into play, it's obviously

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going to be life -altering. And so talk to us

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just a little bit about essentially what happened,

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what gave you the sign that there was a problem,

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and how did you... eventually receive the diagnosis

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of a GBS? Gosh, that's a no one's ever asked

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me how I received the diagnosis of GBS. That's

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a good question. But how did it happen? Well,

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a year ago, right around this time, actually,

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I got hit with RSV. And I got it pretty badly,

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actually, and I couldn't shake it. And I was

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on all kinds of medicines, one medicine after

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another, after another. And then kind of getting

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over it, but not really. I got a phone call from

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a friend of mine in the western part of North

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Carolina up in the mountains saying, gee, Miles,

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a tree has fallen across your driveway. And it's

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my tree. Could you use some help cleaning it

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up? And I said, absolutely. I said, I'll come

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up tonight. We'll do it tomorrow morning. I had

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my stepson and family coming to the mountain

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house to go skiing that week. And I said to my

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wife, I'll just stay there. I'll just, you know,

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I'll get this tree cleared and kind of clean

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things up and I'll just stay. Right. So I drove

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up on a Sunday evening and woke up Monday morning

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and I had this lisp, which was the weirdest thing.

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It was like a speech impediment. I didn't think

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much of it. I thought, wow, this is a reaction

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to one of how much medication I'm taking for

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RSV. I didn't think a lot of it. I was out with

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my neighbor, my buddy, and we cut up this tree.

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It was 18 degrees out with a minus one wind chill.

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It was pretty pleasant, tropical, if you will.

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We spent hours out there cleaning this tree up.

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Got it cleaned up got done got back in the house

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and I've been running a chainsaw for hours And

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I got back in the house and I was like, wow,

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I'm really tired, you know, and I'm in pretty

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good shape I'm 62 years old at the time, but

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I'm still in pretty good shape. It's weird. I'm

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this tired. I didn't think much other kind of

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got cleaned up and You know the lisp was still

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there and I discovered I couldn't spit I lost

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the opportunity and the ability to spit You know,

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you're outside getting a mouthful of sawdust

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because you're talking to your friend, and you

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know, I have to reach my finger in to clean out

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my mouth. I thought, this is kind of weird. So

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I got back in the house. I kind of warmed up,

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and I swear God was sitting on my shoulder because

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he said, Miles, you need to go home. And I said,

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well, you know, here I am getting into an argument

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with God, which I never win those arguments.

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And I said, well, no, I need to stay because

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You know, family's coming up in a couple days

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and God said, no, you really kind of need to

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go home. Something's not right. So I said, okay,

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I'm going to go home. So I got my dog and got

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him in the truck and I was getting ready to pull

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out and God's on my shoulder and he says, uh,

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you need to shut this house down. You're not

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coming back anytime soon. And I was like, well,

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that's ridiculous. I'm coming back in two days.

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And you know, the little voice saying, no, no,

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you really need to shut the house down. Shut

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it down. Like you're not coming back for months.

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And so I got out of the truck. I called my wife

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and I said, I'm gonna be about another half an

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hour because I'm shutting the house down. My

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wife's like, what? That doesn't make any sense.

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But I did and I'm glad I did because I got home

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and that night I discovered while eating dinner,

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I said, wow, you know, not only do I have this

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list, I'm unbelievably tired. I'm having a hard

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time swallowing my dinner. Now this has got to

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be reaction to all the medicine I'm taking. So

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I go to bed. And at midnight, midnight, Monday,

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Monday, late night, Tuesday, early morning, midnight,

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literally at like 1202, I woke up choking. And

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what I was doing was aspirating on saliva because

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I couldn't swallow. The ability to swallow was

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now gone completely, which scared the you know

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what out of me. So I'm up now for the rest of

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the night sitting in a chair, spitting into a

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cup or a paper towel or something. Think of somebody

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who chews tobacco, for example. I can't swallow.

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So I call the doctor first thing in the morning

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and she says, come in, you're having a reaction

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to the medicine. I'll give you a Benadryl shot.

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Big, big Benadryl shot. So I go in, get the shot

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and she says, look, if this isn't better in an

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hour, you got to come back. I said, okay. So

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being the typical guy who hates doctors and refuses

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to go unless he actually has to, I wait two hours.

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With no improvement if anything things are a

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little bit worse and my wife says nope. We're

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going to the ER So I go to the ER where I'm promptly

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misdiagnosed by a PA Who says oh you've got a

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problem with your esophagus your esophagus is

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wrong And by the way, it took him hours to figure

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that out So I go home, you know trying to get

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back in the truck Because my wife drove I realized

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I can barely pull myself up into the truck. I'm

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losing strength Frighteningly fast I get home

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We've been the emergency room for six hours now

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My wife makes herself dinner I can't eat because

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I can't swallow I can't drink any water because

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I can't swallow Well, I'm basically this guy

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who's super weak has a heavy heavy list like

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a speech impediment and can't swallow sitting

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in a chair. My wife finally says about eight

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o 'clock I'm exhausted I'm going to bed you know

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here's my cell phone call me if there's a problem

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I'm going to be right on the other side of that

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wall. I said no problem you know I'm going back

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to the doctor tomorrow though. About 11 o 'clock

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at night I got to go to the bathroom because

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you go to the emergency room they give you these

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bags of IV fluid and it goes in it's eventually

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asked to come out and I can't get out of the

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chair. I physically cannot push myself or stand

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out of a chair. So I call my wife. In about less

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than two seconds, she's standing in front of

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me saying, what do you mean you can't get out

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of the chair? And I, sure, I physically cannot

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get up. Terrifying. She helps me up or upon she

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promptly drops me. And I'm now on my knees on

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the floor and I can't get up. And we eventually

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work our way up from a small footstool to a bigger

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footstool to a bigger footstool to a small chair.

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And I finally get to the point where I'm standing.

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She helps me get to the men's room. I do what

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I have to do. And I come out and I lean against

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the wall and I said, go to the bedroom, pack

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me a bag. We have to go back to the hospital

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and I promise you I'm not coming home. Something's

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seriously wrong. Get to the emergency room. The

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nurse recognizes me from being there earlier.

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and looks at me and says, I'm getting a wheelchair

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before you fall down. And I immediately was taken

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behind and seen by a doctor this time. And by

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the grace of God, and God alone, it was the chief

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of staff of all the doctors at the hospital.

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And he looked at me and he said, Mr. Washburn,

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I think you're having a stroke. Well, the only

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word I heard was having. And meanwhile, I'm trying

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to tell him what's going on. My speech has gotten

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so bad. My wife is acting as an interpreter Because

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the doctor can't understand me. And so my wife

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is kind of figuring out what I'm saying and telling

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him He immediately orders a brain MRI because

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he thinks I'm having a stroke That was that was

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a pleasant experience about an hour and a half

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an hour and 45 minutes And he gave me Robonol

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to dry up my secretions because I couldn't lie

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down because if I lay down, all the spit would

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run down into my throat and I'd be choking. So

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he dried up all the secretions. It was like blinking

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with sandpaper because you become so dry. And

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I get out of the MRI and he's actually waiting

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for me. And he says, well, Mr. Washburn, the

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good news is you have a brain with no lesions.

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The bad news is I don't know what's wrong with

00:14:08.620 --> 00:14:10.840
you, but we're going to admit you. And this is

00:14:10.840 --> 00:14:13.139
where I heard it the first time. He said, you

00:14:13.139 --> 00:14:16.259
have one of four things. You either have Guillain

00:14:16.259 --> 00:14:20.100
-Barre syndrome, Elliott -Barr syndrome, an exotic

00:14:20.100 --> 00:14:22.519
tick or flea bite, or something else. I don't

00:14:22.519 --> 00:14:24.759
remember what the fourth thing was. The next

00:14:24.759 --> 00:14:26.759
words out of his mouth were, we're admitting

00:14:26.759 --> 00:14:29.000
you to the hospital, you're not going home, and

00:14:29.000 --> 00:14:32.360
where have you been? And so through my interpreter

00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:34.460
wife, you know, I explained to her I've been

00:14:34.460 --> 00:14:37.059
to, you know, Beach Mountain, Banner Alk, and

00:14:37.059 --> 00:14:40.139
Pinehurst. And he goes, no, no, where have you

00:14:40.139 --> 00:14:42.919
been? And it occurred to me at that point, he

00:14:42.919 --> 00:14:44.840
thinks I have an exotic tick or spider bite.

00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:48.740
And I say nowhere, nowhere. And he said, well,

00:14:48.740 --> 00:14:50.559
I'm going to have you being treated for all four

00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:52.600
of these things until we figure out what's wrong

00:14:52.600 --> 00:14:54.779
with you. I actually have two open textbooks,

00:14:54.940 --> 00:14:57.840
textbooks on my desk, as well as my computer

00:14:57.840 --> 00:15:00.980
trying to figure out what's wrong. I'm admitted

00:15:00.980 --> 00:15:03.399
to the hospital. I don't even realize I'm in

00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:06.539
the ICU for several days because I just I didn't

00:15:06.539 --> 00:15:11.879
know. And they start. testing me for everything.

00:15:12.299 --> 00:15:15.899
Cat scans, spinal tap. The spinal tap was for

00:15:15.899 --> 00:15:17.519
the Guillain -Barre because the Guillain -Barre,

00:15:17.700 --> 00:15:19.659
they rule everything out and then the Guillain

00:15:19.659 --> 00:15:22.899
-Barre after a couple of days actually produces

00:15:22.899 --> 00:15:25.879
some sort of an enzyme in the spinal tap and

00:15:25.879 --> 00:15:28.539
that's how they figure it out along with losing

00:15:28.539 --> 00:15:34.220
your reflexes. So I'm going on and on about this.

00:15:34.639 --> 00:15:36.059
Hopefully I'm going to give you your answer of

00:15:36.059 --> 00:15:41.340
how high news. He comes in a couple days later

00:15:41.340 --> 00:15:44.480
or so and goes, ah, look at that. That's great

00:15:44.480 --> 00:15:46.700
news. And I go, what's good news? He goes, you've

00:15:46.700 --> 00:15:49.139
lost your reflexes. And I said, doctor, how is

00:15:49.139 --> 00:15:52.559
me losing my reflexes good news? He goes, because

00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:55.019
when I get your spinal test, when I get your

00:15:55.019 --> 00:15:58.340
spinal tap test back today, it's going to show

00:15:58.340 --> 00:16:00.620
you have Guillain -Barre and then we'll know

00:16:00.620 --> 00:16:03.940
what to treat. Sure enough, several hours later,

00:16:03.940 --> 00:16:06.580
he comes in, says you have Guillain -Barre syndrome

00:16:06.580 --> 00:16:10.669
and all this medication. disappears from that

00:16:10.669 --> 00:16:14.549
big metal rack that they hang above your hospital

00:16:14.549 --> 00:16:17.070
bed with all the bags and medicines hanging down.

00:16:17.330 --> 00:16:19.250
Because again, I was being treated for four different

00:16:19.250 --> 00:16:21.190
things. Now they're just treating it for Guillain

00:16:21.190 --> 00:16:25.850
-Barre. And I guess I kind of took it in stride

00:16:25.850 --> 00:16:28.730
because I didn't know what it was. And I was

00:16:28.730 --> 00:16:31.049
like, well, if they can treat it, OK, you know,

00:16:31.149 --> 00:16:33.690
some kind of sickness that will go away. No big

00:16:33.690 --> 00:16:36.210
deal. They've got their arms around this. I'm

00:16:36.210 --> 00:16:39.090
in the right place. I had never heard of it.

00:16:39.250 --> 00:16:41.230
I didn't know what it was. I didn't know what

00:16:41.230 --> 00:16:44.049
the implications were. And I didn't know what

00:16:44.049 --> 00:16:50.169
I call the GBS hangover would be like. So I kind

00:16:50.169 --> 00:16:53.330
of took it in stride in the beginning. Like somebody

00:16:53.330 --> 00:16:56.269
tells you, you broke your arm, but it's going

00:16:56.269 --> 00:17:00.870
to be OK. I didn't know what it was. And I think

00:17:00.870 --> 00:17:04.019
most people, I think, I think a lot of doctors

00:17:04.019 --> 00:17:06.920
don't know what it is. They spend a couple hours

00:17:06.920 --> 00:17:11.660
in med school on it maybe, but it's so rare that

00:17:11.660 --> 00:17:13.920
they don't come across it very often. I think

00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:18.720
my physician, I think told me in 20 years, I

00:17:18.720 --> 00:17:22.319
was her third case. And my neurologist said to

00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:25.039
me, in 20 plus years, I was maybe his fifth or

00:17:25.039 --> 00:17:27.500
sixth case. He hadn't seen a case in five years.

00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:31.299
Really? Yeah, it's pretty rare. It's pretty rare.

00:17:35.490 --> 00:17:38.170
I was just thinking as you're talking about this

00:17:38.170 --> 00:17:42.609
in terms of just the time compression part of

00:17:42.609 --> 00:17:49.230
it. How long between RSV until you were first

00:17:49.230 --> 00:17:51.990
being told that you have GBS? It didn't sound

00:17:51.990 --> 00:17:56.309
like much time had passed in total. Well, I would

00:17:56.309 --> 00:18:01.630
say maybe a month because you get sick and you

00:18:01.630 --> 00:18:05.210
think, I got a cold. and maybe have a sinus infection.

00:18:06.289 --> 00:18:08.349
And then you have that for, you know, 10 days,

00:18:08.430 --> 00:18:09.630
a couple of weeks. You go, oh, gee, you know,

00:18:09.650 --> 00:18:11.910
this hasn't gone away. Maybe I need to go to

00:18:11.910 --> 00:18:15.069
the doctor. And, you know, you go to your typical

00:18:15.069 --> 00:18:17.410
walk -in clinic and they give you all the COVID

00:18:17.410 --> 00:18:19.670
tests and the flu tests and the RSV tests. And

00:18:19.670 --> 00:18:21.109
they come out and they say, oh, you have RSV.

00:18:21.109 --> 00:18:23.730
And then they start giving you medicine. You

00:18:23.730 --> 00:18:31.589
know, maybe a month because of all the respiratory

00:18:32.299 --> 00:18:36.079
illness, if you will, that led up to it. But

00:18:36.079 --> 00:18:38.359
from when the symptoms hit, it was very, very

00:18:38.359 --> 00:18:41.420
fast. Because the symptoms hit Monday morning,

00:18:42.119 --> 00:18:46.900
and I was admitted to the hospital Tuesday morning

00:18:46.900 --> 00:18:53.339
at about 2 a .m. OK. Yeah, that's it. And I just

00:18:53.339 --> 00:18:55.980
bring that out because you're dealing with these.

00:18:56.539 --> 00:18:59.079
scary and catastrophic symptoms and they're just

00:18:59.079 --> 00:19:04.079
cascading on top of one another. Like you said,

00:19:04.240 --> 00:19:09.220
you had somewhat of an explanation in your mind

00:19:09.220 --> 00:19:11.900
that this was just from the medicine or the after

00:19:11.900 --> 00:19:14.819
effects of RSV and all that. It allows you to

00:19:14.819 --> 00:19:18.059
look past when the list starts and all that.

00:19:19.140 --> 00:19:21.599
But it is so different for everyone. I was just

00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:25.700
thinking about how in my situation, injured my

00:19:25.700 --> 00:19:30.400
hips in March of 2011 and then every time it

00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:33.660
took it took a year before I got my actually

00:19:33.660 --> 00:19:35.500
a year and a half before I was diagnosed with

00:19:35.500 --> 00:19:37.839
ankylosing spondylitis I won't get into what

00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:39.799
that is today my listeners have heard it before

00:19:39.799 --> 00:19:41.700
and then it took another year after that to be

00:19:41.700 --> 00:19:45.319
diagnosed with Crohn's and I think it's just

00:19:45.319 --> 00:19:48.609
so different because for me that was still seemed

00:19:48.609 --> 00:19:50.890
like life was changing rapidly. So that's what

00:19:50.890 --> 00:19:53.009
I'm trying to get in my mind, just how rapid

00:19:53.009 --> 00:19:57.029
this struck you and how much your life changed

00:19:57.029 --> 00:20:02.710
overnight. And so, you know, kind of how you

00:20:02.710 --> 00:20:04.589
sound like you were just trying to take it in,

00:20:04.630 --> 00:20:06.829
trying to grasp it. You're obviously glad it

00:20:06.829 --> 00:20:09.450
wasn't a stroke. But when do you really kind

00:20:09.450 --> 00:20:12.609
of come into possession of the knowledge that

00:20:12.759 --> 00:20:15.019
this is going to be something that I'm going

00:20:15.019 --> 00:20:17.539
to have to deal with. I'm not just going to be

00:20:17.539 --> 00:20:19.539
able to have a surgery or take a pill and this

00:20:19.539 --> 00:20:22.940
is going to be gone. So kind of tell me how you

00:20:22.940 --> 00:20:24.680
really came to understand that this was going

00:20:24.680 --> 00:20:28.140
to be something more long -term. That's a great

00:20:28.140 --> 00:20:30.740
question and I'm glad you asked it and I think

00:20:30.740 --> 00:20:33.900
that most GBS patients that listen to this or

00:20:33.900 --> 00:20:35.339
I talk to them in the future are going to say

00:20:35.339 --> 00:20:37.980
the same thing. Probably not until after they

00:20:37.980 --> 00:20:41.359
got out of the hospital because nobody really

00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:45.460
tells you what it is or what you're gonna deal

00:20:45.460 --> 00:20:51.279
with because they don't know. They don't know

00:20:51.279 --> 00:20:54.839
enough about it. Now I will say my neurologist

00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:57.720
that I had in the hospital was amazing. I remember

00:20:57.720 --> 00:20:59.740
the day before I left the hospital, he said to

00:20:59.740 --> 00:21:01.880
me, he goes, and it was just he and I in the

00:21:01.880 --> 00:21:04.200
room. He came and talked to me when my wife wasn't

00:21:04.200 --> 00:21:07.079
there. I think he did that on purpose. And he

00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:10.299
said, look, your Guillain -Barre syndrome doesn't

00:21:10.299 --> 00:21:13.420
go away. You keep it forever. Now, hopefully

00:21:13.420 --> 00:21:15.680
it never comes back to bother you. It probably

00:21:15.680 --> 00:21:19.960
won't. The repeat rate is very, very, very rare.

00:21:20.740 --> 00:21:26.200
And you have a very rare disorder with an extremely

00:21:26.200 --> 00:21:30.200
rare, rare variance. I have a combination of

00:21:30.200 --> 00:21:32.059
two variants. One of them is the Miller -Fisher

00:21:32.059 --> 00:21:34.960
variant. And he told me the other variant that's

00:21:34.960 --> 00:21:37.200
in there. And quite frankly, I don't remember

00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:41.900
GBS as GBS. I mean, it doesn't go away. And he

00:21:41.900 --> 00:21:43.750
said, He said, you're going to have some after

00:21:43.750 --> 00:21:45.089
effects that you're going to have to deal with

00:21:45.089 --> 00:21:47.970
and hopefully they get better over time. One

00:21:47.970 --> 00:21:49.769
of them is you're going to get anxiety. You're

00:21:49.769 --> 00:21:53.250
going to get it. You're it's going to show up

00:21:53.250 --> 00:21:56.609
and it's going to leave as fast as it comes or

00:21:56.609 --> 00:21:59.089
it may stay for the rest of the day. And you're

00:21:59.089 --> 00:22:00.769
not going to understand why. It's because your

00:22:00.769 --> 00:22:03.890
body is changing. Your your immune system is

00:22:03.890 --> 00:22:06.849
changing. Your your emotions are changing. It

00:22:06.849 --> 00:22:09.450
just it is what it is. He said the other thing

00:22:09.450 --> 00:22:11.369
you're going to have to deal with is nerve pain.

00:22:11.440 --> 00:22:16.380
I know you understand that. The myelin sheaths

00:22:16.380 --> 00:22:19.039
around your nerves have been degenerated due

00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:21.119
to your GBS and your nerves have been attacked

00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:23.579
due to GBS and it's going to hurt. It's going

00:22:23.579 --> 00:22:25.180
to hurt and you're going to have to deal with

00:22:25.180 --> 00:22:28.240
that. Pain is something I'm kind of used to from

00:22:28.240 --> 00:22:30.420
being involved in athletics all my life. You're

00:22:30.420 --> 00:22:33.019
used to pain. You're used to injuries. You just

00:22:33.019 --> 00:22:35.299
learn to put up with it and quite frankly the

00:22:35.299 --> 00:22:38.380
nerve pain any GBS patient will tell you can

00:22:38.380 --> 00:22:42.400
be terrible. I manage it the best I can and when

00:22:42.400 --> 00:22:45.539
I don't, I have a prescription that helps. I

00:22:45.539 --> 00:22:48.079
use Gabapen. That's what I use. I don't want

00:22:48.079 --> 00:22:51.500
to take a narcotic. The other thing that can

00:22:51.500 --> 00:22:53.940
be, and this is my wife's word and it's absolutely

00:22:53.940 --> 00:22:56.960
perfect, that can be crushing is the chronic

00:22:56.960 --> 00:23:01.220
fatigue. The fatigue that comes with this, and

00:23:01.220 --> 00:23:02.940
I imagine it's because your body is always trying

00:23:02.940 --> 00:23:06.180
to heal. The fatigue can be crushing. I mean,

00:23:06.180 --> 00:23:09.000
I can wake up My wife uses the expression when

00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:10.759
you wake up in the morning, it's crackerjacks.

00:23:11.200 --> 00:23:13.839
You open the box and you see what you got. She

00:23:13.839 --> 00:23:15.500
goes, in your case, you get up in the morning,

00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:18.420
you have your cup of coffee or two, and you sit

00:23:18.420 --> 00:23:20.240
down and you watch the news, and you kind of

00:23:20.240 --> 00:23:23.259
see where you are today, how your body is feeling.

00:23:23.920 --> 00:23:25.940
And there are days I have where it's kind of

00:23:25.940 --> 00:23:28.400
like nothing ever happened. I feel kind of normal.

00:23:29.140 --> 00:23:32.160
Then there are days that I'm really, really tired.

00:23:32.509 --> 00:23:34.829
Yeah, but you kind of get through it you work

00:23:34.829 --> 00:23:37.650
through it Yeah, you just you get through it

00:23:37.650 --> 00:23:40.069
and then there are the days that it's the crushing

00:23:40.069 --> 00:23:42.950
fatigue Where I look at my wife and I say nothing

00:23:42.950 --> 00:23:45.269
is happening today. I'm gonna sit in this chair.

00:23:45.390 --> 00:23:47.009
I'm gonna read a book I'm gonna watch mindless

00:23:47.009 --> 00:23:50.150
TV and eventually this fatigue will leave but

00:23:50.150 --> 00:23:54.369
until it does there's nothing happening so it

00:23:54.369 --> 00:23:57.730
is Absolutely life -changing and as an athlete

00:23:58.679 --> 00:24:01.980
I remember I was in the hospital and I had this

00:24:01.980 --> 00:24:05.700
really nice lady who was, I don't know, I want

00:24:05.700 --> 00:24:08.000
to say my age, but she'd probably wheel back

00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:13.059
at that. I'm sure she was younger. And she could

00:24:13.059 --> 00:24:15.880
tell I was having a hard time. And it wasn't

00:24:15.880 --> 00:24:18.440
with a hard time with being in the physical therapy.

00:24:18.460 --> 00:24:20.700
It was a hard time kind of figuring out what

00:24:20.700 --> 00:24:22.279
was going on with my body. And she said, are

00:24:22.279 --> 00:24:24.759
you okay? And I looked at her and I said, you

00:24:24.759 --> 00:24:26.960
know, whatever her name was, I don't remember.

00:24:27.279 --> 00:24:29.880
I said at one time in my life, I was an elite

00:24:29.880 --> 00:24:33.079
athlete in two different sports. I've been to

00:24:33.079 --> 00:24:35.599
the national championships in two different sports.

00:24:36.660 --> 00:24:39.740
And here I am, I can barely move my arms and

00:24:39.740 --> 00:24:43.200
legs. Kind of having a hard time with that today.

00:24:44.000 --> 00:24:48.359
And she got it. She understood that. And that

00:24:48.359 --> 00:24:51.920
actually helped me a lot because she just sat

00:24:51.920 --> 00:24:54.299
there. My physical therapy session was that day

00:24:54.299 --> 00:24:56.539
we just sat and talked. And that was probably

00:24:56.539 --> 00:25:00.960
the first time I ever talked about GBS and what

00:25:00.960 --> 00:25:04.000
it was doing to me and how I was going to cope

00:25:04.000 --> 00:25:09.119
with it. You know, another gentleman came to

00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:12.460
see me probably that same day in the afternoon

00:25:12.460 --> 00:25:15.839
and she very well could have sent him, was a

00:25:15.839 --> 00:25:19.099
pastor. A gentleman knocked on my door. Of course,

00:25:19.119 --> 00:25:20.759
you know, I really can't move on my command.

00:25:21.359 --> 00:25:24.400
Again, I'm hardly able to move. the guy walks

00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:27.579
in and he sits down never seen the guy in my

00:25:27.579 --> 00:25:30.720
life he sits down and he said to me before he

00:25:30.720 --> 00:25:33.680
even introduced himself to me he said do you

00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:37.640
feel like God has left you and I said absolutely

00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:40.660
not I said God is in this room with me right

00:25:40.660 --> 00:25:44.660
now he has never left my side he will never leave

00:25:44.660 --> 00:25:49.319
my side and he he is he is right now he's carrying

00:25:49.319 --> 00:25:54.309
me because I can't stand on my own And he introduced

00:25:54.309 --> 00:25:57.490
himself as a hospital pastor who goes from room

00:25:57.490 --> 00:26:01.069
to room. And to this day, he and I are still

00:26:01.069 --> 00:26:02.789
friends. Matter of fact, I spoke with him yesterday

00:26:02.789 --> 00:26:07.269
for half an hour just shooting the breeze. And

00:26:07.269 --> 00:26:10.130
he told me he did not expect me to say that.

00:26:11.170 --> 00:26:12.750
He actually said that to me yesterday when we

00:26:12.750 --> 00:26:15.829
were talking about it. And he said, I never expected

00:26:15.829 --> 00:26:18.569
you to answer that way because most people will

00:26:18.569 --> 00:26:21.349
feel like God has left. And I said, no, God never

00:26:21.349 --> 00:26:25.299
left me. I said to him yesterday, I said, I think,

00:26:25.299 --> 00:26:28.059
you know, Guillain -Barre has been laid upon

00:26:28.059 --> 00:26:30.220
my shoulders so that I can do something good

00:26:30.220 --> 00:26:33.680
with it. And I said, I really wish that maybe

00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:36.019
he had given me something else that wasn't so

00:26:36.019 --> 00:26:41.700
severe, but if that's my purpose, then so be

00:26:41.700 --> 00:26:45.779
it. I will manage it with God's help and I will

00:26:45.779 --> 00:26:47.700
do something, I will do God's work with it, which

00:26:47.700 --> 00:26:51.349
is what we're doing with Miles for GBS. Well,

00:26:51.349 --> 00:26:53.990
thank you for sharing that. I want to pick up

00:26:53.990 --> 00:26:56.730
on just a couple of different things that you

00:26:56.730 --> 00:26:59.289
shared. First of all, I think I want to say something

00:26:59.289 --> 00:27:03.250
about the pastor who came into your room. And

00:27:03.250 --> 00:27:06.829
I'm glad to hear that the intent in asking the

00:27:06.829 --> 00:27:09.670
question wasn't malicious. And I would think

00:27:09.670 --> 00:27:11.410
with a hospital chaplain, it wouldn't normally

00:27:11.410 --> 00:27:16.190
be. Yeah. But we have listeners who have been,

00:27:16.349 --> 00:27:18.529
that question has been asked almost in an accusing

00:27:18.529 --> 00:27:21.829
way. It sounds like he was trying to investigate

00:27:21.829 --> 00:27:24.069
where you were spiritually and how he could come

00:27:24.069 --> 00:27:27.029
alongside you. Yep. Yeah. So that's really good.

00:27:27.109 --> 00:27:29.430
And I'm really glad to hear about your continued

00:27:29.430 --> 00:27:31.990
relationship with him. And that sounds like it's

00:27:31.990 --> 00:27:34.650
really special. And thank God for empathetic

00:27:34.650 --> 00:27:37.269
other caretakers like the physical therapist

00:27:37.269 --> 00:27:40.410
that was in your life at such a critical time,

00:27:40.410 --> 00:27:43.250
you know, as well. I did want to ask, and this

00:27:43.250 --> 00:27:44.670
is kind of funny because I want to alter the

00:27:44.670 --> 00:27:47.009
question a little bit. I don't think it should

00:27:47.009 --> 00:27:49.210
be any shock to our listeners that we come up

00:27:49.210 --> 00:27:51.690
with some questions we want to use beforehand

00:27:51.690 --> 00:27:54.529
just to set kind of sign markers for our conversation.

00:27:55.410 --> 00:27:57.849
But the original question is, are there common

00:27:57.849 --> 00:27:59.789
misconceptions you've encountered that you'd

00:27:59.789 --> 00:28:02.430
like to clear up? But I realize that as you're

00:28:02.430 --> 00:28:05.250
talking about how few people even know what a

00:28:05.250 --> 00:28:08.029
herd of GBS or what it is, it might be hard to

00:28:08.029 --> 00:28:10.819
have a misconception if you don't even have any

00:28:10.819 --> 00:28:13.619
familiarity with it at all. So maybe a better

00:28:13.619 --> 00:28:15.799
way to ask that is just simply to say, as you

00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:18.299
have talked to people about it, what have people

00:28:18.299 --> 00:28:21.839
misunderstood or has been frustrating in your

00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:25.380
communication with others? That's just been difficult

00:28:25.380 --> 00:28:28.880
for people to grasp, if that makes sense. It

00:28:28.880 --> 00:28:34.700
does. And I think I will say a common misperception

00:28:34.700 --> 00:28:39.440
is that it's something else. And the people Maybe

00:28:39.440 --> 00:28:44.559
the doctors or the PAs or whomever don't realize,

00:28:44.740 --> 00:28:48.339
and the patients probably don't either, the massive

00:28:48.339 --> 00:28:52.640
muscle weakness and muscle fatigue that happens

00:28:52.640 --> 00:28:55.759
while you're losing your strength and losing

00:28:55.759 --> 00:28:59.240
the ability to move I think is often misdiagnosed.

00:28:59.940 --> 00:29:03.279
My college roommate came to find out after the

00:29:03.279 --> 00:29:09.559
fact he lost his father to GBS. he went to the

00:29:09.559 --> 00:29:13.400
hospital with the massive fatigue and the symptoms

00:29:13.400 --> 00:29:18.200
of RSV or what have you and wound up on a ventilator

00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:22.480
and passed. And I think the real thing people

00:29:22.480 --> 00:29:25.440
need to watch out for is the massive fatigue.

00:29:25.640 --> 00:29:28.039
It's a different, I remember saying to my wife,

00:29:28.519 --> 00:29:30.420
I'm in good shape. I don't understand why I'm

00:29:30.420 --> 00:29:36.900
so weak. That's the symptom that I think people

00:29:36.900 --> 00:29:39.400
and doctors miss. They think, oh, I'm just tired.

00:29:39.720 --> 00:29:43.119
I'm just tired. But it literally is a massive

00:29:43.119 --> 00:29:47.180
fatigue where simply raising your arm is exhausting.

00:29:48.140 --> 00:29:51.039
Trying to move your legs is absolutely exhausting.

00:29:51.559 --> 00:29:53.779
And that would be the symptom I would probably

00:29:53.779 --> 00:30:00.799
be telling people to be aware of. I think that

00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:02.339
might answer the first part of your question.

00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:05.690
I think the second part of your question is what

00:30:05.690 --> 00:30:09.309
are the misconceptions other people have? Is

00:30:09.309 --> 00:30:14.230
that what it was? Yeah, just in terms of misunderstandings

00:30:14.230 --> 00:30:16.869
that you've encountered when you've tried to

00:30:16.869 --> 00:30:18.650
talk and share about what you're going through,

00:30:18.670 --> 00:30:21.849
that sort of thing. I think that a lot of the

00:30:21.849 --> 00:30:24.430
times people just don't understand. They don't

00:30:24.430 --> 00:30:27.970
understand what it's like when you say, I'm just

00:30:27.970 --> 00:30:32.769
so tired. I'm exhausted. I can't do it. Because

00:30:32.769 --> 00:30:34.549
they say well, you know, did you sleep okay?

00:30:34.569 --> 00:30:36.950
Yeah, you know, I got my usual sleep. I'm just

00:30:36.950 --> 00:30:39.730
they don't sometimes they just don't understand

00:30:39.730 --> 00:30:44.029
that you just can't do it today and and You know

00:30:44.029 --> 00:30:46.970
if they give you a little I I do what my neurologist

00:30:46.970 --> 00:30:49.049
said if people don't understand I simply say

00:30:49.049 --> 00:30:50.890
look I'm not asking you to understand I'm just

00:30:50.890 --> 00:30:52.829
telling you I can't do it and I will walk away

00:30:52.829 --> 00:30:55.009
Because the neurologist said you've got to get

00:30:55.009 --> 00:30:58.650
away from people that don't understand You know,

00:30:58.650 --> 00:31:00.609
there are times when the nerve pain does get

00:31:00.609 --> 00:31:03.559
bad And I manage pain well, but there are times

00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:06.720
when it really does hurt. And I simply can't

00:31:06.720 --> 00:31:09.539
do stuff. And that's when I take a gabapentin

00:31:09.539 --> 00:31:14.539
or two. And I just, if people give me static,

00:31:14.640 --> 00:31:15.960
well, you know, where are we gonna go and do

00:31:15.960 --> 00:31:19.539
this stuff today? I can't do it. I'm blessed.

00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:21.799
I mean, I am blessed. I have surrounded myself

00:31:21.799 --> 00:31:24.619
with some really good support, people who do

00:31:24.619 --> 00:31:30.029
love me and care and understand. and get it and

00:31:30.029 --> 00:31:34.430
don't give me static. But I think that the average

00:31:34.430 --> 00:31:37.089
person, because they don't know about GBS and

00:31:37.089 --> 00:31:41.930
they don't know the long -term effects that a

00:31:41.930 --> 00:31:44.430
recovering patient can have, I can see how it

00:31:44.430 --> 00:31:47.009
would be easy to misunderstand and say, oh, he

00:31:47.009 --> 00:31:49.009
just doesn't want to do it. So he's using this

00:31:49.009 --> 00:31:54.170
as an excuse. But the recovery time for some

00:31:54.170 --> 00:31:56.859
patients can be weeks or months. It could be

00:31:56.859 --> 00:31:59.460
decades. Every patient recovers differently because

00:31:59.460 --> 00:32:03.059
everybody's body is different. And while GBS

00:32:03.059 --> 00:32:08.460
does kind of the same thing to us, it does it

00:32:08.460 --> 00:32:11.220
to various degrees. And then there's the various

00:32:11.220 --> 00:32:15.720
variants that do things. I'm blessed. I know

00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:18.420
two other GBS patients. One of them doesn't want

00:32:18.420 --> 00:32:22.880
to talk about it. And another one, I've spent

00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:25.289
a lot of time talking with her about it. but

00:32:25.289 --> 00:32:28.309
she had very different she had the same fatigue

00:32:28.309 --> 00:32:33.049
and paralysis that I have had but she had different

00:32:33.049 --> 00:32:35.950
beginning symptoms so it's kind of interesting

00:32:35.950 --> 00:32:39.369
to speak with her about it and our recovery is

00:32:39.369 --> 00:32:41.690
similar but different because everybody's different

00:32:41.690 --> 00:32:45.230
and that's what makes gbs hard I think for doctors

00:32:45.230 --> 00:32:49.369
and and and caregivers because her recovery is

00:32:49.369 --> 00:32:54.920
different from mine Yeah, I appreciate you pointing

00:32:54.920 --> 00:32:57.319
that out because even with, like you said, within

00:32:57.319 --> 00:32:59.539
the same diseases, and I've experienced that

00:32:59.539 --> 00:33:01.819
with mine as well, ankylosing spondylitis. Some

00:33:01.819 --> 00:33:05.359
people have their lives just... completely changed

00:33:05.359 --> 00:33:07.279
to the point of being disabled and having to

00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:12.839
give up careers. My situation though, it is a

00:33:12.839 --> 00:33:14.980
systemic disease and it's affected my body a

00:33:14.980 --> 00:33:16.960
lot. I've been able to continue in my career

00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:19.619
and not everyone's able to do that. But I did

00:33:19.619 --> 00:33:22.519
want to just make a remark on the chronic fatigue,

00:33:22.579 --> 00:33:26.160
like you said, that maybe people don't understand.

00:33:26.400 --> 00:33:30.299
I would say that I've I've had chronic fatigue

00:33:30.299 --> 00:33:33.420
with this disease. But what turned out for me

00:33:33.420 --> 00:33:36.420
in my case was I undiagnosed sleep apnea. So

00:33:36.420 --> 00:33:38.460
that changed my life when I finally got that

00:33:38.460 --> 00:33:41.039
diagnosed. But I would say before that, I would

00:33:41.039 --> 00:33:43.140
have told people that despite the amount of pain

00:33:43.140 --> 00:33:45.660
that I've been in, the fatigue was actually worse

00:33:45.660 --> 00:33:48.779
because the fatigue just robs you of any desire

00:33:48.779 --> 00:33:53.039
to be able to do anything. The level of fatigue

00:33:53.039 --> 00:33:55.440
you're talking about, the only time I've experienced

00:33:55.440 --> 00:33:59.380
that was the first time I got COVID. I remember

00:33:59.380 --> 00:34:04.319
my arms being tired, washing my hair and walking

00:34:04.319 --> 00:34:07.759
across my kitchen floor and being almost out

00:34:07.759 --> 00:34:10.159
of breath and just. you know, needing to collapse.

00:34:10.219 --> 00:34:12.199
And of course, that was a little scary for me

00:34:12.199 --> 00:34:14.539
since I was also immunocompromised and I did

00:34:14.539 --> 00:34:16.659
get special treatment at the hospital because

00:34:16.659 --> 00:34:19.099
of that. But not to dive into that. I'm just

00:34:19.099 --> 00:34:21.719
saying I can I think that those who've gone through

00:34:21.719 --> 00:34:24.599
something similar at any point in their journey

00:34:24.599 --> 00:34:26.500
understand what you're saying, that that can

00:34:26.500 --> 00:34:28.960
be the most debilitating part, you know, of it

00:34:28.960 --> 00:34:31.960
all. And so I thank you for sharing about that.

00:34:32.260 --> 00:34:34.579
You've mentioned, you know, purpose. You've mentioned

00:34:34.579 --> 00:34:37.739
that God has a purpose for you in this. And so

00:34:37.739 --> 00:34:40.039
I want to move on to that and this part of our

00:34:40.039 --> 00:34:44.059
conversation at this point and talk about how

00:34:44.059 --> 00:34:47.500
that purpose developed for you and how it really

00:34:47.500 --> 00:34:53.039
came into focus. Absolutely. Thank you. Well,

00:34:53.099 --> 00:34:55.639
I'm going to go back to my previous life as a

00:34:55.639 --> 00:35:00.920
bike rider, bicycle rider. I was very successful

00:35:00.920 --> 00:35:03.840
as a younger man and was fortunate enough to

00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:07.980
make a couple of US regional teams. and raced

00:35:07.980 --> 00:35:10.039
for a major, one of the top sponsors in the country.

00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:12.059
And I was very, very blessed, a lot of success.

00:35:13.420 --> 00:35:17.059
And my wife and I went to France over the summer.

00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:21.280
I took her there to, you know, she was so good

00:35:21.280 --> 00:35:22.880
to me when I was in the hospital. I told her,

00:35:22.920 --> 00:35:25.139
I said, let's go on a vacation. I got cleared

00:35:25.139 --> 00:35:28.300
by my doctor to travel. And so I took her to

00:35:28.300 --> 00:35:31.480
France and my brother was out there with his

00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:34.179
wife. So we met up with them and. both my wife

00:35:34.179 --> 00:35:35.780
and my brother said, well, you should ride up

00:35:35.780 --> 00:35:38.659
Mount Ventoux. You're a past Bicel racer. It's

00:35:38.659 --> 00:35:40.699
been made famous by the Tour de France. You should

00:35:40.699 --> 00:35:43.480
do this. And I looked at them and I said, do

00:35:43.480 --> 00:35:46.860
you guys have any idea how hard that's going

00:35:46.860 --> 00:35:50.699
to be? And the training just to do it, the training

00:35:50.699 --> 00:35:53.480
involved, you know, it's the third hardest climb

00:35:53.480 --> 00:35:56.900
in the world. It's been made famous by the Tour.

00:35:57.420 --> 00:36:00.460
It's, you know, made some of the best bike racers

00:36:00.460 --> 00:36:04.300
in the world just Collapse. I mean, you know,

00:36:04.420 --> 00:36:09.159
no, I'm not doing that. You're nuts And so, uh,

00:36:09.260 --> 00:36:11.300
of course I stick that idea in the back of my

00:36:11.300 --> 00:36:13.500
head and I like I used to do this because you're

00:36:13.500 --> 00:36:15.500
a bike rider This would be fun. And I'm like,

00:36:15.599 --> 00:36:20.260
that's not And so we come back from France and

00:36:20.260 --> 00:36:22.940
I'm going back and forth between the mountains

00:36:22.940 --> 00:36:26.179
and doing some things and I was driving back

00:36:26.179 --> 00:36:28.179
from the mountains. I was by myself was me and

00:36:28.179 --> 00:36:31.320
the in the dog in the truck And I'm driving back

00:36:31.320 --> 00:36:33.650
from the mountains I'm thinking boy that would

00:36:33.650 --> 00:36:35.750
that would be kind of a neat experience, but

00:36:35.750 --> 00:36:38.190
I'm not gonna do it I just I really don't want

00:36:38.190 --> 00:36:39.849
to you know, I don't even own a bike right now.

00:36:39.849 --> 00:36:42.550
I got rid of my bike a while ago You know, I

00:36:42.550 --> 00:36:45.570
just don't want to do this. It's too much and

00:36:45.570 --> 00:36:47.590
that little voice was sitting on my shoulder

00:36:47.590 --> 00:36:53.530
again a little voice of God and I'm driving home

00:36:53.530 --> 00:36:56.789
in the truck So I you know, I guess you could

00:36:56.789 --> 00:36:58.590
say I was praying about it because I was talking

00:36:58.590 --> 00:37:03.619
to God and he said Well, you should write up

00:37:03.619 --> 00:37:06.039
want to be good. And I'm like, I'm not going

00:37:06.039 --> 00:37:08.039
to want to. And here I am. I'm arguing with God

00:37:08.039 --> 00:37:09.780
again. And every time I argue with God, I lose.

00:37:09.900 --> 00:37:13.559
I mean, you know, I don't know why I try. And

00:37:13.559 --> 00:37:17.760
he he said he goes, you should do this as a fundraiser

00:37:17.760 --> 00:37:22.119
for the GBS Foundation. And the next song that

00:37:22.119 --> 00:37:26.059
came on the radio was a song with the title Don't

00:37:26.059 --> 00:37:30.000
Give Up. And I almost drove the truck off the

00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:35.340
road. I really It blew me away. I was about 15

00:37:35.340 --> 00:37:39.039
minutes from the house, walked in the house,

00:37:39.119 --> 00:37:40.599
told my wife the story, and she goes, well, that's

00:37:40.599 --> 00:37:43.159
it. I said, what do you mean that's it? She goes,

00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:45.480
well, that's what we're doing. God has told us

00:37:45.480 --> 00:37:47.739
to do that. This is what we're going to do. We've

00:37:47.739 --> 00:37:50.880
been going 110 miles an hour forward with this

00:37:50.880 --> 00:37:55.119
since. Contacted the GBS CIDP Foundation, spoke

00:37:55.119 --> 00:37:58.760
with them multiple times at great length, and

00:37:58.760 --> 00:38:03.119
discovered that they actually have a fund in

00:38:03.119 --> 00:38:06.360
the foundation that goes strictly to patients

00:38:06.360 --> 00:38:10.539
in need. And it doesn't go to research. It doesn't

00:38:10.539 --> 00:38:13.679
go to buy copy machines and pencils and paper.

00:38:14.300 --> 00:38:16.659
It doesn't go for scholarships. It doesn't go

00:38:16.659 --> 00:38:21.039
for salaries. 100 % of the money goes to patients

00:38:21.039 --> 00:38:23.420
in need. For example, if there's a patient out

00:38:23.420 --> 00:38:26.159
there who's getting out of the hospital and needs

00:38:26.159 --> 00:38:28.260
a wheelchair and doesn't have the wheelchair.

00:38:28.820 --> 00:38:31.460
If they contact the GBS foundation, I'm sure

00:38:31.460 --> 00:38:33.780
they have to jump through some hoops to prove

00:38:33.780 --> 00:38:36.119
they have GBS and all that fun stuff. But once

00:38:36.119 --> 00:38:39.460
all that's done, there's money there to help

00:38:39.460 --> 00:38:42.460
them. That had a lot of appeal to me because

00:38:42.460 --> 00:38:44.840
I'm very blessed. I keep saying it, but it's

00:38:44.840 --> 00:38:47.380
true. I've been very blessed throughout my entire

00:38:47.380 --> 00:38:49.880
working career as well. I've made some good choices

00:38:49.880 --> 00:38:52.380
and God has pointed me in the right direction

00:38:52.380 --> 00:38:55.059
and I've been very successful. And when the neurologist

00:38:55.059 --> 00:38:56.980
said, Miles, you're going to need this, this,

00:38:57.059 --> 00:38:58.900
this, and this during your recovery, I looked

00:38:58.900 --> 00:39:02.320
at my wife and I said, go buy it. And it occurred

00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:05.280
to me during this drive home with my conversation

00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:06.960
with God, that there's an awful lot of people

00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:09.400
out there who can't say to their wives or their

00:39:09.400 --> 00:39:14.059
husbands, go buy it. So I spoke with the foundation

00:39:14.059 --> 00:39:17.119
at great length and I said, I'm willing to do

00:39:17.119 --> 00:39:20.360
this fundraiser, but all the money has to go

00:39:20.360 --> 00:39:24.900
to recovering patients, every dollar, 100%. And

00:39:24.900 --> 00:39:29.440
they said, okay. And I answered the question

00:39:29.440 --> 00:39:32.559
before they asked it. And the question I'm sure

00:39:32.559 --> 00:39:34.559
was, well, how are we going to fund the fundraiser?

00:39:34.579 --> 00:39:36.539
And I told them I would eat all the expenses

00:39:36.539 --> 00:39:40.460
myself. And I have eaten every expense there

00:39:40.460 --> 00:39:45.260
is for this fundraiser. And I'm very deep, needless

00:39:45.260 --> 00:39:48.940
to say, between equipment and airfare and a house

00:39:48.940 --> 00:39:52.239
and my support team and all the stuff that goes

00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:54.969
with it. but I do believe God has put this on

00:39:54.969 --> 00:40:00.909
my shoulders to help recovering patients in need

00:40:00.909 --> 00:40:04.690
because our job as Christians are to give back.

00:40:05.230 --> 00:40:08.829
You know, and one of the things, you know, of

00:40:08.829 --> 00:40:10.769
course I've been selling sponsorships, you know,

00:40:10.769 --> 00:40:13.030
if you want to have your name on my jersey, it

00:40:13.030 --> 00:40:16.489
costs X dollars. But one of the things I'm putting

00:40:16.489 --> 00:40:18.489
on my jersey and I'm putting on my shoulders

00:40:18.489 --> 00:40:22.760
is 1 Peter 4 10. And I would encourage you, and

00:40:22.760 --> 00:40:24.340
you might already know what it is, David, but

00:40:24.340 --> 00:40:27.519
I would encourage you or your Andreas or your

00:40:27.519 --> 00:40:31.380
listeners to look up 1 Peter 4 .10. And I am

00:40:31.380 --> 00:40:35.579
using my gift from God, which is athletics, to

00:40:35.579 --> 00:40:40.920
help people in God's name. That's a very inspiring

00:40:40.920 --> 00:40:44.159
story and, you know, one in which I know you're

00:40:44.159 --> 00:40:46.159
giving God the glory because of the way, first

00:40:46.159 --> 00:40:48.380
of all, you've acknowledged He gave you the abilities,

00:40:48.460 --> 00:40:51.699
the gifts, as well as, in this case, the calling

00:40:51.699 --> 00:40:55.440
to go in and to do this. And I want to say something,

00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:58.880
too, just about your heart because where the

00:40:58.880 --> 00:41:01.380
financial part wasn't... the big struggle for

00:41:01.380 --> 00:41:04.139
you, but yet you're able to recognize what a

00:41:04.139 --> 00:41:06.679
privilege or a blessing that was and recognize

00:41:06.679 --> 00:41:08.860
that there are a lot of people out there that

00:41:08.860 --> 00:41:11.260
this could be financially devastating for and

00:41:11.260 --> 00:41:14.139
or just keep them from getting what they need,

00:41:14.139 --> 00:41:17.179
like a wheelchair or something like that. And

00:41:17.179 --> 00:41:20.579
so that that that's very moving to me, you know,

00:41:20.579 --> 00:41:24.820
as well. And then what you're taking on Mount

00:41:24.820 --> 00:41:27.679
Von Two, is that how you said it? Yes, Mount

00:41:27.679 --> 00:41:32.880
Von Two. Okay, Mount Von Two, and what an exciting

00:41:32.880 --> 00:41:36.699
challenge and something that we're going to be

00:41:36.699 --> 00:41:39.900
praying for you about and your success in that.

00:41:40.260 --> 00:41:42.139
And my understanding is you're not riding alone.

00:41:42.300 --> 00:41:49.519
Is that correct? It is correct. When I decided

00:41:49.519 --> 00:41:51.579
to do what God is telling me to do and stopped

00:41:51.579 --> 00:41:55.440
arguing with him, I reached out to my cycling

00:41:55.440 --> 00:41:57.760
coach from back in the day. His name is Bill

00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:00.579
Humphreys. He's known as the bike guy worldwide.

00:42:03.460 --> 00:42:06.480
He's been in cycling, you name it, he's done

00:42:06.480 --> 00:42:09.820
it. He's written some books. His books are available

00:42:09.820 --> 00:42:14.340
on Amazon, The Jersey Project and What If, and

00:42:14.340 --> 00:42:18.119
it's about his life and how he went from using

00:42:18.119 --> 00:42:20.400
his words being a hippie to being a world -class

00:42:20.400 --> 00:42:24.530
athlete inside of one, two years. And so I called

00:42:24.530 --> 00:42:26.809
him, and he and I have remained friends and in

00:42:26.809 --> 00:42:31.110
touch since I was in my 20s. And I said, Bill,

00:42:31.929 --> 00:42:35.690
I said, basically Reader's Digest condensed story.

00:42:35.730 --> 00:42:38.489
And I said, I want to write up Mount Vonto as

00:42:38.489 --> 00:42:41.869
this fundraiser, and I want you to coach me.

00:42:42.510 --> 00:42:47.369
And he said, Miles, I'm 82 years old. You know

00:42:47.369 --> 00:42:49.449
how to do this. And I said, yeah, I do. I know

00:42:49.449 --> 00:42:52.329
how to train, but I was a sprinter, not a mountain

00:42:52.329 --> 00:42:54.750
climber. And now I'm going to go from being,

00:42:54.750 --> 00:42:58.329
you know, a very high level sprinter to a mountain

00:42:58.329 --> 00:43:00.469
goat. You know, I, I know how to do this, but

00:43:00.469 --> 00:43:02.710
I could, you know, use pointing in the right

00:43:02.710 --> 00:43:05.630
direction. And he said, absolutely, I will absolutely

00:43:05.630 --> 00:43:09.610
do this. And so we, you know, we meet on a regular

00:43:09.610 --> 00:43:12.650
basis on the phone and talk as he's up in, he's

00:43:12.650 --> 00:43:14.670
up in, he's in Connecticut, actually. I'm in

00:43:14.670 --> 00:43:19.050
North Carolina and. About a month later, he and

00:43:19.050 --> 00:43:21.010
I were on the phone. He said, I got to tell you

00:43:21.010 --> 00:43:23.210
something. And I thought, uh -oh, you know, I'm

00:43:23.210 --> 00:43:26.469
doing something wrong. And he said, I'm not going

00:43:26.469 --> 00:43:29.030
to train you to go up this incredible mountain

00:43:29.030 --> 00:43:33.369
for this journey of yours without going myself.

00:43:35.170 --> 00:43:40.570
And I brought a tear to my eye. I mean, he's

00:43:40.570 --> 00:43:43.769
82 years old. He's done everything there is to

00:43:43.769 --> 00:43:46.110
do in cycling. he's going to ride up the mountain

00:43:46.110 --> 00:43:48.909
with me. And he said, using his words, you're

00:43:48.909 --> 00:43:50.849
going to ride away from me, but I'm still going

00:43:50.849 --> 00:43:52.510
to do it. And I'm going to wear your jersey while

00:43:52.510 --> 00:43:57.090
I'm doing it. Another one of my teammates, I

00:43:57.090 --> 00:43:59.170
mentioned I was a sprinter. Well, every good

00:43:59.170 --> 00:44:02.530
sprinter has got a great lead out man to help

00:44:02.530 --> 00:44:05.030
you in the races, to get you across the finish

00:44:05.030 --> 00:44:10.269
line first. And my great lead out man, Tom Reilly,

00:44:10.909 --> 00:44:13.409
has told me he's going to ride the mountain with

00:44:13.409 --> 00:44:19.289
me now. He's 60 years old and he has MS. So he

00:44:19.289 --> 00:44:22.949
is going to overcome his MS. And so the three

00:44:22.949 --> 00:44:25.070
of us are all training in three different states.

00:44:26.230 --> 00:44:27.670
And, you know, he also says he's going to wear

00:44:27.670 --> 00:44:30.530
the jersey. And again, I might ride away from

00:44:30.530 --> 00:44:33.329
him, but he's still going to do it. There's been

00:44:33.329 --> 00:44:35.369
a lot of support there. I've got a support team,

00:44:35.449 --> 00:44:37.989
my brother, my nephew, my wife, they're all going

00:44:37.989 --> 00:44:40.289
to be out there to make sure we're all getting

00:44:40.289 --> 00:44:42.690
our nutrition and our water, you know, in August

00:44:42.690 --> 00:44:48.550
it could be hot, to help do it. My doctor, I

00:44:48.550 --> 00:44:50.469
joke with my doctor saying she's on the support

00:44:50.469 --> 00:44:52.929
team, but you know, she's obviously not going,

00:44:53.250 --> 00:44:57.630
but she's been great. I mean, she made sure I

00:44:57.630 --> 00:45:01.250
was, I had a lot of tests, medical tests before

00:45:01.250 --> 00:45:03.610
she cleared me to be able to do this. She's watching

00:45:03.610 --> 00:45:07.340
me closely, you know. My wife is amazing. She's

00:45:07.340 --> 00:45:11.739
my nutritionist. She's my, you know, an inspiration,

00:45:12.440 --> 00:45:15.920
motivator, full of faith, you know, keeping me

00:45:15.920 --> 00:45:19.739
doing it. So, and my sponsors. I mean, I'd be

00:45:19.739 --> 00:45:22.000
remiss if I didn't thank my sponsors. And, you

00:45:22.000 --> 00:45:24.579
know, give a little commercial for the Sita Foundation,

00:45:24.860 --> 00:45:28.019
for Callahan and Rice Insurance, for Heart Pine

00:45:28.019 --> 00:45:32.820
Builders, Camino Development, Telemore Golf Resorts.

00:45:33.320 --> 00:45:36.679
Delta Leathercraft, Infinite Space Quilting,

00:45:37.079 --> 00:45:39.900
these are all people who have given all kinds

00:45:39.900 --> 00:45:45.320
of money to the GBSCIDP Foundation for patients

00:45:45.320 --> 00:45:49.079
to recover, patients in need. They have the faith

00:45:49.079 --> 00:45:54.159
that I can do this and the faith and the foundation

00:45:54.159 --> 00:45:58.420
to continue helping recovering patients. And

00:45:58.420 --> 00:46:01.960
David, to me, I've had a lot of people say oh

00:46:01.960 --> 00:46:03.500
you've got a big heart and you've got this and

00:46:03.500 --> 00:46:05.480
you've got that you know David I don't want any

00:46:05.480 --> 00:46:08.360
of that it's it's not about me it's not about

00:46:08.360 --> 00:46:11.500
miles washman it's about God and it's about the

00:46:11.500 --> 00:46:14.840
patient to me it is every day I think what more

00:46:14.840 --> 00:46:18.679
can I do to try to help patients in need and

00:46:18.679 --> 00:46:21.000
to me that's what it's about it's about helping

00:46:21.000 --> 00:46:27.570
the patients in need yeah I mean Well, I've just

00:46:27.570 --> 00:46:30.909
inspired to hear about your team. I mean, what

00:46:30.909 --> 00:46:35.909
a great story. I mean, and you can make a movie

00:46:35.909 --> 00:46:37.949
about the three of you riding up that mountain,

00:46:38.070 --> 00:46:39.769
you know, but like I said, I know it's not about

00:46:39.769 --> 00:46:42.789
you, but go ahead. I want to add one more thing,

00:46:42.789 --> 00:46:45.190
if I could. Yeah. You know, there's a lot of

00:46:45.190 --> 00:46:47.289
patients out there and some people at GBS who

00:46:47.289 --> 00:46:48.710
are going to listen to this and going, well,

00:46:48.730 --> 00:46:51.449
you know, this guy is the exception. You know,

00:46:51.449 --> 00:46:54.610
he's riding up this big mountain. He's the exception.

00:46:55.079 --> 00:46:58.059
And I would come back and I would say, I'm not.

00:46:58.400 --> 00:47:02.980
I'm not an exception. I'm blessed. But what I

00:47:02.980 --> 00:47:06.579
want to do is I want to inspire that person that

00:47:06.579 --> 00:47:13.380
look at this mountain as a symbol of faith, you

00:47:13.380 --> 00:47:17.300
know, resilience and the ability to climb towards

00:47:17.300 --> 00:47:20.900
recovery for everybody affected by GBS or any

00:47:20.900 --> 00:47:25.699
other chronic debilitating syndrome. I would

00:47:25.699 --> 00:47:28.320
say to the person, I want you to think about

00:47:28.320 --> 00:47:32.179
me riding up that mountain for you, that today,

00:47:33.579 --> 00:47:38.260
reach deep. Take the extra 10 steps. I know it

00:47:38.260 --> 00:47:40.739
hurts. I know it's hard. I know you're tired.

00:47:41.940 --> 00:47:44.940
Tomorrow, try to walk to the end of your driveway

00:47:44.940 --> 00:47:48.940
and walk back. The next day, try to walk to your

00:47:48.940 --> 00:47:51.360
mailbox. Then maybe you need to take a rest.

00:47:51.460 --> 00:47:53.320
The next day, try to walk to your neighbor's

00:47:53.320 --> 00:47:59.949
house. It simply is really a symbol of recovery.

00:48:01.030 --> 00:48:06.230
And the mountain, this huge mountain of recovery

00:48:06.230 --> 00:48:09.690
that we all have to try to overcome. And that's

00:48:09.690 --> 00:48:13.519
really what it stands for. Well, thank you for

00:48:13.519 --> 00:48:15.860
that. Yeah, that helps. And I think it'll mean

00:48:15.860 --> 00:48:18.639
a lot to people, whatever perspective they're

00:48:18.639 --> 00:48:22.239
listening from with their chronic health issues,

00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:25.900
they can be encouraged to do the next thing that's

00:48:25.900 --> 00:48:28.139
before them to do and not to give up, like you

00:48:28.139 --> 00:48:31.400
said about the song earlier. Now, we don't want

00:48:31.400 --> 00:48:33.659
people trying to look up a Bible verse if they're

00:48:33.659 --> 00:48:37.280
listening to this while they're driving. So I

00:48:37.280 --> 00:48:40.719
do want to... to read that 1 Peter 4 10 passage

00:48:40.719 --> 00:48:43.820
here. As each has received a gift, use it to

00:48:43.820 --> 00:48:46.880
serve one another as good stewards of God's varied

00:48:46.880 --> 00:48:51.599
grace. And so thank you to our producer, Andreessen,

00:48:51.719 --> 00:48:54.039
sharing that so I could read it to you at this

00:48:54.039 --> 00:48:56.880
point. One last thing for us to do, Miles, very

00:48:56.880 --> 00:49:00.820
important, is tell us, give us where you are

00:49:00.820 --> 00:49:03.489
in your fundraiser. What the deadline is in other

00:49:03.489 --> 00:49:05.769
words when the race is and how people can get

00:49:05.769 --> 00:49:09.730
involved in sharing Donating or any of those

00:49:09.730 --> 00:49:12.070
things sure David. That's that's that's very

00:49:12.070 --> 00:49:13.829
important. I appreciate you putting that out

00:49:13.829 --> 00:49:16.449
there So it's not a race. It's simply an event.

00:49:16.769 --> 00:49:20.829
It's three old guys Going up this big mountain

00:49:20.829 --> 00:49:23.929
For the recovering patients of GBS and it's gonna

00:49:23.929 --> 00:49:27.409
be on August 24th of 2026 that gives all three

00:49:27.409 --> 00:49:31.579
of us plenty of time To train to for me to make

00:49:31.579 --> 00:49:35.739
all the available arrangements You know house

00:49:35.739 --> 00:49:40.880
photographer vehicles all that fun stuff It's

00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:45.480
a to get involved if you will my Facebook page

00:49:45.480 --> 00:49:51.179
is miles for GBS On that Facebook page, there's

00:49:51.179 --> 00:49:56.219
a link you can go to my website It's long, it's

00:49:56.219 --> 00:50:03.679
go .gbs -cidp .org slash gbs26. That takes you

00:50:03.679 --> 00:50:05.739
right to my webpage, but it's easier just to

00:50:05.739 --> 00:50:09.019
go to Facebook if you will. You can donate from

00:50:09.019 --> 00:50:12.039
there. And I would tell everybody that, you know,

00:50:12.119 --> 00:50:16.199
sure, I've had some donors give thousands of

00:50:16.199 --> 00:50:18.780
dollars, which has been wonderful and a blessing.

00:50:19.480 --> 00:50:21.260
But there's also donors that have given $10.

00:50:21.820 --> 00:50:25.949
And I will say that Every single dollar that

00:50:25.949 --> 00:50:30.429
you donate makes a difference. It makes a difference.

00:50:31.670 --> 00:50:36.889
Know that if somebody donates $10 or $5 or $5

00:50:36.889 --> 00:50:40.690
,000, whatever, they're changing somebody's life

00:50:40.690 --> 00:50:43.570
that can't afford the wheelchair. Maybe they

00:50:43.570 --> 00:50:46.050
can't afford the physical therapy. Maybe they

00:50:46.050 --> 00:50:48.840
lost their job and lost their insurance. and

00:50:48.840 --> 00:50:50.860
they can't afford the speech therapy. One of

00:50:50.860 --> 00:50:53.219
the things that got badly affected by GBS is

00:50:53.219 --> 00:50:57.679
my tongue. And it's behaved during this podcast

00:50:57.679 --> 00:50:59.380
for the most part, which is pretty good, but

00:50:59.380 --> 00:51:02.139
very often I have a hard time trying to get a

00:51:02.139 --> 00:51:05.960
word out or trying to make a word. Because the

00:51:05.960 --> 00:51:07.760
tongue was the first thing that went for me when

00:51:07.760 --> 00:51:10.360
I, you know, that speech impediment. And so I

00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:14.920
get what I call GBS mouth. And sometimes I struggle

00:51:14.920 --> 00:51:17.780
with that a little bit. So. You know that every

00:51:17.780 --> 00:51:20.719
every donation that we raise where are we our

00:51:20.719 --> 00:51:23.820
goal is 60 ,000 I'd like to do more than that

00:51:23.820 --> 00:51:26.719
right now or our little thermometer is saying

00:51:26.719 --> 00:51:31.900
39 ,000 65 right now awesome although I will

00:51:31.900 --> 00:51:36.320
say that I have secured a major company recently

00:51:36.320 --> 00:51:39.380
we just haven't announced it yet for all the

00:51:39.380 --> 00:51:41.159
legalities we have to jump through the hoops

00:51:41.159 --> 00:51:44.340
for and Sure, but there are there are $10 ,000

00:51:44.340 --> 00:51:47.760
donation I just can't say who they are yet. So

00:51:47.760 --> 00:51:50.559
while my thermometer says 39, we're actually

00:51:50.559 --> 00:51:55.719
at 49. But I still like to pretend that we're

00:51:55.719 --> 00:51:58.219
way behind where we need to be and ask everybody

00:51:58.219 --> 00:52:01.199
to please go to Miles for GBS and donate what

00:52:01.199 --> 00:52:03.260
they can. I'm not asking people to give up their

00:52:03.260 --> 00:52:07.199
life fortune or mortgage their house, but every

00:52:07.199 --> 00:52:11.840
little bit helps, David. If everybody gave $2,

00:52:12.300 --> 00:52:14.519
think how much money we'd raise and how much

00:52:14.519 --> 00:52:17.880
good it can do for the people who need it. That's

00:52:17.880 --> 00:52:20.260
right. And I appreciate that for a couple of

00:52:20.260 --> 00:52:23.840
reasons. One is because First of all, everyone

00:52:23.840 --> 00:52:26.460
can participate, whatever, they have a lot of

00:52:26.460 --> 00:52:28.440
money or a little money. And that means a lot

00:52:28.440 --> 00:52:30.900
for people with, you know, chronic illness and

00:52:30.900 --> 00:52:32.880
maybe their budgets are strained because of their

00:52:32.880 --> 00:52:36.059
own medical, you know, situation. And we never

00:52:36.059 --> 00:52:38.840
want to burden someone to make them go into debt

00:52:38.840 --> 00:52:40.579
more. But the fact that you could be encouraged

00:52:40.579 --> 00:52:43.320
to give 10 bucks, most of us can do that, right?

00:52:44.079 --> 00:52:45.880
And maybe you can give more. And if you're able

00:52:45.880 --> 00:52:48.599
to give more, we encourage you to do so. Broken

00:52:48.599 --> 00:52:52.480
and Mended and In the Seams are certainly supportive

00:52:52.480 --> 00:52:55.460
and behind you in this effort. We will put all

00:52:55.460 --> 00:52:57.960
the links that you've been talking about in our

00:52:57.960 --> 00:53:01.440
show notes. And again, for people driving, you

00:53:01.440 --> 00:53:03.139
can wait till you get home and then click on

00:53:03.139 --> 00:53:06.579
it. But anyway, Miles, want to just thank you

00:53:06.579 --> 00:53:10.159
so much for being with us today and sharing about

00:53:10.159 --> 00:53:13.699
your story, your journey, and your cause. thank

00:53:13.699 --> 00:53:15.880
you and you know one of the last things people

00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:18.900
can do to also help is maybe somebody can't afford

00:53:18.900 --> 00:53:22.019
to give and I understand that I really do but

00:53:22.019 --> 00:53:25.099
what they can do is they can forward this my

00:53:25.099 --> 00:53:28.239
page my Facebook page miles for GBS they can

00:53:28.239 --> 00:53:31.380
put it on their Facebook page they can forward

00:53:31.380 --> 00:53:34.139
it to their friends and say hey look you know

00:53:34.139 --> 00:53:36.699
this is a great cause if you can't give forward

00:53:36.699 --> 00:53:39.280
and the more people we reach out to the more

00:53:39.280 --> 00:53:41.820
people we touch You know, the interesting thing

00:53:41.820 --> 00:53:44.119
is, is we're going to eventually touch some people

00:53:44.119 --> 00:53:47.820
who have GBS or other chronic diseases and they

00:53:47.820 --> 00:53:50.579
they're going to see your podcast and they're

00:53:50.579 --> 00:53:51.900
going to listen to it and they're going to reach

00:53:51.900 --> 00:53:55.219
out. And, you know, the more awareness we can

00:53:55.219 --> 00:53:58.320
give, it's just as good as raising the money.

00:53:59.599 --> 00:54:02.380
Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much, Miles. It's

00:54:02.380 --> 00:54:04.400
been great to have you. It's been a great conversation.

00:54:04.619 --> 00:54:07.760
It encourages and edifies me, and I know it will

00:54:07.760 --> 00:54:10.960
our listeners as well. Certainly a reminder to

00:54:10.960 --> 00:54:13.739
our listeners, you know, you can go to brokenandmended

00:54:13.739 --> 00:54:16.940
.org to see what resources. We have available

00:54:16.940 --> 00:54:18.780
for you there to support you on your chronic

00:54:18.780 --> 00:54:21.760
illness or chronic pain journey, including our

00:54:21.760 --> 00:54:24.079
support groups. We don't have support groups

00:54:24.079 --> 00:54:26.840
everywhere in the US yet, but we do have virtual

00:54:26.840 --> 00:54:29.059
options for people that need to join from a place

00:54:29.059 --> 00:54:32.320
where we don't have a group. But there's also

00:54:32.320 --> 00:54:34.519
our Facebook group there. You can find our podcast

00:54:34.519 --> 00:54:36.320
there, which you already know where the podcast

00:54:36.320 --> 00:54:39.000
is if you're listening to this. But anyway, there

00:54:39.000 --> 00:54:40.699
are a lot of different resources people can tap

00:54:40.699 --> 00:54:43.199
in there as well. Check out the links we're going

00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:47.219
to leave in regards to GBS, the foundation that

00:54:47.219 --> 00:54:49.800
we've been talking about, and also Miles' story

00:54:49.800 --> 00:54:52.280
and his Facebook page. We'll put all that in

00:54:52.280 --> 00:54:54.760
here as well. So thank you to our listeners again

00:54:54.760 --> 00:54:57.480
for being with us, and we will see you next time

00:54:57.480 --> 00:54:58.199
on In the Scenes.